Trojan Loader Repower with Cummins 4BT

[chansey]

This thread will document what needed to be accomplished to repower a 1989 Trojan 1500Z with a rebuilt Cummins 4BT with 130 HP. The engine repower will net a additional 37 HP over the Deutz F5L912.

The original Deutz is a rebuilt engine (2006) that had a rod knock when I purchased the loader. Took the engine out and the crank was ground for -.20 rods and -.10 mains, new rings, bearings and new rod/piston.

Had a Cummins Reviva 4BT and a rotary pumped 6BT sitting in the garage. The 4BT was scheduled for installation in my 1942 G506 (1.5 ton Chevy) however I will be using the loader extensively and decided to install the 4BT in the Trojan 1500Z.

As with any repower, it’s never a straight drop in and bolt up situation. New metal fab and parts are always part of the process. To start with, need to see what is at hand and where we need to go.

The 4BT is equipped with a SAE #2 flywheel and flywheel housing and a 10 spline 14” clutch. The Deutz F5L912 has an SAE #3 flywheel housing. The transmission is an Allison TT222-1 transmission with an SAE #3 bolt pattern. The Allison flexplate consists of 3 separate plates that are center mounted to the transmission torque converter and the 8 outer bolts mount to the flywheel. The 4BT starter is retained.

The first task is to mate an SAE #2 4BT housing to an SAE #3 transmission. C and C Truck Parts offers an SAE #2 to SAE #3 adapter ring for $75.00. Others want as much as $550. The Deutz flywheel is flat and the SAE #2 Cummins flywheel has a recess for the 14” clutch. Sent the flywheel to the machine shop to mill off the ridges for the clutch and provide an index for the flexplates.

With the mating and coupling issue solved, here are some of the known items that need to be addressed as the project moves along.

Fab new motor mounts for the front and rear of the 4BT
Fab mounting bracket for the transmission oil cooler
Add Cummins gear driven air compressor for brakes
Fab, find install radiator and coolant lines to engine and air compressor.
Fab brackets/mounting for radiator
Add air to air cooler
Deal with other details for electrical, throttle, engine shutoff, etc







Paul

 

[d9gdon]

Very interesting thread, I'll be tuned in. These kinds of swaps always throw some curves that'll test your patience. It should make a nice loader in the end. No air conditioning?

 

[Tdam]

If there is any thing I can look at on mine and let you know let me know I would be more than happy to help. I don't know if mine was a repower or if it came with it but if I can help let me know

 

[chansey]

d9gdon,

What is air conditioning ??? Where is it located on a Trojan loader? Since winter is on the way, I'll be looking for heat. Don't seem to have that either.

Got the flywheel back today. Going to replace the rear bearing seal just because it is open and good insurance.

Wife was going into town so I asked her to stop by Napa and pick up some 10 X 150 X 30mm studs. Counter man calls me to make sure I want studs. Wife gets home and hands me 8 hex head bolts. They need to hire a few more 18-19 year olds with 20 years experience. Now I'll loose an hour plus to make the trip in to town, use 3 gallons of gas and just to buy less than $8.00 worth of hardware.

I want to get the flywheel together and install the engine for a test fit. Instead of starting in the morning, it looks like now I'll start late pm.

Ordered a Bendix Tu Flo 550 air compressor for the 4BT. It is a direct mount engine driven unit. The 4BT, 6BT and the 6C all have the same gear drive. Don't need the power steering pump. Loader has all of the other required parts for the air system.

Paul

 

[chansey]

Tdam,

Can you take a pic of the motor mount setup on your Trojan loader? Would save me a lot of time to get an idea of what works. If all goes well tomorrow, I want to set the engine in the hole, couple the tranny and block the engine in the position it will be at when finished. Need to find the rubber mount portion for the engine and transmission as well. They are completely worn out. The difficult part of the fix is that the OEM mount is moulded into the bracket and attached to the transmission. May have to fab these as well.

Also a pic of the set up for your radiator and air to air if it has it.

If your engine has the Cummings label on the L/H side on the timing cover you can find your HP rating. The original F5L912 Deutz had 93 HP on a good day. Your Cummings s/b at least that much or more.

Your tranny is most likely an Allison TT222-1.

Paul

 

[Tdam]

 

[Tdam]

 

[Tdam]

Here are some of the pics I have cant seem to get all of them from my phone to my computer. Mine had AC and a heater that came in to a unit that sat next to the right side of the seat when you are in the cab but the compressor has been removed it must have been on the top of the right hand side of the motor. You can see the black mounting bracket in the one picture. The last picture shows the engine mounting bracket that goes from one side to the other at the bottom of the engine to the 2 rubber mounts that bolt to the frame. I know these are not the best pics if they don't help at all let me know and I will try to do better

 

[chansey]

Thanks for the pics, they do help.

The motor mounts look like OEM Trojan that are currently not available.

I need to get the loader up and running--have a ton of work for it.

Paul

 

[kshansen]

Thanks for the pics, they do help.

The motor mounts look like OEM Trojan that are currently not available.

I need to get the loader up and running--have a ton of work for it.

Paul

Paul,

Take a look at this link:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-vibration-damping-mounts/=u1xzw8

Might be something there that would work.

 

[d9gdon]

You may find some parts you need without reinventing the wheel off of these machines that have been dismantled:

http://www.machinerytrader.com/list/dismantledsearch.aspx?ETID=3&Manu=TROJAN

 

[Labparamour]

d9gdon,

They need to hire a few more 18-19 year olds with 20 years experience.

Paul

As I get older (and because I own mostly old, outdated stuff) I'm finally appreciative of the older counter-man... Someone who actually knows what I need or can open an actual parts book to find stuff, not "is the gas cap on the left or right side? Huh, my computer doesn't list it"

 

[Tdam]

Do any of you guys know what oil should be in the Allison TT222-1 and how much? I would say by looking you are right chansey about what tranny I have. What I don't know is why my 3rd gear has no power at all and why when shut off the tranny dip stick reads full and when running in neutral warmed up there is nothing at all on the dip stick. I have no idea what is the right way to check it.

 

[Tdam]

Chansey,

What kind of bucket do you have on your loader? Sometime if you have time if you have a picture of the bucket I would like to see it. I am trying to get a GrabTec grapple fork for mine but I cant find a model number on it. Mine is a JRB clam shell that was welded shut and had new sides, bottom, and cutting edge installed as well.

Thanks

 

[kshansen]

Do any of you guys know what oil should be in the Allison TT222-1 and how much? I would say by looking you are right chansey about what tranny I have. What I don't know is why my 3rd gear has no power at all and why when shut off the tranny dip stick reads full and when running in neutral warmed up there is nothing at all on the dip stick. I have no idea what is the right way to check it.

I think this might be the service manual for your transmission It shows as TT2221-1, did you miss-type the model?

ftp://38.106.177.129/gopettibone/forms/dealersold/vendor-archived%20service%20manuals/allison/Series%20TT%20TTB%20TRT%202001%20Service%20Manual%20SA%202003.pdf

Or if that one is way to long:

http://************/nfqmkgx

 

[Tdam]

kshansen,

Thanks for the link but after looking for the TT2221-1 I don't think is right. I have 3 forward and 3 reverse gears in my Trojan 1500. So I need to find the tag on my tranny. If I am wrong sorry I am still learning I know pickups and tractors but not Trojan Wheel loaders. But thanks for every thing

 

[chansey]

YuP

Left the 1 out of the number

Thanks for the correction

I'll post some more pics tomorrow

Paul

 

[chansey]

Tdam,

Do your have the Data Plate info for your Trojan?

Any idea of the year model?

Paul

 

[chansey]

Trojan loader Pics






Bucket --tag missing



Paul

 

[Tdam]

All I know it has a plate on the dash it Trojan 1500 and SS #. I know the cummins motor is a 1988 100 hp 4BT from the tag on it. Now a question can the oil from the tranny leak into the hydraulic oil? I am almost 100% sure that the site window where you check the hydraulic oil is bright red now and it wasn't before. Is so that would explain why my tranny is low every day but I cant find any oil leaks on the outside of the machine.