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Steep slopes, what's your experience?

pete40

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Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
Now that you put it in those words jerry I can see reason. I am going to probably try one of each on hire for a while before I buy. It'll be the only way to truly decide. But I know now that I'll probably end up wanting one of each!
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
Buy a small dozer thats what i use for pioneering work i have an older machine a John Deere 350c pat blade cuts about a 6' pass(perfect for ATV)very stable machine simple to work on. Pick one up for about $20K i also have a CTL with a 6way blade aswell great for regradeing trail terraces but just will never have the pushing power of a dozer. in short there is not one machine that will fit your purpose another option would be a small drott like a 931 or 933 will push a trail and can dig and carry not as fast as a dozer for cutting across a slope but will do the job once you hone you skills great for pushing heaps and building bike jumps, clearing scrubis a breeze with a 4 in 1
 

pete40

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Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
What pros and cons can you give for a 6-way blade as opposed to a bucket on the same type of tilting pivot on a CTL? A 4 in 1 bucket is obviously very handy and if you can also have it tilting for side-cuts as well, that could be ideal - couldn't it? What are the drawbacks?
 

therealjohnboy

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Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
itll do the job but a CTL just cant get the traction required due to its low ground pressure slow itll be slower and more wear and tear on the running gear i use my CTL for this application to save having to cart in both machines it also depends on soil type, amount of rock, tree roots, skill level, fear factor, budget in mind.
You could buy a good dozer and drott for the price of a CTL or a dozer and mini exc or SSL you need to way up what will be the bulk of the work. will you always have to maintain the steep terrain or only till your tracks are in if so buy a dozer to do the bulk work then sell it and buy a ssl/ctl and mini exc to do the on going maintainence i build alot of enduro/Motocross tracks in steep scrub land with the dozer and do the finish work and maintainence work with the ctl just my 2c worth
 

pete40

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Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
Know anybody in Qld who does similar work johnboy?

I like your idea there - buy a dozer (or hire someone to do the work) and then sell it and get a CTL for maintenance work. CTL's are bloody expensive though even second hand. I am a bit worried about on-going cost - I mean I will only use it occasionally but with a second-hand one, what are the main things to steer clear of when looking to buy? I don't want to buy one and then find out I have to spend 10k on something that is buggered on it. How many traps are there for the uninitiated?
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
i have owned ctls for about 3 years and would never go back to a ssl despite the added costs allow about $6-7K every 1500 hrs for maintainence (tracks sprockets, etc) a ssl will cost about half that amount in 1500 hrs but physio bills will make up the difference plus you'll never **** right again due to the poo compaction the ride gives you. also one week of work when a ssl is laided up due to weather more than pays the diff.
plus digging pass for pass a ctl will run rings around a ssl. a small dozer will cost about the $6K for chains and sprockets every 2000 hrs. I would go down the path of buying the small dozer rather than sub contract the work as you'll need to learn YOUR terrain if you intend on maintaining it. besides if your doing it for yourself you can take your time and do it the way you want not the most cost effective way. My only advice would be to take your time and learn the limits of the machine, my dozer has been on its roof twice in extreem terrain and it happens in a instant respect the conditions. Walk the site looking for blind cliffs, old mines, wells, dams etc i have found all of them and soiled many pairs of jocks. I'd come up from SA for a change of scenery if work wasnt so chaotic down here.
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
The dozers i would suggest for small work are
Kom. D20 D21 D30,
Mits. BD2,
JD 350c,
Cat D3,
all are small enough to do a neat job of small tracks and are cheap to run Ive owned a
D20 great for tight work still have the JD as it has 3pl too and just sold my 931c to a fella in Armidale D3 size drott same as D3 dozer Great power in a small package
 

pete40

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Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
On the small dozer front - you got any knowledge of those "Eastwind" dozers - chinese small dozer about same size as a D20. A guy on the Sunshine Coast sells them, but I haven't spoken to anyone with one for a true opinion. Brand new about $30k.
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
i heard that they do the job but more suited to a hobby farmer id spend 30k on a second hand cat/JD/Kom before i looked down that path but they do fit the size requirement same as kom d20 both about 40hp 3.5/4 ton JD 350c is about 55hp 5 ton D3 cat is about 75hp 7.5 ton its not all about hp you need the weight to get the traction too
 

pete40

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Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
I would love to do as you suggest and get a small dozer. But I will eventually have a bitumen road to negotiate as well and there isn't much room either side of that to run a steel track vehicle, so a rubber track is going to be ideal. I may end up doing what you said and get a steelie, learn how to do it and get most tracks cut in, then sell it and buy a rubber track.

Are there any pros and cons for any particular brand of track loader to go for or steer clear of? If I just go ahead and get a track loader from the start, it's just going to take me longer to get my tracks in.
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
For hard digging i would buy a CTL not an MTL.
MTL's are better suited to low impact work.
Bobcat machines work hard,compact nimble and are common but hard on the operator and heavy on fuel
Takeuchi machines are awesome, good on fuel, dig like nothing else, a little better than B/C as far as ride noise etc. But they are big tall and tough.
New Holland are in the middle. Great ride, nice cab comfort, economical good digging power a great all rounder.
Case are a case machine do the job but are dated and expensive but reliable
If i was looking around id be looking for a low hr machine at a good deal nows the time.

there are other machines but they are an unknown ie KOM, JCB, JD, Couger just buy the biggest you can afford cos you'll get more done in a shorter time

Just my 2c worth should be some other opinions out there
 

pete40

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Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
The only machine I have actually tried at my place was an ASV Posi-track (RC-60) with a 4-in-1 bucket. Seemed like it would do the job. Bloody things hold their price second hand. Where does this brand rate amongst the ones you mentioned? The guy who sells them up here was great - he brought one out for a demo for me.
 

therealjohnboy

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Joined
Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
ive used them but not owned one they are the MTL style i mentioned working them hard seems to kill the under carriage quick and its a fortune to replace plus the digger power didnt compare to what im used to they seemed to give up when pushed hard
Try a few of the brands i suggested just to give yourself something to rate against.
Its alot of cash so you wanna get it right
 

therealjohnboy

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Sep 13, 2008
Messages
100
Location
South Australia
all the dealers should bring you a machine out if they are serious about selling it to you.
you need to trial them in the conditions you'll use it maybe even hire a few to get a good idea
 

pete40

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Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
So what is CTL and MTL? I thought CTL was "Compact Track Loader" and MTL was "Mini Track loader" . Is that right? I must seem pretty base on knowledge, but everyone's gotta start somewhere!

The ASV- 60 wasn't too mini (if that's what it means) and they go up to a 100, which is quite powerful)
 

Foster

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Nov 15, 2007
Messages
19
Location
New Hampshire
How about a machine built for steep impassable terrain?
 

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pete40

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Aug 2, 2008
Messages
61
Location
Australia
Beejeezus!

Looks impressive - how does it get onto the slope in the first place???

Also, looks like the slope has been chain-pulled first too. That thing wouldn't get in between the trees too easily - would it?
 
Last edited:

Foster

Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
19
Location
New Hampshire
You use your boom and stick to push or pull your self around. The wheels you see have power to them, there is also a set of wheels that mount on the front legs so you can drive on flat ground. Very easy to get between trees, can be only 6' wide and move sideways if you need to. Chain pulled ?
 
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