• Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!

Section for komatsu d20,21 and similar grey market dozers

tantoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2012
Messages
50
Location
Tacoma, Wa
Please do... I have several that I will rebuild if I can get them for that price... I only have one that is a problem as far as a definite HAVE to do now, but the others have signs of future problems so I’d like to do them as well.
Well the only parts of the rebuild kit that were the right size were the rod wiper seal (you see this seal on the exterior of the cylinder) and the rod seal. Luckily everything else was ok and it stopped my leak. I will find the part number and report back.
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Just got a new starter installed on my D20A-6 and was ready to get some overdue work done. But after about an hour of pushing dirt, it started sputtering and almost died on me with the throttle cracked a good bit. I had to limp it back to the house, letting it sit and speed back up a bit before driving a bit farther. It had been sitting up about a year, so I thought it's probably water in the fuel, or something got stopped up. When I cranked it up the next day to move it close to the shop, it ran just fine, so I eased down to the closest place I could work and started pushing dirt again. It didn't last for 5 or 10 minutes and started sputtering again. So I parked it by the shop and started troubleshooting.

First, I replaced the fuel filter. Then I pulled the strainer out of the fuel tank inlet and looked into the tank with a flashlight. I could see a little dirt in the bottom of the tank, and a nodule of some kind laying in the bottom as well. I didn't see any water, and everything I saw was well below the pickup tube. But I drained the tank and sucked out what was left anyway. I poured a few gallons of fresh diesel in, cranked it up and let it run at medium speed for a few minutes. It wasn't long before it started sputtering again.

So I moved up to the feed/injector pump system. I pulled the inlet hose off the feed pump, and fuel came running out, so I know that hose is clear. I pulled off the hose from there to the fuel filter, and from the fuel filter to the injector pump and made sure they were all flowing freely. I pulled off the priming pump, and the plug, spring, and piston in the side of the feed pump assembly and found no dirt or anything that looked bad. I blew air through the fuel filter assembly and it was clear.

Now I'm baffled. It runs like a champ, smooth as can be when first started, but after a short, random time, it starts sputtering and almost dies. I am not a diesel mechanic, and until 2010, never owned a diesel. So I have no experience troubleshooting the fuel system for a diesel. My thoughts right now are that the feed pump is not pumping fast enough to keep up with the demand at higher rpm, and after the fuel filter drains what fuel it has in it, the injectors are starved. But that is just a wild guess. I feel like the injector pump itself is working fine, but is starved for fuel.

I would appreciate any thoughts or opinions you may have on this problem. I am not scared to tear into anything as long as it is advisable. I just don't want to go removing something that is virtually impossible to replace after examining.
 

epirbalex

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2017
Messages
554
Location
Akitio
Occupation
peasant
Just got a new starter installed on my D20A-6 and was ready to get some overdue work done. But after about an hour of pushing dirt, it started sputtering and almost died on me with the throttle cracked a good bit. I had to limp it back to the house, letting it sit and speed back up a bit before driving a bit farther. It had been sitting up about a year, so I thought it's probably water in the fuel, or something got stopped up. When I cranked it up the next day to move it close to the shop, it ran just fine, so I eased down to the closest place I could work and started pushing dirt again. It didn't last for 5 or 10 minutes and started sputtering again. So I parked it by the shop and started troubleshooting.

First, I replaced the fuel filter. Then I pulled the strainer out of the fuel tank inlet and looked into the tank with a flashlight. I could see a little dirt in the bottom of the tank, and a nodule of some kind laying in the bottom as well. I didn't see any water, and everything I saw was well below the pickup tube. But I drained the tank and sucked out what was left anyway. I poured a few gallons of fresh diesel in, cranked it up and let it run at medium speed for a few minutes. It wasn't long before it started sputtering again.

So I moved up to the feed/injector pump system. I pulled the inlet hose off the feed pump, and fuel came running out, so I know that hose is clear. I pulled off the hose from there to the fuel filter, and from the fuel filter to the injector pump and made sure they were all flowing freely. I pulled off the priming pump, and the plug, spring, and piston in the side of the feed pump assembly and found no dirt or anything that looked bad. I blew air through the fuel filter assembly and it was clear.

Now I'm baffled. It runs like a champ, smooth as can be when first started, but after a short, random time, it starts sputtering and almost dies. I am not a diesel mechanic, and until 2010, never owned a diesel. So I have no experience troubleshooting the fuel system for a diesel. My thoughts right now are that the feed pump is not pumping fast enough to keep up with the demand at higher rpm, and after the fuel filter drains what fuel it has in it, the injectors are starved. But that is just a wild guess. I feel like the injector pump itself is working fine, but is starved for fuel.

I would appreciate any thoughts or opinions you may have on this problem. I am not scared to tear into anything as long as it is advisable. I just don't want to go removing something that is virtually impossible to replace after examining.
Check the fuel cap vent is not blocked .
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Oh my goodness. If that is what it is, I will be a happy camper, and quickly purchase a new cap. I will check it out tomorrow. Thanks.
 

tantoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2012
Messages
50
Location
Tacoma, Wa
Oh my goodness. If that is what it is, I will be a happy camper, and quickly purchase a new cap. I will check it out tomorrow. Thanks.
Run the machine till it starts to stall, shut off, loosen fuel cap and listen for vacuum in tank as epirbalex says.
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Well, that wasn't it. It started sputtering and I took the cap completely off and ran it for another three or four minutes with no change. Any other ideas?
 

epirbalex

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2017
Messages
554
Location
Akitio
Occupation
peasant
Well, that wasn't it. It started sputtering and I took the cap completely off and ran it for another three or four minutes with no change. Any other ideas?
That's a pity , either blocked intermittently or sucking air into a line maybe , taking to the injector pump would be to hasty . It is behaving abit like a D31 that I had here for awhile , operator treated it for diesel bug and it came right after a filter change a couple of times , it too had been sitting for an extended period . I know he added something to the fuel but don't know what it was . Another couple of local roosters tore of an injector pump from a Case 1150 only to have blocked filters . Serviceman had to put it back together again .
 

tantoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2012
Messages
50
Location
Tacoma, Wa
Well, that wasn't it. It started sputtering and I took the cap completely off and ran it for another three or four minutes with no change. Any other ideas?
Iam sure you looked at/cleaned the banjo bolt filter at the pump inlet?
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
epirbalex, my brother-in-law told me they use a product called Diesel 911 on all their equipment where he works. He said it will get rid of water and other stuff in the fuel over time. Don't know any more than that about it. Sorry to hear about the blocked filters episode. I have been burned before by something really simple like that. It's not a good feeling.
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Had a little blow come through this evening, with much needed rain. More in the forecast. Will check out that banjo next chance I get. Thanks, tantoy.
 

thepumpguysc

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2010
Messages
7,535
Location
Sunny South Carolina
Occupation
Master Inj.Pump rebuilder
Yeah, 16 should have a filter in it..
To determine if things are pumping like they should.. Take the fuel INLET line off or loosen it, at the injection pump.. Have someone standing there to watch & crank the engine.. fuel should be pulsing outta there at about 20psi.!! ALOT of fuel..
IF IT IS.. tighten it back up.. NOW go to the return side & pull THAT banjo bolt out.. it should be a spring loaded overflow valve.. CHECK IT.. Its "supposed to" hold 25psi in the pumping gallery..
You could rig up a pressure gauge at the pump inlet to check the pressure..
Check the overflow valve for a broken/weak spring.. shake it & get a small scribe or screwdriver & push the check ball from the bottom.. the spring should have tension on it..
Good luck..
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Woohooo! Thanks to all of you for the help. I pulled the inlet banjo bolt, and took it all the way out. Sure enough, this time I saw the filter. And boy was it stopped up. I had to take a picture of it to share with you all. I pushed dirt for about two hours, and it never so much as coughed one time. I double-checked the drawing to see if I just overlooked the filter, but I didn't. It is definitely not on there. Must have been a mod that didn't get documented. Once again, thank you all. thepumpguysc, good info there, and I will keep it handy in case there is another episode down the line.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Z9BiT6JrXvebqQFp9
 

thepumpguysc

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2010
Messages
7,535
Location
Sunny South Carolina
Occupation
Master Inj.Pump rebuilder
WOW. THAT IS stopped up..!!!
That little baby "almost" cost you about $2000.00.!!! {Inj. pump overhaul}
The only way that crud coulda got that far is, by fuel filter neglect..!!! {public shaming, lol}
I hope you learned your lesson?? A couple of 20.00 filters a few times a year, will keep A BUNCH of money "IN" your pocket in the long run..
The filter isn't in the breakdown because the banjo bolt is sold as an assembly..1 pc..
They make BRASS ones too..{older style}
Ya might wanna consider draining & sucking out/cleaning the fuel tank..
Just imagine what got by that "last resort" screen..??
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Ok, I'm a bit confused by what you are saying. The spin-on fuel filter is downstream from this little filter, and I change it with every oil change. The tank was drained and cleaned when I first started fighting this problem. It has fresh diesel in it now. This crud has probably been building up for the 7 years I've owned this dozer, because I didn't know there was another filter that needed to be serviced. It will be checked periodically from now on. Thanks again for all the help and education. Sure is nice to be able to work again.
 

thepumpguysc

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2010
Messages
7,535
Location
Sunny South Carolina
Occupation
Master Inj.Pump rebuilder
Are you saying the fuel goes from the tank, thru THAT little clogged filter, THEN on to the main filters??
IF so, If it were mine, I'd put another filter in-line.. something like one of those glass or plastic see-thru, push on ones..
One of those would keep you outta trouble..
Glad to hear you already cleaned the tank..
 

RRRancher

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
113
Location
Henderson, Texas
Occupation
Retired
Yessir, the fuel hits this thing straight out of the tank, then through the feed pump, through the fuel filter, and into the injector pump. Not sure why they did it this way. I would think that if the fuel filter was first in this arrangement, with it so high up near the top of the tank, there may be problems getting fuel to flow up and through the fuel filter, and on down and into the feed pump. It would be like a siphon action to begin, but would probably flow ok after it was started.

I think you have a good idea there. I will pick up one of those inline filters and stick it on the line from the tank. Thanks again.
 
Top