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Sandvik Holders

Discussion in 'Mills' started by kramer, Nov 15, 2009.

  1. kramer

    kramer Member

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    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    Anybody else demoing these? I've got 50 hours on mine with two direct manhole hits and I'll have to say I've got a pretty good feeling about them. That being said, I had a good feeling about the schibecki tooling and that ended up being a complete POS. Thoughts?
     
  2. milling_drum

    milling_drum Senior Member

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    asphalt mill operator (ret)
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    out west lately
    Sandvik make pretty good teeth, I'd have to imagine their holders would be aight as well. Nothing wrong with Scibecki stuff if used properly. I ran one of they're drums for a summer and it did well with a little hard facing from time to time.
     
  3. milling_drum

    milling_drum Senior Member

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    The lack of attention to this thread makes me laff.....for reasons that if publicly mentioned would most likely get me booted off the server....

    Good topic Kramer....maybe you know why the replies are so slow too:)
     
  4. Buster F

    Buster F Active Member

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    Alright - i'm dying to know MD. Is one of the mods a rep for Kennametal or something?
     
  5. bean

    bean Well-Known Member

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    Does sandvik make a drum to go with these holders or are they for someone elses?
     
  6. milling_drum

    milling_drum Senior Member

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    Not like that Buster...nope.

    The reasons I have that idea is because so many operators and companies I've seen know very little about how teeth work. (I'm no better either) Over the past little while there are ALOT of operations running milling divisions that not bother with it before and they never considered certain elements of controling the amount of teeth they go through or how they run them.

    For instance, I've seen MANY operators set into the cut in cold (or hot) weather and take off as fast as the mill will go from the start. That in my opinion isn't good, it causes flat spotting on teeth because the tips aren't at a decent temp yet. I was taught its always a good idea to load a truck or two going a little slower then full out to get the drum warmed up and then hammer away as fast as possible.

    Another For instance is the amount of people that have no idea if the back tracks are out of calibration causing the machine to crab, which wears out end ring teeth and holders, I doubt I've seen anyone in the last 10 years that pays attention to such things. Its usually pretty obvious by looking at the side walls of the cut, the one that has no material left in trail usually means the @ss end of the machine is kicked off in that direction.

    And milling people just don't like being told those little cruddy details, they don't care and they resent hearing it at all. In another thread here, I saw some pictures and mentioned that it is a good idea to try to run a mill as level (front to back) as possible, the reply was....they didn't care and it didn't matter....end of story. Let the company owners replace the parts worn out because the crews aren't interested in taking care of the equipment. Not me....I'll quit before I go out like that:)

    Hopefully these comments don't get me booted but they might...whiners are not in short supply.

    Bean, I ain't never seen a Sandvik drum atall, saw a few holders once with a tooth sales rep down in Texas this year, never run a Sandvik holder either. Lotta folks don't care anything for Sandvik but I think they are aight and better than some others I've used. This year in the Midwest we ran those Sandvik teeth with the double ring of carbide on it, they were excellent on Interstate 94, held up better than Kenametal teeth we had.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2009
  7. AtlasRob

    AtlasRob Senior Member

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    :D I think that goes for all of us.............:rolleyes:............ :drinkup

    Its intresting to hear from somebody that 1) knows about such things and 2) still takes pride in what he does.

    I have seen comments of yours about cut patterns following different pictures that have been posted. You know the difference between it being right or something wrong, but to me its just a mark left by a load of rotating tips.

    Dont take this as critisism, it is meant as praise and is very intresting. :IMO :beerchug

    on edit, as for getting booted out, NOT for expressing an opinion. Whether you get flak from another point of view is anybodys guess, but you are entitled to your opinion, which you express very well in my opinion.

    Re read and theres an awful lot of opinions in this post
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2009
  8. milling_drum

    milling_drum Senior Member

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    Well Thanks Mr Rob, its always nice to read something from across the pond that concurs or makes light of the fact most of what I've stated is indeed "opinion".

    In review of a milling pattern is usually difficult to tell what shape the teeth were in if the mill is moving at over 100fpm. That being mentioned, material density also makes a big difference. Factor in such issues and teeth/holder wear can then boil down to ...... if they have the smarts to check the drum OR can they feel the bad teeth while the machine is moving forward in the cut.

    Lots of different elements are at work when it comes to teeth. Griz posted some lovely pics of a drum with the teeth holder pockets almost worn off....I'll bet those operators are a little guilty in part of what I mentioned earlier. (specially that worn out end ring)

    I just parted ways with a company that changes a FULL set of drum teeth every 2 days whether or not ALL the teeth needed change or not.....wonder how much that is costing the owner who doesn't know any better and loses money???? I tried to help and was seriously resented for it:)
     
  9. bean

    bean Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Canada
    I have used the sandvik teeth before and they are better the the wirtgen w6 and w7's.

    Wirtgen has a nice little book that can educate people on all sorts of tooth related stuff.

    The end ring teeth i think are some of the most important, but many people don't like changing them because they can be somewhat more diffucult to get at on allot of machines i have found. When we recycle a road 1 lane at a time i can gain 15-30% percent speed just from the 2 inch overlap.


    as for griz's photo usually when the machine starts to surge it means you have some serious drum work to do lol. It can happen very fast though I must admit several years ago within 200 meters we lost about 10 holders in a flight.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2009
  10. Toegrinder

    Toegrinder Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2009
    Messages:
    131
    Occupation:
    Milling Foreman
    Location:
    CO
    "For instance, I've seen MANY operators set into the cut in cold (or hot) weather and take off as fast as the mill will go from the start. That in my opinion isn't good, it causes flat spotting on teeth because the tips aren't at a decent temp yet. I was taught its always a good idea to load a truck or two going a little slower then full out to get the drum warmed up and then hammer away as fast as possible. "

    I was taught the exact same thing, still follow it to this day



    "Another For instance is the amount of people that have no idea if the back tracks are out of calibration causing the machine to crab, which wears out end ring teeth and holders, I doubt I've seen anyone in the last 10 years that pays attention to such things. Its usually pretty obvious by looking at the side walls of the cut, the one that has no material left in trail usually means the @ss end of the machine is kicked off in that direction."

    machine crabbing to one side=HUGE pet peeve of mine, the old pr-800's were friggin notorious for that crap



    "And milling people just don't like being told those little cruddy details, they don't care and they resent hearing it at all."

    Again, I completely agree. I As far as keeping the machine level...another pet peeve, I even put a little stick on bubble level on my machines for the groundmen too lazy to back up and look, haha I'm anal I know.



    " In another thread here, I saw some pictures and mentioned that it is a good idea to try to run a mill as level (front to back) as possible, the reply was....they didn't care and it didn't matter....end of story. Let the company owners replace the parts worn out because the crews aren't interested in taking care of the equipment. Not me....I'll quit before I go out like that:)"

    I have fired more people for that attitude


    "Bean, I ain't never seen a Sandvik drum at all, saw a few holders once with a tooth sales rep down in Texas this year, never run a Sandvik holder either. Lotta folks don't care anything for Sandvik but I think they are aight and better than some others I've used. This year in the Midwest we ran those Sandvik teeth with the double ring of carbide on it, they were excellent on Interstate 94, held up better than Kenametal teeth we had.[/QUOTE]

    The one time we were given a sample of sandvik's to run on a pr-800, I was not impressed at all
     
  11. milling_drum

    milling_drum Senior Member

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    Occupation:
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    LMFAOOOOOOOOO thats so funny....Dude....Literally every other milling outfit out there these days has the BIGGEST set of morons who think because they can cut a line thats fairly straight or stay on grade going 110 fpm that they know it ALL about milling....

    The older CMI models had a less than steller back track auto, When I worked at The Miller Group back in the late 90's, they had a series of PR machines from 12ft to 7'2 ft which ALL exhibited the same rear steer problems. First week I was running the PR1050, the foreman Eddie insisted that I use the back track auto, the then supt at Miller had told me to run it with it off and just pay attention to it. Second night on the job (285 beltway in Atlanta) I'm running with it on because Eddies lurking around, the supt, Donny, shows up...gets up top with me and asks me how I like it blah blah blah...notices the auto on...shuts it off and gets down....Eddie gets up top, sees it off and flips it on giving me a dirty look....and hour later they are in a shouting match....Hilarious. NO animosity with those folks, they are both still on good terms although I can't work for them cuz nothing pays good down where they are, but they DO know they're stuff with milling and they were a pleasure to work for.

    The older Roadtecs were bad like that too, When setting them down you could watch the front of the back track kicking over as you came down to zero. First thing you had to do before taking off was straighten it back out, luckily with the old machines the engine compartment doors could be popped open and the operator has a view of the front of the track....it did matter alot what position the operator looked at it too because getting it on center until you had a mark to work with was hell.

    CAT and Wirgten for some reason being 4 track machines didn't have as many issues like that...and most of the people that run Wirtgen equipment are clueless in general because Wirtgen make such an easy to machine to run, nothing matters to the people running them, they aren't the ones that pay to do repairs. Which is why Wirtgen has that mouldboard system the way it is, they must know that the people buying a large percentage of their machines have minimal milling experience don't pay any attention to mouldboard down pressure.....

    I could go on and on....Nice to see theres other people that know a little something out there:)