• Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!

Redneck ruminations and thoughts

Scrub Puller

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair . . . .

I started a fourteen pound brisket on the drum early this morning and, and for some time I was busy laying back in the hammock soaking up the morning sun.

As often happens my mind wandered back in time and I thought about how things are done “different” these days.

It seems to me that jobs that used to be easy are becoming increasingly difficult . . . witness Tradesmans battle with a sewage pond and other posts by folks looking to purchase extreme low ground pressure dozers for boggy conditions. Across the years there have been threads on long and not so long reach excavators getting stuck clearing silt from ponds.

Then I see discussions about modifying excavator buckets to have the pins and bushings made to take automatic pressure lubrication with bearings and seals . . . this just to win gravel from thirty feet of water.

It has all been done before of course.

Thirty odd years ago a dredging outfit on the North Coast spent thousands of dollars modifying an excavator stick and bucket to take oversized floating pins, roller bearings and what we then called “Caterpillar” metal to metal seals. The whole thing was oil lubricated with a twenty gallon tank on the stick . . . the theory was that the head of oil would maintain a positive pressure in the housing and keep the crap out.

My boss just shook his head and we continued with the “quick change with the oxy” system described on that thread . . . to take that thought process further he had modified the buckets on his Scoopmobiles to take sections of D9 bushings in the pivots and of course used the D9 pins.

In fact just about every pivot he owned used dozer pins and bushes, cheap as chips he reckoned and it only took a few minutes to split them with the gas axe and knock the buggers out.
The thing is, as I have mentioned, the rock and dirt remain the same and we choose to move it with ever more complex and fragile machinery . . . witness the discussion about pushing trees with a PAT blade.

I have mentioned before (to almost zero response) I reckon there is a machine missing from the arsenal available to contractors today . . . imagine a modern version of a small dragline.

There may be a few on here who have seen a small dragline in full flight baling and I put it to you that (say) a twenty five ton excavator equipped with a side folding lattice boom and hydraulic winches would have many applications.

And what a joy it would be, some real tractive power and easily adjusted tracks and no drive chains and frictions to contend with.

Draglines are not just about mud. I have a thread on here about a contractor I worked for who bid road cuts with a bitser dragline and me ripping, pushing to him, and cutting batters with a D6. He would load hired in road trucks all day and we’d spend half the night on maintenance but it seldom broke down.

Cheers.
 

hetkind

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2015
Messages
472
Location
Unicoi, TN
I think the long stick tracked excavators can do most of that work today...with draglines really only used in mining type activities. I have seen some unusual types of draglines at large sand pits.

Howard
 

Delmer

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
8,891
Location
WI
No argument from me. The guys who can't find somebody qualified to run a skid steer might disagree? big grin
 

Scrub Puller

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair . . .

Thanks for link boaterri! So they are out there but nobody wants them. Obviously Delmer has nailed part of the problem . . . finding some one to run one.

"Back then" dragline operators were among the elite in the equipment world and I believe slightly up the rung from a final trim grader hand. Remember this was in an era ( in Australia anyway) that paid a little extra money if a driver could run two sticks in a Mack.

I would point out that the machine shown in that link posted by boaterri could win gravel from thirty feet of water one day, clean out Tradesmans sewerage pond the next, then clean out Shimmy1's stock-ponds and water holes and, and then set about stripping top soil and loading out shot rock on a road job.

Cheers.
 

Queenslander

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2009
Messages
1,248
Location
Australia
On another thread I posted a link to an outfit using a large purpose built winch and pulley system to pull a silt scoop across farm dams.
These blokes are using the same principle with an old Ruston Bucyrus dragline.
http://www.damassist.com.au
I can't think of a "modern" machine capable of doing the job as efficiently as this.
 

Scrub Puller

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair . . .

And a good operator could throw the bucket quite a ways past the point sheave.
ol'stonebreaker That's exactly right. The bloke I worked for was a classic He would have that bucket hanging out when he came round on the swing and yet his ropes were always tidy on the drum.

Cheers.
 

boaterri

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2008
Messages
231
Location
Florida, USA
Occupation
Retired Television Engineer
Did the old time operators get the most distance past the end of the boom by whipping around with the house swing or by having the bucket just above the ground, reeling it in with the drag and letting it swing out on the lift line?

Rick
 

Birken Vogt

Charter Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2003
Messages
5,323
Location
Grass Valley, Ca
There is a guy around here with an old 1950s Bucyrus with a 2-71 engine in it. He cleans out ponds and not much else I assume because hydraulic machines get the jobs. He can't be all that busy because whenever I see the machine it always sits for weeks after completing a job.

That being said I have never met the guy, only looked at the machine.
 

John C.

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
12,870
Location
Northwest
Occupation
Machinery & Equipment Appraiser
Years back as part of being a wrench in a small coal mine I ran a Koehring 405 with a drag to clear a fines pond. Sixty foot of boom and two yard bucket with three to four hours work would keep two highway dump trucks and a wheel loader going for six to seven hours loading out from a drying pad. I don't know to this day of any long stick juice machine with the same horsepower and fuel usage that could come close to that type of production.
 

Scrub Puller

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair . . .

boaterri. Letting the bucket swing out on the hoist line was the normal/conventional technique. However, as skills improved and, if it was advantageous or necessary, as I mentioned up thread, a good operator would use the swing motion to get that bucket hanging out there and gain that extra few yards.

John C. Thanks for that comment.

Apart from the fact that a dragline can easily get to dirt inaccessible to other machines I believe the dirt moved to fuel used ratio ratio equation would be a bit of an eye opener for folks using what is seen these days as "standard methods".

The dragline I speak of up thread had a 4LW Gardner probably putting out about forty five horsepower at (say) a thousand revs and, stripping and stockpiling eighteen inches of topsoil on a mile or so of road job it was way more efficient than pushing off with the D6.

The biggest problem was the walking and traction system. If only could have been clattered around like a modern day excavator . . . .

Cheers.
 

kenh

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Messages
264
Location
bonners ferry,id
Long ago in another life I was flinging a 7500 lb magnet with a Brownhoist locomotive crane.
I would let it go on the "catch up" and if required a bit of reel in/let out.
40 minutes to unload a 50' Gondola of pig iron. Occasionally the foreman would come out and point to select scrap way out there.
I think he was bored and used me for entertainment.
 

hd16b

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
48
Location
Stokes, NC
Occupation
Farmer by name and trade
Yeah I can run two ten hour days on my 22b. I like to swing cast, reeling in and casting takes too long and doesn't quite go as far. Have a look on youtube under son working on farm.
 

hd16b

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2011
Messages
48
Location
Stokes, NC
Occupation
Farmer by name and trade
Forgot to say on 50 gallons of fuel,471 Detroit. Also have some videosort under 22b digging sand and 16b working
 

Shimmy1

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2014
Messages
4,352
Location
North Dakota
Found this vid. https://youtu.be/MgY2_8JzyXI Scrub, since you've been around draglines a bit, I have a question. Does he pull the scoop most of the way in before picking it up to minimize leverage on the boom? I have to do the same with my hoe, but for slightly different reasons, first being I don't have enough counterweight to pick a full bucket of muck up out of the hole stretched way out. Second, *if* I could pick it up, all the weigh is out on my "toes" (tracks) and the ground would never hold up for more than a bucket or two. This last pond I dug, I could only get about 4 or 5 buckets and would have to back out, throw a little dry dirt in the holes, and move back in for a few more buckets before I'd have to do it again. Luckily I was able to get each setting done before there was no stability left in that spot. You know it's time to get out when the hoe is sliding down from the motion of the stick moving in.
 

Scrub Puller

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair. . .

Gotcha Shimmy1. Good question. Lots of dragline hands here would be in a better position to comment than me but the feller I worked for certainly did not work like that.

I worked with him and got some seat time desilting dry dams and he stressed the importance (if possible) of not stirring up the goop. If he could see what he was doing he'd hoist as soon as the bucket filled and that was basically in the length of the bucket.

Same thing when stripping topsoil and sod, basically lower bucket, suck it a bucket length or so to fill it, hoist and swing.

It's pleasing to see this odd ball thread has created a bit of comment.

Cheers.
 

Jim D

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2012
Messages
408
Location
California
Occupation
equipment operator
What about the long reach excavators with cable winch retrieval of the bucket? British machines, I think.
 
Top