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Old man work? No.....he's with MSHA

Discussion in 'Safety Issues' started by RollOver Pete, Sep 19, 2014.

  1. 96_Bear

    96_Bear Active Member

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    I to understand MSHA and a I do see there point from some of the things I now deal with FDA and NFPA. The first truck/trailer I ever worked on was the Monday Night Football truck. Was just a little company out of Sunbury Ohio. Not sure if I am allowed to post the link but the first part of the company name is Gerling. There is lots of pictures of work I did there. The company only had 30 employees.
     
  2. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    That's interesting 96_Bear .

    So to put it all in a nutshell so to speak ....... Company buys a truck or trailer . People on the set say we need it to do this or that and then it gets handed to you to make needed modifications . Am I pretty close ?
     
  3. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Nice find old-iron !

    Damn ..... You could have a barbeque and square dance behind the cab of the ASTRO !:D

    Cummins power ?
     
  4. old-iron-habit

    old-iron-habit Senior Member

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    Its actually a Chevrolet Titan. Pretty rare copy. It has all the options then that was available then. It has a 350 Cummins with a 13 speed. 177,000 miles on it right now. Was owned by a truss manufacturing facility and delivered trusses. Brought it home crusing at 72 MPH with some left. Just got classic plates for it today. Going to be the new toyhauler. It has a little damage in the back lower corner where they set the aluminum cab down on some blocking but otherwise its real clean. Looking for a body shop now to clean it up with new paint. I want Cat yellow, wife wants something else. If she pays for half it gets her color choice. Lighting needs some work but tires and brakes are good. It has hook ups for an air brake trailer also. I picked it up cheap so I can stick a bit into it.
     
  5. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    That's cool old -iron !

    Keep it up Bro .

    I got to say it ..... :)

    Man ..... I cant get over some of the internet nonsense on welding .

    After passing trucks on the road we put together 20 years ago and still hauling today pretty much puts it in perspective for myself .:cool:

    Don't have time to worry about some little can welded on the side of a ROPS cab . LOL !
     
  6. lantraxco

    lantraxco Senior Member

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    Splicing a frame is completely different than gluing on a bracket or welding something on top of the frame flange. These kinds of things are just about guaranteed to create stress risers that will lead to cracks and eventual failure. Then you have to replace the frame rail or splice in a section, neither of which is fun or cheap.
     
  7. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Yeah lantraxco , I would agree with that to an extent .

    That was always the text book rule . But then again there are exceptions ............

    One example is a factory built trailer with fenders welded on top frame flange . No problems with it .

    Then look at the mast section on the 750 Holmes , welded on flanges & across the channel in pretty much every direction . No complaints , Ernest Holmes got it figured out long time ago .


    Then on the other end of the extreme when I built the FWD oil field truck every thing got welded solid to the frame from the tail board to the front fenders . Similar to a crane chassis . H - beams welded rite in to the frame rails & suspension brackets .
    http://www.heavytruckforums.com/showthread.php?51-Fwd-Trucks&p=223&viewfull=1#post223

    I like to step back & look how different equipment is put together , helps me make decisions on how to repair & fabricate .
     

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  8. lantraxco

    lantraxco Senior Member

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    Truck frames are often heat treated like a spring leaf, thus the decals warning not to weld on them. Structural steel will still have issues but it's a lot less likely to fail since the weld and what you're attaching are probably very close in strength to the parent metal.

    Cheers :)
     
  9. Scrub Puller

    Scrub Puller Senior Member

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    Yair . . .

    To put things into perspective . . . welding a drink holder/fire extinguisher bracket onto a ROPS would not be an issue in most cases but there have to be rules and industry wide I guess it is simpler to enforce a no modification/welding/drilling rule.

    As I have mentioned somewhere (perhaps on this thread) I have seen cracks propagated by gorilla snot welds on brackets attaching hydraulic tube clamps to excavator booms so, as pointed out by Nige with the computer stress analysis pictures, this can be a complex issue.

    Cheers.
     
  10. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Oh man ....... I really done it this time .... :(

    Just hope we can it fixed before Nige sees it ..:eek: We borrowed the loader arm and while prying up some limestone broke it in two ( Dad was operating ) I didn't do it .


    Lets say a new one is not available or costs some crazy amount of cash . Would you guys weld it back together ?




    I know this is a safety thread but just throwing out some hypothetical welding humor .:D



    Have to deal with repairs like that from time to time . https://www.heavyequipmentforums.co...-new-equipment&p=514566&viewfull=1#post514566
     

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  11. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Funny welding stories

    Got it back in one piece ........ Paint is still wet .




    Years ago my Grandfather had some trouble with his dump truck ..... What happened is the set screw on the pto shaft driving the hydraulic pump came loose allowing the shaft to swing wild and snapped off the end off the pto drive shaft in the keyway .

    I was about 12 years old at the time & asked him " Why don't you take it to the welding shop and they could fix it " ?

    Grandpa replied " There is no way that shaft could be repaired " !!!!!!!

    We went to a junk yard and picked up a used pto unit to mount back on the transmission ......... And guess what ????? The end of the drive shaft had been welded up ... Grandpa ended up buying the pto and we mounted it on the truck ....

    I never let him live it down . Can't be welded ? LOL! :D
     

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  12. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Don't worry td, I have thick skin ....... and BTW you wouldn't weld a total failure of that lever - it's cast ........ the recommendations on the drawing are for weld-repairing casting defects on a new lever, not for field repair.

    Back to Page 1 for a moment if I may. The simple fact is that a ROPS is a safety item and you mess with it at your peril, or at least you do since you Colonials have developed your "I'll sue the a$$ off you because I can and a jury is going to award me a gazillion dollars in damages" culture which the rest of the ambulance-chasing world has taken up with gusto. I agree that welding the fire extinguisher bracket on the ROPS most likely didn't affect its structural integrity, but would YOU like to be the person in the seat if it went over and the ROPS collapsed on your head, or would you like to be the person who did the modification that resulted in someone's serious injury or even death..? There are certain things I personally would not mess with and the case that generated the OP is one of them.

    When it comes to structures I'm much more willing to experiment. The caveat here is understanding how it was put together in the first place. Years ago we were told that a broken lift arm main plate couldn't be welded because the factory procedure required putting the entire structure in an oven to stress-relieve it. what did we do..? built an oven big enough for it that's what. I'll see if I can find some photos.

    I have no problems cutting frames apart but I do like to know a little bit about the metallurgy first and how it was put together. If you understand how it was put together in the first place then coming up with a plan to fix it is generally speaking a relatively simple process. Judging by the number of posts on HEF asking for advice regarding welding repairs for stuff that has been welded before and then (ohmigod who would have believed it) re-cracked leads me to believe that there are a large number of folks walking around this planet who should not be allowed within a mile of any structural welding repair because they are a danger to themselves and others......
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2015
  13. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

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    Like the time we had a 769C truck from another quarry who apparently did not feel keeping the nitrogen suspension cylinders working and this truck had a crack in the frame right above the rear axle. This crack went from right to left and a couple inches down the side plate. Company hired in an outside contractor to repair it. A few minutes with a grinder, no preheating and a few quick passes and job done!

    I'll be the first to say I'm not a welder, biggest problem I had is when I got into this business is the shop had at least two full time welders and there was more wrench work than we could handle so if something needed a quick tack or major fabrication job the welders took over that part. Often regret not having the need or opportunity to learn that part of the business. But that being said I still feel, at least on the basic level, I can tell the difference between a good solid repair and a quicky "cosmetic" patch. Does not take a skilled welding technician to understand that a 1/4 inch deep groove in a 1 inch thick plate is not going to restore the integrity of a frame.
     
  14. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    That's cool Nige ! I knew you would take it in stride mate .:thumbsup

    We just try to keep customers taken care of & happy .

    Last week I did get a good look at the mine safety bull crap.

    Went on service call to get a trucker out of a jam ... Pretty easy job . Guy kept thanking & praising us for doing it as the mine he was hauling in to would not lift a finger to help him . I thought " what the hell are you talking about " , this is what I do bro ......:D

    Aint scared of the job .......... Damn Colonials ! ;)

    http://www.heavytruckforums.com/showthread.php?263-Some-Holmes-750-action&p=1610#post1610
     
  15. nicky 68a

    nicky 68a Senior Member

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    Out of curiosity,can the canopy on this old 980 be returned to service?
     
  16. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Officially the answer is no. Any ROPS with welding in non-approved areas such as the support legs should have the certification plate removed and the structure cut with a gas axe to prevent it being used again.
     
  17. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    I finally got some time and went digging for photos. Do you think you could weld-repair this TD..?

    Picture 032.jpg
     
  18. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Oh Nige ! :eek:

    Don't tell me you let my Dad back on the loader ! Got to keep a close eye on him .:cool2


    How soon do you need it repaired ? Oh yeah ..... Sorry he broke it again .
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2015
  19. CM1995

    CM1995 Super Moderator

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    That gave me a chuckle TD.:D

    A friend of mine has the same issue. His dad works for him and well he's rather a card. :cool2 I respect the hell out of the old coot but he deals junior fits.:D
     
  20. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Yeah CM , It's funny because it's true . :D That's Dad , gotta love him :salute

    He insisted the 15' bat wing bush hog needed new blades installed . OK , put them on then later that day I hear this god awful bang ! bang ! bang ! down in the woods ........ Yep he was testing out the new blades on some limestone .:(