Old Baker FJF runs like a dog, need some tuning help with the Continental Flathead 6

[kilohertz]

It's an Otis/Baker FJF-050 and did lots of work to it this weekend, found the timing WAY off, don't know how it ran, dwell all wrong, carb out of tune etc. I managed to get it running much better but only with the timing way retarded, the timing marks are probably 3" outside the window in the bell housing. I timed it by ear and it seems to run much better than it did, dwell set at 34*, I don't know why it runs much better this far out of time, tuned the carb idle mixture for highest vacuum and took it for a run down the road....Mmmmm not too impressive. I know it's an 8500lb machine with one gear and an automatic, but I thought 85HP would have more snort. And coming back up the driveway, about 4% grade, barely made it. I confirmed TDC with a rod in #1, but the rotor is pointing to almost #5 plug wire in the cap???

Is this normal performance or do I need to keep tuning? This is my first Continental flathead 6, it has a Zenith updraft carb and looks like Delco distributor, which has been changed at some point as it has a vacuum dashpot on it but no port on the carb.

Anyone familiar with these engines?

Cheers

 

[TD24]

Email me direct at: forktruk@yahoo.com.
Had a little experience with Baker and Baker-York.
A pic of the machine itself, and a pic of engine top
with good view of distributor.
TD24

 

[Wes J]

Just start from scratch. #1 on compression stroke, line up the timing mark on the flywheel. Turn distributor to point at #1 wire. Make sure plugs are wired correctly for the firing order 153624. Then use the timing light to fine tune it. You can find the manual online. The ignition is all Delco stuff straight from GM.

The ones I have see all have mechanical advance (centrifugal), not vacuum.

 

[kilohertz]

Thanks Roger and Wes, good stuff.

Well yes I did ensure #1 was at TDC, compression stroke, checked with a wire down the plug hole, rotor was pointing almost at #5, well past #1, and the timing mark was right at TDC. This is where I timed it by ear, and sounds good. When running, the timing mark flashes about 20-30* retarded. I can see mechanical advance is working, about 15* of movement from idle to full poop. Wires are in correct order. I have the manual, the timing marks on this flywheel are actually a sticker, marked 0-30*, the 0 mark is right under a flywheel bolt, not sure if this is something that has been added over the years or is factory. Nothing stamped into the flywheel like shown in the manual. I may try rotating the rotor 180* and rewiring the cap, not sure if that will bring the mark back to where it should be. This is also not the original dist as it has vacuum diaphragm.

Appreciate the help.

Cheers

 

[RZucker]

Thanks Roger and Wes, good stuff.

Well yes I did ensure #1 was at TDC, compression stroke, checked with a wire down the plug hole, rotor was pointing almost at #5, well past #1, and the timing mark was right at TDC. This is where I timed it by ear, and sounds good. When running, the timing mark flashes about 20-30* retarded. I can see mechanical advance is working, about 15* of movement from idle to full poop. Wires are in correct order. I have the manual, the timing marks on this flywheel are actually a sticker, marked 0-30*, the 0 mark is right under a flywheel bolt, not sure if this is something that has been added over the years or is factory. Nothing stamped into the flywheel like shown in the manual. I may try rotating the rotor 180* and rewiring the cap, not sure if that will bring the mark back to where it should be. This is also not the original dist as it has vacuum diaphragm.

Appreciate the help.

Cheers

Not sure about the 6 cylinder continentals, but the F-163's in the Lincoln welders timed from the #4 cylinder. Maybe yours times from #6?

 

[kilohertz]

Quick update, compression check yields all 6 cylinders, 75 PSI warm, at least they are all the same, to me seems low??

Cheers

PS the manual I have for the F227 engine shows timing from #1, thanks for the thought though

 

[Wes J]

That should be fine for an old flat head.

I cover ignition timing in this video.

 

[kilohertz]

Well guys,

I found the problem and fixed it. Besides being the wrong distributor, which I knew had been changed at one time, I took it into my friends shop to get online and find the right one, he looked at and started asking questions. He said let's check the points opening in relationship to the rotor position, he pointed out it turns clockwise based on the vacuum diaphragm position, and I said no it turns counterclockwise......Mmmmm REALLY the wrong distributor, so not only is it going backwards, when the weights swing out, the timing retards, and the points opening and rotor position are all wrong. Turns out this is from a 6 cylinder GM product from the 60's-70's. JEEEZ. So I took it apart and figured out that all the internal mechanics can be reversed to make it a counterclockwise unit, flipped the weights over, moved the top half of the rotor to the opposite set of holes in the base plate, then I had to do a little grinding to get the points plate enough movement to align rotor with #1 when the points just open, removed the vacuum pot and wired the points plate in a fixed position, put it all back in and static timed it, fired right up, timed it again by ear and checked with the light, and it seems happiest at about 8* BTDC, and this time the timing advances, not retards with higher RPM.

Thanks for all the help. Wood arrived for the new shop and she is ready to go to work, just in time.

Cheers