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Motor oil change intervals

Discussion in 'Shop Talk' started by RobVG, May 2, 2019.

  1. RobVG

    RobVG Senior Member

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    Just wondering something.

    All our Hitachi excavators have a 500 hr interval. 4 Gallons of oil.

    Our new Yanmar has a 250 hr interval and takes 3 gallons.

    Why should the Yanmar have to have it's oil changed twice as often?
     
  2. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    The real question is that standard change intervals used to be 250 for all equipment diesel engines. Why would you trust a 500 hour interval? I would be on oil analysis if running over 250.
     
  3. RobVG

    RobVG Senior Member

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    Yeah i remember when intervals were all 250. Ive heard oils are better now.
     
  4. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Oils may be better but they also have to deal with sh1t fuel, sorry ULSD, and a whole host of emissions-related stuff that they never had to in the past. There also appears to be somewhat of a trend of lower engine oil pan capacity in newer engines than it was in older ones which potentially puts even more stress on the oil.

    Second John C's comment about oil analysis if oil is changed at intervals over 250 hours. You are having oil analysis done, right..?

    Good quality oil and filters are probably the cheapest insurance policy anyone can ever get for a machine.
     
  5. Truck Shop

    Truck Shop Senior Member

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    Detroit, Daimler says up to 45,000 mile interval on their DD series on highway engines. We change at 30,000 and I don't like that even. Oil analysis is only as good as the person doing it,
    I sent two samples to two different labs and got two slightly different readings on the same engine.
     
  6. RobVG

    RobVG Senior Member

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    Went to seminar when Delo LE came out. There were a couple guys who said they were getting 60,000 mi intervals on older trucks with oil sampling.

    Personally I bristle when someone suggests oil sampling. Without going into detail, there is simply no time. Haven't lost an engine or a pump in 15 years.

    Let me ask this: Do you have the time to do ALL the scheduled maintenance on the equipment you take care of?
     
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  7. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

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    If time is the only objection to doing oil sampling I have to wonder how you go about taking the samples. The sample kits we used took less than a minute to pull the sample before draining the oil from anything other than axles or final drives on loaders.

    Walk up to the machine with the bottle with probe installed and insert probe into valve, wait a few seconds for it to fill, remove probe cap and install shipping cap. Probably took me longer to type that than to actually do the job!

    Labels were done on computer and that only took a few click of the mouse to select the machine and compartment and then insert the current hours, computer did all the calculations and filled the blanks.
     
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  8. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    In a word - Yes. Anyone who doesn't rolls the dice every time they miss something IMHO. Intervals between attention to certain scheduled maintenance items might be tweaked bearing in mind site conditions but that's about it.

    +1 on KSH's comments regarding oil sampling. It's so simple to do these days I fail to understand why anyone would cite lack of time as a reason not to do it. Our crews probably pull about 20 samples a day on average, 365 days a year.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2019
  9. RobVG

    RobVG Senior Member

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    I have 30 pieces of older equipment and 6 older truck and tailers to repair and it's me and a helper who started 2 days ago.
     
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  10. Truck Shop

    Truck Shop Senior Member

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    We have never lost an engine due to oil or filters,--Let me correct myself. Since I have been with this company {15 plus years and have seen 186 different tractors owned by the company}
    we have never lost an engine except one that was just inframed by the dealer {A series 60}. Now with that said I'm the one that keeps track of services and repairs on 60 tractors and 96 trailers.
    Which gives me 156 engines to monitor. Series 60 engines oil is changed every 15,000 and greased every 7,500 on a short service, DD15 engines oil is changed every 30,000 and greased every
    10,000 on a short service. Maximum over run on a service may hit 2,500 miles. But the real key to keeping a engine alive is the older it gets and more miles it gets to slightly shorten the
    service intervals. In the shop engines after 550,000 miles like the Series 60 I change at 13,500, DD15's at 27,000.

    But the big factor is set a realistic interval for services and stick with it, not to mention all the other things that need attention on a regular basis. Like belts, dryer cartridges, air and power
    steering filters, the list goes on.

    One thing I always tell the boss {everything stars with the shop not the office} if the equipment don't roll no one needs to come to work!
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2019
  11. RobVG

    RobVG Senior Member

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    How many mechanics Truck Shop?
     
  12. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    We don't bother with the oil samples . Just change the oil at given intervals of the engine and manufacturer specs .

    I will " profile " one pretty hard if I see , hear , or smell something out of order .:)
     
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  13. Truck Shop

    Truck Shop Senior Member

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    In the Walla Walla shop Three including me. In the American Falls, Id shop two but they spend most of their time working on trucks that are based there hauling fresh potatoes.
    And will pull a service if needed on one of our trucks or trailers.
     
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  14. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    I've probably taken more oil samples than any single person on this board and maybe more than any two people. I can tell you that it is time consuming when there are no sample fittings and I've seen very few companies that ordered them as options and many more that don't even know they are there when the machine comes with them.
    I buy plastic tubing by the roll and sample bottles by the case. Each sample beginning with pulling a dipstick or level plug takes a minimum of ten minutes by the time the paperwork is filled out. Pulling samples on axles take on average nearly double the time. I've never seen fancy paper work filled out on a computer and the labs around here supply the labels anyway. I don't normally recommend samples outside of an organized maintenance program on a regular schedule. Dealers requesting trade inspections nearly always require me to take oil samples on all compartments.
    With all that being said, extended oil drain intervals are the one place I highly recommend a sample program at the least until a known base line of hours is established where indicators start showing problems with the fluid. In the case of extending hours on construction equipment engines past 250 I've seen many times where there are wear indicators increasing, particularly in the 300 hour range. In the past where a manufacturer has recommended extended oil changes I have made them provide the oil sample bottles as a provision of a sale on a new machine so they can prove their point. Only one has not had a problem with it.
     
  15. Wytruckwrench

    Wytruckwrench Senior Member

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    The local John Deere outside parts salesman just caught me today and told me if I would use their oil and filters I could go to 500 hour oil changes.
    I think if a person has a good maintenance program samples work well. I have found it’s a lot easier to take the sample than it is to do the paperwork and get it sent in correctly. I’m guilty of not taking the time to do the paperwork, then forgetting what it was for.
     
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  16. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    Make him define how they will pay if and when something goes wrong. You might also check the prices of their oils and filters. Maybe they can afford a problem child because of the accrual return on crazy fluid and filter prices. It's a numbers game at that point.
     
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  17. Truck Shop

    Truck Shop Senior Member

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    Well here is one good indicator that I noticed about extended oil change intervals. We run a waste oil heater in winter and the pressure gauge at the pump climbed 15 lbs
    when we went to extended services. I have to cut 150 gals of crank case oil with 50 gals of diesel to drop the pressure down and plugging the nozzle at the burner.
    The soot levels are real high at 30,000 miles. Can't imagine what it's like at manufactures suggested 40,000 mile interval.
     
  18. Tenwheeler

    Tenwheeler Senior Member

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    I thank all previous posts but will add this.
    One company I worked for did oil samples. Coolant showed up on one and it was inframed shortly before warranty ran out. They also stapled coolant test strips to each PM sheet with the results written on the sheet. Tell us again we did not maintain our cooling system and deny warranty.
    Another company had some genie pig BCIII trucks. One was transferred into us with 500,000 miles on it. It maintained the oil level from sensors and added oil from a storage tank. It injected an ounce of oil into the fuel tank on a time schedule. Once an hour or something. Just spin new filters on it every 15,000 miles and fill up the storage tank. We took out the drain plug and a long loose turd came out. Against policy we disabled that. Sometime after the next oil change it was off to Cummins for an inframe. About two weeks after we got it back I received a phone call. THIS UNIT HAS TO COME OFF THE ROAD NOW BECAUSE OF OIL SAMPLE RESULTS!
    Samples have came a long way since BCIII's but I am pretty much in agreement With Truck Shop. If engines and oil are better stretch it out some. How did engines and oil improving make grease last four times as long? How much money was also saved spending a little time under those trucks on a regular basis? Preventive maintenance.
     
  19. Wytruckwrench

    Wytruckwrench Senior Member

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    I’m going to question him about who makes JD filters, and get more info. He said $13 per gallon for 15-40. $12 for hydraulic.
     
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  20. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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