Looking to buy 246B Cat...any advice???

[k45]

Stability is not a published spec per say, but you can pretty much group them into 2 categories: Deere and New Holland, 60% rear/40% front axle wt, and everybody else, 70% rear/30% front. From my experience, the more even distribution and lower center of gravity makes a Deere pretty hard to beat on slopes. A 320 is a 2000# ROC machine w/ 66 hp. You can bump it up another 350# with counterwts, but then you're gonna be butt heavy like a Bobcat.
Another option would be to add solid tires. That gives you a huge amount of extra weight down low without screwing up your balance too bad.

Good information, thanks!

Your comment about rear weights sounds right on. I wonder if they can be mounted in the front for more stability? Or just add some weights to the bucket. Hmmmmm.....

Ken

 

[BruceJ]

Hi LBT,

BruceJ,
Have you thought about renting one for a day, then you can run it through its paces on the turraian you will be working on. A days rental expense is a great way to take one for a good test drive.

Thanks Mate!

Yeah thought bout that but i live in remote area.IE: we only have a BC dealer.
Would have to freight just about any other machine for at least a days road travel. May just find some locals who i could pay for a few hrs use. I kno where a Cat 226 lives but its only 60hp. I spose you get used to wot ya got!?? I found BC fine for most terrain and lift...once you kno limitations you can work within, as long as you dont roll the SS or trash it!!

 

[BruceJ]

Hey Ken,

Good information, thanks!

Your comment about rear weights sounds right on. I wonder if they can be mounted in the front for more stability? Or just add some weights to the bucket. Hmmmmm.....

Ken

I used to bolt some 90lb tractor weights to the back of my BC which worked ok!

 

[BruceJ]

3thirteen,

BruceJ,

I have the Cat Performance Handbook at home now so fire away with questions. I got my copy because I work for a dealer but you might be able to track one down some other way.

Now the hoses usually failed early on, under 500 hrs. Again, Cat had a service letter to address these issues. The pilot hydraulic leaks around 700-2000 hrs. Now, everyone is talking about balance and weight distribution: Cat 246B tipping load is between 1710Kgs (3771 lbs) to 1767Kgs (3896lbs) depending on the bucket. Rated operating capacity is 2000 pounds. I can't find anything regarding balance or center of gravity but I have all the dimensions so it can be calculated.

A 257B was mentioned earlier in the thread. The track machines are great in soft conditions but the 216,226,232,242, 247 and 257B's all run the 3024 engine which is actualy a Perkins. We have seen many of these come in with dusted engines due to the airbox tube coming off. We have also had head gasket issues with the Perkins machines. Something to keep in mind. Let me know if there is anything else you want for specs, etc.

How expensive to do seals for pilots??? The mach im looking at 2 morro has done 750hrs and has warranty(if it covers leaks). So how easy to DIY.? I have mid range mechanic ability(ie: just done up top end of deutz motor etc)..Thanks in advance...BJ

 

[mouse]

Hey guys,
I been running an 863 for near on 2 years with steel Grouser tracks. Had a guy come round to my property with a posi track who said he could not do the anywhere near the hills and mud that i can do.

interesting. if i had only one machine it'd be a tracked one every day of the week and bugger the cost, they are just that much better to operate.

bobcat now do steel tracks as an option for their tracked machines tho i'm pretty sure its not available here as yet.

all feedback i have about the positrack brand of machines suggest that what you posted above is correct but i've not been in one personally. i did watch a cat 277b slip and slide its way everywhere on a pretty gentle grass slope, the grass was pretty long but not overly wet kikyu.

the s220 must be a grey market job, afaik bobcat have never brought them in principally cause i understand the 205 outperforms them in real world. make sure you can get support for the 220 tho i guess most, if not all, of the parts will interchange with the S250.

re balance, i prefer the machine to be balanced loaded, i find the bobcats ok in that regard.

lastly, while not meant to be a plug, i offer both a t190 and s330 for dry hire but if you really want to test either then get yourself here to sydney and i'll let you play on some of my slopes that'll answer any question you have. might cost you a nice bit of slab tho

 

[Tigerotor77W]

I can't find anything regarding balance or center of gravity but I have all the dimensions so it can be calculated.

Unfortunately, you won't be able to calculate the center of gravity unless you have the axle splits... as far as the 60/40 and 70/30 splits go, Cat is pretty accurately 70/30 but the percentage will vary. Some manufacturers will go as light as 75/25!

 

[3thirteen]

Unfortunately, you won't be able to calculate the center of gravity unless you have the axle splits...

By splits do you mean wheel base, weight distribution, axle to axle? I am just curious.

BruceJ,

The the leak is found in the pilot control housing, there was an o-ring that would fail and Cat would replace with an upgraded seal under warranty. Cat warranty stated that the repair was to take 2 hours. Really, it is not a difficult procedure and one could do it themselves without issue. If you would like details I could scan in a copy of the service letter.
This was performed AFTER failure so, don't tear into your pilot controls unless you have a definite leak.

 

[BruceJ]

Hey Mouse..

interesting. if i had only one machine it'd be a tracked one every day of the week and bugger the cost, they are just that much better to operate.

bobcat now do steel tracks as an option for their tracked machines tho i'm pretty sure its not available here as yet.

all feedback i have about the positrack brand of machines suggest that what you posted above is correct but i've not been in one personally. i did watch a cat 277b slip and slide its way everywhere on a pretty gentle grass slope, the grass was pretty long but not overly wet kikyu.

the s220 must be a grey market job, afaik bobcat have never brought them in principally cause i understand the 205 outperforms them in real world. make sure you can get support for the 220 tho i guess most, if not all, of the parts will interchange with the S250.

re balance, i prefer the machine to be balanced loaded, i find the bobcats ok in that regard.

lastly, while not meant to be a plug, i offer both a t190 and s330 for dry hire but if you really want to test either then get yourself here to sydney and i'll let you play on some of my slopes that'll answer any question you have. might cost you a nice bit of slab tho

Thanks for the offer mate! Im up in Bellingen, near Coffs Harbour, so bout 5 hrs away.Still, it pays to be sure.Looked at a nice 246B today which i could pop the Grousers on but that dont help me with the "try before you buy" feel. It felt very responsive compared to S220 (and take awhile to co ord the diff controls) , but the 220 can lift more...hmmmm it will take some thought...and some doin!

 

[Tigerotor77W]

By splits do you mean wheel base, weight distribution, axle to axle? I am just curious.

I mean the amount of weight on each wheel -- sorry about that! The wheelbase is the axle-to-axle definition, and the weight distribution can be calculated from the CG (but there's no simple mathematical way to get to the CG without knowing either component masses or, well, the weight distribution).

 

[Squizzy246B]

I have had 2 of these machines and never had this leaking pilot stuff. Watch the upside down mounted relay for the fuel lift pump...it gets water in it. Never really had any probs in over 5000 hours on two machines. I think I had one leaking o-ring on the pump once and a bit of bad wiring on the ECM relay. We grease daily, service regular and use them well.

The weight distribution of the Cats suits them well to digging and loading trucks.

 

[3thirteen]

I have had 2 of these machines and never had this leaking pilot stuff.

I will clarify this,something I should have done sooner. Reviewing the service letter (Product Support Program) I found the these to be the affected machines.

AFFECTED PRODUCT
Model Identification Number
216B RLL03362-04991
226B MJH05814-06792, 6794-6813, 6815-7455, 7457-8076
232B SCH01638-01986
236B HEN03829-05262
242B BXM02455-02987, 2991-2995, 2999-3372
246B PAT03548-04805
247B MTL02925-04037
248B SCL01387-01818
252B SCP02492-03258, 3260-3306, 3308-3321, 3323-3327, 3329-3551
257B SLK04447-05654, 5656-5997
262B PDT03153-04336
267B CYC01036-01419
268B LBA01350-01675, 1677-1829
277B MDH03683-04875
287B ZSA02823-04153

This o-ring seal in the pilot control valve was replaced under the Service Letter AFTER failure only. The program began December 20, 2006 and ended December 31, 2008. I have personally done three machines that had this issue, two of which were 246B's. Since the program ended we have seen a few others (not all were 246B's though)that had the leaking pilot controls addressed in the Service Letter. That is why I felt it might be somehing to keep an eye out for. If anyone wants more info feel free to PM me. All in all I think the 246B is a great machine.

 

[Squizzy246B]

looking at those dates my 246B was before that although it was a PAT serial number IIRC. It blew an O-ring on the main pump (loader circuit) the day after I got it home from the dealer.....the Cat man came straight out and fixed it pronto. It was badly installed.

 

[BruceJ]

I have had 2 of these machines and never had this leaking pilot stuff. Watch the upside down mounted relay for the fuel lift pump...it gets water in it. Never really had any probs in over 5000 hours on two machines. I think I had one leaking o-ring on the pump once and a bit of bad wiring on the ECM relay. We grease daily, service regular and use them well.

The weight distribution of the Cats suits them well to digging and loading trucks.

Great info Squizzy,
Thanks for that. Thats what this forums all about...relaying experiences in the real world....not just the paper specs or salesmans world.

 

[txbrushbuster]

If you are looking for stability you want the 262B or 268B. The 262B is more trouble free the 268B is Hi-flow. We run steep rough rocky stuff. I run along with S220's and S330's . The Cats climb steeper slopes and rougher terain but the Bobcats have the stronger belly.