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Load line camera

Discussion in 'Cranes' started by Natman, May 2, 2021.

  1. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    If nobody gets hurt it's a good thing.
     
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  2. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    Setting a glue lam beam on a restaurant job. I had good viz, so didn't really need the camera, just glanced at the screen once it was in place and took this pic. Also didn't need a signal person, good thing as there wasn't one, as usual on these small jobs. I have a letter into the backup camera people, telling them of my use and how well it's working, BUT a bit more definition/picture clarity would make it over the top successful. I asked if there is any way I could get the wireless capability, with the clarity of the hard wired version. IMG_20210521_082813222_HDR~2.jpg This pic was from about 65' above

    I also recently worked on a dairy job, setting some 4000 pound steel columns behind some 14' high walls. A signal person this time, but he didn't speak English or know crane signals, so I had to interpret what he was yelling and waving about. NOT making this up or trying to be funny, dealing with this while still maintaining a safe environment is all part of the job, and we did keep it safe, it just slowed the job down, I did anyway, once after getting a guy with a little English to talk with the signaler, telling him when he pointed his finger directly at me from 60' away while standing in the shade and wearing a dark jacket, it was hard to tell if he was telling me "I was the man", or he wanted me to move the load the direction he was pointing. Numerous times I got cabled down like they wanted, and then was told to now move the load another 20', they didn't get the whole winch up/while booming down thing. Or the fact that I don't have a control that moves the load away without raising it up, many don't get it's hard to know how much line to let out while extending the boom when you can't see the load, and how it all depends on how much wrap is on the winch drum. They also wanted me to plumb the beams by sideloading my boom, with 95' of stick out, and that wasn't going to happen. This all took place in 25 mph winds, a hundred yards downwind from a feed lot with a big herd in it. And after a 2 hr drive, with the last 2 miles on a washboard road so rough even going at a walking speed I had things moving that never moved before in the op cab and on the bed. Faster didn't help, tried it. The camera came in handy here, at least by helping me getting over the general area, before the finger pointing started again. They thought the job went great and will be calling me back to set the roof beams, but I'm going to be real busy that day, or broke down, or both.
     
  3. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    A good bellman can help you squirt and hold just fine. Without it THEY are screwed.
     
  4. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    Bellman?? That code or something for signal person? Or a thumb thumper? But do you agree, the rate of rope let down while squirting varies with the amount of rope still on the winch? Doesn't matter that much if they give me some leeway, I can come pretty close to holding it while squirting the boom out or down, but they were cutting it too close, less than 1' above the floor, no viz, lots of wind and noise, and 4 K on the hook. NOT boring, like a lot of truss jobs anyway!
    If I so, I agree, but these guys were having me winch down until the load was a few inches off the floor, and than wanting me to move it in the direction I think they were pointing....., many feet, toward the J bolts, after a few broken English discussions I was able to get the concept across that it would be better to keep the load a few feet higher while I boomed down and cabled up, than stop me when I was "in the ballpark." I still had sight of my headache ball at this point, to help me, once down the last few feet I could only see the line.
     
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  5. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    I got a quick response from this crane camera outfit, located in Taiwan. NOT to be confused with China, I've seen a lot of good stuff come out of there, bike frames and other stuff, so the point of origin is of not much concern to me. They didn't come up on my earlier search, my mistake no doubt, as they are a pretty big time outfit. MUCH better pricing than the other big time crane cameras, $1900.00 or so for a complete system. Part of that is their included solar panel, battery, and mounting system for it all, none of which I would need if I went this route. I need to see if they would cut me a price for just the wireless camera and it's receiver. If so, and IF the picture is more HD than what I have now, I may upgrade, as even my current none HD system has shown me how handy a camera can be for my type of work. I will wait and see if my current supplier responds on my query about a camera upgrade.
    Hello Tom,


    Greetings! My name is Aria, sales specialist at Scarlet Tech. Thank you so much for your interest in APOLLO M1 Wireless Crane Cameras System. Please see the enclosed datasheet for your reference.


    About APOLLO M1 Wireless Crane Camera System

    Apollo M1 is a comprehensive visual assistance designed to improve crane safety and lifting efficiency.

    It has been adapted by flagship crane companies (such as Beaufort Beatty, Uperio, Raimondi, and Liebherr) on their crawler, mobile, and tower cranes.


    For small cranes, I highly recommend the single camera setup as listed below:



    • Wireless Hook-View Camera (Wide-angle downward view from the hook block, support IR night vision)
    • Touchscreen Monitor (Full HD LiveView & video recording)
    • Solar-charged Battery (up to 1 week of continuous work hour


    Price: $1890 USD/set
    Delivery Time:
    2-3 days via DHL express

    Payment Method: Bank Transfer, Credit Card, Paypal (subjects to 2% processing fee)

    Warranty: One-year global warranty. All electrical parts (excluding accessories such as mounting brackets, safety lanyards, cables) can be replaced for free against manufacturer defects.

    Optional Accessories:

    • Wireless Winch-View Camera (up to 4 cameras connection in split screen)
    • 4G Remote Liveview Kit (4G Router & Unlimited iOS/Android app included ➤LIVEVIEW demo)
    If you require any additional information, please do not hesitate to contact me.
    Kind Regards,
    Aria

    WR-3 PLUS Wireless Crane Anemometer
     
  6. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    Just came across this (no work today, cold and very windy), very interesting. I keep thinking of the picture quality of the Go Pro cameras and the drone footage videos, something like that picture quality is what I'm really after. I'll see if I can get a line of communication going with this outfit, but I am unsure what/where their camera transmits, if it could be sent to a screen or it's all just stored digitally.
    https://www.amimon.com/connex-uav-market/
     
  7. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    Bellman = signal person hopefully with great skill
    Yes I do agree holding a load you can't see is pretty much off the hook LOL.
     
  8. Toolslinger

    Toolslinger Member

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    That Apollo looks like a nice package, but it's a hook mount, so the camera is a fish eye view of 114 deg. Their winch view camera is 104 deg, so that's a little better, but it's still pretty wide to use out on the tip of the boom I imagine.
     
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  9. crane operator

    crane operator Senior Member

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    "Bellman" is from the days before radios. Communication when in the blind was actually by a bell. Had to be great with a engine sitting about 4' behind you in a old friction rig.
     
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  10. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    BEFORE radios?? Man that's going back a ways!

    I have shifted gears, and have a new camera and receiver, plus a 10" monitor, all on the way. All HD! The backup camera will be put to other uses so nothing wasted by going down that route at first. The "proof of concept" worked well enough to make me imagine how useful it could be with a better picture quality, and the equipment I have coming in is the best possible in that regard. Still fairly cheap, and my solar power source will still be used so the change over should be quick and easy.

    Total price now, including the solar, battery and misc. is looking like a shade below 2K, so fairly cheap is relative, but this equipment is on a whole different level than the back up camera stuff.https://www.amimon.com/connex-uav-market/connex-mini/
     
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  11. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    I worked around a lot of old farts and we still use the term. Bell is faster than the smoke signals.
     
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  12. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    I am writing this with my home monitor HDMI lead plugged into my newly arrived 10" HD super wazoo 12 VDC monitor, as a test. It is super clear and sharp, as good a pic as my regular 20" monitor, that bodes well for the updated camera system reboot. i had a brief issue with getting some tech support, the antennas they sent for the new transmitter (that the camera plugs into) were meant for drone use, and as such are super light plastic, and I finally got confirmation that I can replace them with more or less standard rubber duckies, that are hard to break as they are flexible. I pulled the "old" back up camera system out today, and by this weekend will have the new system in place. Just an hour or two work. Now that I am a lot more educated on the entire subject of HD cameras and wireless transmitters, way more educated on the topic than when i started this project, I have high hopes it will be very useful, at times.

    Like today....coming back from a truss job, I stopped at a grain mill to pick a couple seed bins off a roof. No one knew signals of course, and I needed to step out of the cab several times and off the rig to eyeball the pick before winching up. Even after i was crudely guided in, hooked up, and told to cable up, when I looked at it I could see that I was 2 or 3' off center, and with tight quarters I sure didn't want it to swing when I lifted it, and even the crude backup camera system was good enough to show when centered up. This new setup would have been great to have online, whereas the previous several truss jobs it wouldn't be needed. If the camera and transmitter lives up to the HD hype, is half as good as this little monitor, it will be a game changer for some jobs, if nothing else a bit of a time saver and stress reliever, an eye in the sky.
     
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  13. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    I finally figured out what I need camera wise, I think, once I realized that I needed to search for something with an HDMI output, (in order to be able to plug it into my wireless transmitter) unlike all the drone cameras I was looking at, which have a USB output, and no you can't get a convertor. I have this arriving Friday, https://www.amazon.com/MOKOSE-Industry-CS-Mount-Teaching-Telephoto/dp/B08QJQ4V45

    HD, and 4 K, whatever that means, good I think! Maybe better than I need but the transmitter and receiver are, I believe, specced to take advantage of a higher quality camera. I don't understand all the optics mumbo jumbo they call out, but I am so far down the rabbit hole that another few bucks for something that sounds a bit better is no big deal. A bit less than 2K, (for everything) I'll add it all up when finished, but around there. The zoom feature.....may be worthless, or may make all the difference. I'll have no way to control it, I will just have to play with it first and once I find the best setting, see if it stays there or if duct tape is needed. This is one of those projects, that by the time it's finished, I'll have it all figured out, but not before.
     
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  14. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    A couple of things: that zoom lens is going to be a bit of a pain in the ass. Any changes you make to it you'll also have to manually focus it which means a bunch of dinking around.
    The other and much more concerning thing is weather, that lens camera combo is not at all weather rated.
    I have a similar little telephoto POE camera here that I play with and it does pull in a nice image from a distance.
     
  15. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    I'm hoping I can get a mild zoom effect, and anything I'd be looking at would be in focus, call it the infinity setting. I anticipate some fooling with it to achieve anything, and then one I hit a happy medium, if the settings don't stay fixed, duct tape will help.

    Yup, not weather proof, I think I can cobble something up, a mini umbrella of sorts, above it to help out, driving in rain may require pulling the camera, (2 electrical quick disconnects, and a splice in the square tube the camera is mounted to, with a pip pin, it'd take 20 seconds to remove) or a zip lock bag. Possibly wrap it in plastic all the time, with the lens free of course, would suffice. It's parked inside at least. Once I see what the picture looks like, if good enough to be real handy, it may be worth just buying a camera now and then, a lesser version can be had for quite a bit less then $100.00, if the zoom feature proves worthless.

    A backup plan is to get a outdoor camera from the same outfit that makes the transmitter and receiver, they do offer one, but I didn't know that until I ordered what I have and it arrived. And my setup may deliver better picture quality, costs less by several hundred dollars, so replacing a camera now and then may not be a deal breaker.
     
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  16. muzy

    muzy Well-Known Member

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    cha-ching , cha=Ching , cha-Ching..:D
     
  17. skyking1

    skyking1 Senior Member

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    Fly on over and get me and I will help you with it one weekend :)
    The focus on those little telephotos are touchy. I suggest setting it up while pointing the camera horizontally at a measured target at ~100' range. That should work fine when you get it on the boom.
     
  18. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    I'm using antennas not designed for this, proper ones are on the way, but it's working! On this credit union job last week, lifting trusses with a Connex in the way, it proved handy. NOT at all critically needed, just handy. After the first pick, my LMI told me where to drop the hook of course, where the camera cam in handy was when I could see them rig me and start to walk back into my POV, or not. Not sitting there blind and waiting was nice, waiting and being able to see they were talking with a third person (also out of my view, without the camera) thus the delay was, handy.

    When setting the trusses behind a parapet wall, my LMI again got me dialed into setting them more or less 24" further and further away, but they didn't tell me one batch of trusses were on 12" centers, and doubled up (kept it a secret, like the crew last week who didn't mention the trusses cantilevered 8' out from the top plate) and the camera made sense out of what was confusing me, as my LMI was telling me I had just set the last truss at the same radius. Poor to no signaling, as often happens, it helps a lot. Not quite ready for prime time yet though, besides the antenna I am still fooling with the camera POV, and learning how to set up the 10" monitor, which is smarter than I am.
     
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  19. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    forgot the pic IMG_20210611_104321508.jpg
     
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  20. Natman

    Natman Senior Member

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    Skyking was correct, my first camera with the manual telephoto was too IMG_20210629_103633687_HDR.jpg touchy re; focus. I fooled with it enough (hard to do when the boom is up in the air, I needed to have someone up on a roof right at the boom tip, and on the phone with me to get it dialed in maybe) but before I managed to do that, I found another simpler camera and just used it for the first time today: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BZPDRTS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 It's depth of field seems to be much more forgiving, though I was surprised to see it still had a manual focus ring, , was hoping it fixed, but once I hit the best compromise on my average boom tip heights, some electrical tape will hold that position. This is the monitor I havhttps://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B076GZVCP2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1e, and it is working great right out of the box, and I still haven't fine tuned it. I figured the high quality transmitter and receiver deserved a high quality monitor.

    The first job after I installed this camera was this morning, and I got there early and the home owner and his crew got there late, but I was still able to easily drop the hook on the other side of the house (working blind) some 63' away, I was even able to winch down to the right height, watching it's shadow helped. I purposely dropped it a bit off center to make it easier to reach. After I got it rigged, one guy showed up, and I IMG_20210629_103410872_HDR.jpg told him to wave his arms when he was ready. This is exactly the type of job making this camera worth while, working with no signaler on odd ball jobs. I picked it, swung 20', boomed down/cabled up, until he waved to me to stop, it was a huge help. Not as sharp a picture as it will be, but much better then my wireless backup camera ever was, and this will get better once I fine tune it.

    Here's the price breakdown, best as I recall it:
    transmitter and receiver $1450.00
    battery, solar panel and controller, electrical J box and misc. switches/wiring $150.00
    Camera $110.00
    Monitor $130.00 Total of $1840.00, we will not figure the cost of the first camera, $185.00, because I say so (I'll sell it on eBay for $50.00, paid $185.00 for it, all part of the education on how to do it right) IF I had to do it again, I would MAYBE go with this outfit, About APOLLO M1 Wireless Crane Camera System, for $1890 (plus shipping) but I was never able to talk to anyone, or get any idea how their specs compared to the high tech Amimon system. Also, I like the way my transmitter is separate from the camera, not all one unit. I consider the camera itself almost a disposable part of the system, some sub $100.00 ones may be all I really need. Amimon also has an all in one unit, but it's $2600.00 and I think my monitor is better. Typical do it yourself project, I made some mistakes, wasted some money getting the wrong thing, but for less than 2 grand I have want I want and can take credit for doing it myself, for better or for worse.
     
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