JCB Skid Steer

[KSSS]

so if you dont get the multifunction joystick, how do you control your auxiliary hydraulics? is it still a button on the joystick? like bobcat? it doesnt sound like i would have any use for a multifunction because none of my attachments have more than one hydraulic cylinder on them. well discovering the differences between control systems has been a long process for me. i wouldn't wanna use pilot and servo interchangeably. for example, the standard case is mechanically servo controlled, h pattern. and for 2200 dollars you can get pilot controlled servos. with the case servo controls, you cant get the iso pattern. with the case pilot controls, you can get either h or iso pattern. i have never heard of a mechanically servo controlled machine of any brand with iso controls. (well the gehl iso t bar is the closest) the question is Y is everyone going to electric controls. is it cheaper to build? i doubt cheaper to maintain? just because that is the in thing to be doing? more efficient? the only thing i can think of is with pilot controls (unlike servo controls) you dont have full control response at low rpms. and in cold weather they can be problematic? this would be overcome by electric servos. maybe you get less of a lag time with electric? from what i understand with servo controls you can still feel your machine (not as much as bobcats manual controls). and i hear you can barely feel your machine with pilots. obviously nothing with electric. so if i could choose a jcb with pilots or electric joysticks, what would i want?

There are several reasons for E/H controls. Electronic control of the engine mostly to help meet tier levels and the fact that there is so much you can do with the control system once you go E/H. You can now control response of the machine's functions, the ground speed of the machine, pattern changing, with E/H you can give the operator max. control of the machine. Pilots don't give you near that kind of flexibility. Putting E/H in a skid steer has been challenging for all those that have done it. CAT, Deere, and BC have had their growing pains with E/H. Pilots are much easier to get right and less to go wrong it seems. With E/H trouble shooting these will be a dealer only deal I think.

 

[dave esterns]

i talked to the local jcb company rep today. he said jcb is going to have pilots on their skid steers till 2012. then they are going e/h for the tier 4 emissions, and they are going to offer all 3 skid steer patterns on their machine with the flip of a switch if that is what you want. the current pilots are only available iso. i like the idea of buying one of these pilot controlled machines while i still can. since i am an owner operator, none of the e/h provides any benefit for me. im kinda impressed e/h is more expensive than pilot, cuz with pilot you actually get serious hardware. they say the jcbs are supposed to be a little less expensive than a bobcat. the neighbor has 12,000 hours on his sjc a300 bobcat so it seems possible to get electric right.

 

[HRJR]

I have operated a New Holland skid steer since 1978,-775's (2),785's (3) 885 still have, 175 track,still have. Went to kentucky this fall to the expo. Looked at deere, kubota, jcb. I have been fed up with the reliablity of the newer new hollands. Looked at the bobcats too. I would like to have a new A770 bobcat. But I will say this After running the new kubota I was impressed, then jcb invited me to one of their dealer mechinics (can't spell) school. I got to run some of their new machines. Looked at the ease of service. Without having price comparing and the poor quality that has been coming out of new holland. I would say that the new jcb beats them all. with kubota a tight second and bobcat coming in at a tight third. I have been a diehard new holland fan for a long time, but they are falling behind. Even their new case/new holland models leave a lot to be desired. Then I hear fiat has cnh up for sale. trying to unload. Figures- fiat get's rid of ford, brings in their fiat line then dumps it all. Think that happened before,many years ago with fiatallis. Anybody else remember that one? I for one am not happy about it, so I will be looking at another brand

 

[dave esterns]

is bobcats aws model that popular? i never see many around, yet bobcat seems to offer it in a lot of models. the one question i have is how come takeuchi seems to be the only ctl with planetary reduction on their drives? doesn't this kinda put them in a class by themselves, the class that you would want to be in? i cant figure out how there are so many companies making ctls and they dont feel like they have to compete with takeuchi. also, takeuchi doesnt seem to feel like they have to compete with anyone else either. no vertical lift, not different control options, no size comparison, no track suspension system, etc. i can see y they dont want to go with a track suspension, but i find this all interesting. i have never figured out what fiats strategy is. it seems they have had their hands in everything over the years. y is it necessary for everyone to be buying and selling everything anyway? i like how john deere, honda, and toyota have never really been into doing such things.

 

[farmerleach]

From what I have read about Fiat and the CNH line, this is what I have learned. Fiat has or is going to split their company into two entities. One will be focused on the auto industry and the other on the construction and Ag industries. Fiat wants to be a major player in the Auto industry, globally and apparently splitting the company will help the do this some how. There has also been talk of AGCO purchasing CNH from Fiat, which from what I have read and been told by dealers, won't happen.

 

[JCBiron]

There has also been talk of AGCO purchasing CNH from Fiat, which from what I have read and been told by dealers, won't happen.

God help us all!!! I really don't think that would ever happen, but it is sure a scary thought....

 

[ctheddy]

Balance is good. Keep it full of fuel as it is part of the counter weight. Mine didn't handle dry dusty situations well as it blew up at 400 hours so keep filters clean. They may have corrected this by now. The side exit is priceless for many reasons aside from emergency escape. Can't remember ever slipping getting in or out of mine. Still have bruised ribs from my cat last week,my Bocat isn't much better lol. Loved my jcb but have to say cat and bocat have prove to be much easier to work on and a lot more reliable.

 

[dave esterns]

jcb stole cat and bobcat engineers to design their new one.

 

[Digdeep]

jcb stole cat and bobcat engineers to design their new one.

Do you realize how ridiculous your comment is? You've been rambling on and on about how great a company JCB is along with all the merits of their skid steers, especially now that they're built in the US, and then you make a comment touting how JCB stole engineers from CAT and Bobcat to design their new skid steer. First off, engineers leave companies and go to work other places day in and day out. Secondly, to say that they had to "steal engineers" to make a good one sure validates many of the poster's previous comments on the skid steers previous quality that you so strongly championed. Did JCB steal any NASCAR or Drag Racing engineers to set the land speed record with their diesel dragster?

 

[dave esterns]

ha ha i will comment on this later...

 

[dave esterns]

Ok. Well, first of all, I hate everything about skid steers in general. If it was up to me I would never own one. They are weak, don’t lift very high, and you NEVER have enough traction. Traction is always a problem and a huge inconvenience, and the costs associated with a ctl is prohibitive at best. And since when is skidding tires an efficient way to turn anyway? Skid steers are slow, bumpy, up till now just a pain to run with loud cabs and nothing to make driving enjoyable. Skid steers were made to replace a shovel, and that is still what they do, and yes they have their place. That said, skid steers are a necessary evil that comes with our farming operation. Some genius back in the day built the entire farm around the skid steer. If it were up to me I would have lots of room to drive around and I would have probably a loader tractor. I would have 4wd fluid in the tires, maybe chains, wheel weights, and around 100 hp. That would be sweet, and I could use it when we are short on tractors during haying season. Either that or a jcb endloader or a jcb agricultural telehandler, their telehandlers really look like nice machines. So my biggest problem with people is when the original poster said he was looking at purchasing one, people came out of the woodwork to tell about how crappy, unbalanced, and problematic the robots were. Granted, I do not have much experience with jcb equipment yet, but honestly people, go anywhere else in the world and saying jcb would be just like saying john deere in this country. They are not going to have an inferior product, not to mention the robot has been on the market for decades now. I believe my words earlier were that I had respect for the older jcb skids, but now with their newer ones they have my attention. Now it is true that the robot is a European machine, and in Europe they are not that into skid steers, which I commend them for, because they are aware articulated loaders, loader tractors, and telehandlers make more sense. So the europeans don’t know what americans want in their skid steers, so it doesn’t really make sense for europeans do design it, not to mention lots of people probably did not want to move to the US. Now when I commented that jcb stole engineers from cat and bobcat, that was kinda a figure of speech. They did not literally break into the bobcat plant and kidnap bobcat engineers. Jcb likely got a list of some of the best engineers in the US, and called them and offered them a job with jcb. Its what companies do, they fight over the best engineers. You don’t get a good engineer by posting a job listing, you get a good engineer by going out and finding the best ones and offering them a better package than what they currently have. Hyundai, the automobile division, just picked up one of audis engineers to help in designing their new sonata, and if you look up the new sonata you can see where it is more audi like and less hyunda like. So jcb wanted good engineers to design a sweet skid steer around the good ideas jcb already had. The monoboom, the side entry, and the dieselmax. The safety factor is also huge but nobody seems to care about that either. That is what sets the jcb apart from other skid steers, not the rest of the skid steer that say a bobcat engineer could throw together. So tell the bobcat and cat engineers to make a good machine around the already good jcb ideas. Jcb already did a lot of the work, they just wanted someone who knew how to finish it off the American way. As far as the land speed record, yes i would imagine they would have had engineers outside of jcb working on that too. And I like how nobody gives credit to jcb for being the ONLY company in the WORLD who is pulling off final emmision requirements without using aftertreatment! How is this not hugely significant? Cat simply refused to meet emissions and just paid the fines, and then eventually quit making certain engines. If I was designing a machine, I see jcb as the only option for an engine to install. Best fuel economy, and no need for urea. I want a pickup with a jcb engine, im sure everyone is aware of the poor fuel economy and urea using new pickups. As far as the dieselmax and the land speed record…I have heard that recaro was in on the designing of the dieselmax, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they were in on the land speed record either.

 

[Digdeep]

?????????????????????????

 

[KSSS]

Dave,

There is a guy named Gravel Rat on another dirt moving forum. You guys have a lot in common.

 

[barklee]

Let em have it Dave!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Bet your up to typing 60 words a minute!! Very well said!

 

[dave esterns]

ah yes. my writings might not be compositionally correct because of time constraints, but i think the point gets across. ah its actually ricardo not ricaro who was in on the dieselmax and the land speed record. ricardo is who literally everyone turns to when they cant do it themselves.
http://www.ricardo.com/en-gb/

 

[Digdeep]

Dave...I admire your passion...although I've never longed for a paragraph break until I started reading your posts.

 

[digsalot]

Looking into buying the 2011 260T any one checked them out demo or anything?

 

[dave esterns]

what would you like to know?

 

[digsalot]

Well, cost? Reliability? Performance? I have had some experiance with JCB over the years,
and not impresed at all. So the new Vision looks awsome but will it hold up?

 

[barklee]

definitley sharp looking! Specs are pretty good too