1. Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!
  2. ALL NEW MEMBERS READ THIS FIRST!! Thank you for joining Heavy Equipment Forums! If you are new to forums we communicate with "Threads", please search our threads to see if your topic may have already been answered and if not then click "Post New Thread" in the appropriate forum. This will allow all of our members to see your question and give you the best chance to be answered. After you've made a number of posts you will graduate to Full Member status where you'll see a few more privileges. Following these guidelines will help make this the best resource for heavy equipment on the net. Thanks for joining us and I hope you enjoy your stay!!

Hydraulic cylinders dump truck.

Discussion in 'Trucks' started by Willie B, Jan 23, 2022.

  1. Willie B

    Willie B Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,494
    Occupation:
    Electrician
    Location:
    Mount Tabor VT
    My Heil dump body, probably built 1975 has two stage hydraulic cylinders. The part number is AID or ALD 2039-1
    In dumped position it does not leak & would stay up months. In down position it leaks out the breather. I'm of the belief the pressure seals the piston, but when pressure is released, it seeps past the piston.

    Hydraulic repair shops are understaffed, overloaded with work. The wait seems forever. Most promising is a shop in next state, a one man shop. He makes promised of "a few weeks turnaround". I think I can handle the rebuild, but a seal kit is at best a maybe.

    I googled it, Found a company Allegany York, they offer a kit for Heil cylinders. Surely, there is more than one variety cylinder for Heil dump bodies? Could it be? The seal kit RH-K272-4893 Faceless.jpg
     
  2. Old Doug

    Old Doug Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2013
    Messages:
    3,344
    Location:
    Mo
    I have good luck just taking the seals to a place that rebuilds cylinders they can match most any thing up.
     
    Delmer likes this.
  3. Labparamour

    Labparamour Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2013
    Messages:
    631
    Location:
    Washington
    Agree.
    Several hydraulic hose/cylinder shops have helped me with seals and packing for an old Melroe bobcat hoe and a Deere cylinder packing, wiper seals, etc.
     
  4. Tenwheeler

    Tenwheeler Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    830
    Location:
    Georgia
    Look into Hercules sealing products and the Red Book. I would take them apart. Measure and order the seals. Hopefully that matches your part number. No telling if those cylinders were replaced over the years.
     
    Jonas302 likes this.
  5. SoCoHyd

    SoCoHyd Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Houston
    How much oil is leaking out ? unless its a considerable amount, I wouldn't even worry about it. if you think it's just the bleeder then remove the bleeder and change it out. no need to pull the cylinder and have it resealed because of a bleeder. But considering you said that it doesn't leak down at all when in the up position then it's most likely not the bleeder.
    you might just be confusing oil accumulation on the rods and caps as an oil leak from the bleeder. Telescopic cylinders allow for a film of oil to accumulate.
    of course I can't confirm this without seeing it
    but for some piece of mind here is a quote from a reference guide on telescopic cylinders provided by Hercules Sealing Products

    "A damp to light film of oil on each plunger or stage of a telescopic cylinder indicates good cylinder operation. After many cycles of the cylinder, a small accumulation of oil may be noticed on the plungers or sleeves at the head nuts. This should not be mistaken for packing leakage. Cylinder should be free of entrapped air. It is advisable to bleed air from cylinder weekly for a smooth operation."

    this quote, along with other information, can be found @ this link. click on the "Technical Information" tab which will open a PDF and it will be on page 7 of the PDF (page number of the article will say 559) https://www.herculesus.com/page.php?name=Reference-Guides&id=306

    here's the direct link to the PDF although im not sure if this link will work. chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/viewer.html?pdfurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.herculesus.com%2Foracle%2Ffiles%2Freference-charts%2FTech.pdf&clen=845279&chunk=true
     
    DB2 and 59 North like this.
  6. SoCoHyd

    SoCoHyd Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Houston
    If you still feel like your cylinder needs to be taken to a shop to be resealed be wary of what they will charge you for reseal/repair. I wouldn't pay more than $1000 to repair a 2 stage telescopic cylinder.
    If its a generic cylinder with no extra features you can most likely buy it brand new anywhere from $1200-$1800

    here are some options. https://www.baileyhydraulics.com/pr...escopic?order=onlinecustomerprice:asc&show=48
     
    Jonas302 likes this.
  7. Willie B

    Willie B Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,494
    Occupation:
    Electrician
    Location:
    Mount Tabor VT
    Leakage is perhaps a pint from each after being dumped. I generally leave it parked body up to drain rain or melting snow. No leakage. Leakage happens body down at rest. When I tow, I can't raise the body, so it leaks.

    The above mentioned seal kits are described as being for Heil cylinders. I'm perplexed at a kit so non specific.

    How does one bleed air from a cylinder? How does air get in? I expect air above the piston, but below is perplexing.

    No, the site wouldn't open.
     
  8. SoCoHyd

    SoCoHyd Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Houston
    oh well that definitely sounds like a leak and not just a "light film of oil" haha.
    I'm pretty sure that cylinder part number you gave that starts with "2" indicates it's the "old style" Heil telescopic cylinder which means this cylinder is going to have "vee packing." Vee packing reacts to pressure so you're right on the money when you were talking about leakage when pressure is released.
    Before you pull the cylinders you might try tightening the 2 gland caps with a pipe wrench and run it up and down a few times. If that doesn't work then pull the cylinders and do the reseals

    Air can get in these telescopic cylinder from the negative pressure they produce when retracting as well as when they are being installed after a reseal. It should have a breather at the rod eye. it will most likely be a bolt that you would loosen until oil starts coming out.
     
    Tenwheeler likes this.
  9. SoCoHyd

    SoCoHyd Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Houston
    Can I ask how you determined that seal kit part number ?
    I just took a look at the seal kit number you gave and it shows that the seals in this kit are "u-seals" as opposed to "vee packing"
    I don't think Allegheny sell kits for Heil Dump Truck Cylinders. I think the seal kit number you gave is for a telescopic cylinder off a Heil Refuse Truck.
    Another reason I think its Vee packing is due to the age of the truck as well as I've found vee packing to be the norm in Dump truck cylinders
    I would call Allegheny and make sure the kit is for a dump truck cylinder
    If it is Vee Packing
    Hercules Sealing products has Heil Vee packing kits
    https://www.herculesus.com/product.php?name=Special Heil Telescopic Vee Sets&cat=16530
    part number for the 3 -1/4 " stage is "HL26A2039"
    part number for the 4" stage is "HL40004X184"

    I hope I was able to help and if not good luck !
     
  10. Willie B

    Willie B Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,494
    Occupation:
    Electrician
    Location:
    Mount Tabor VT
    Thank you so much for your contributions. The Allegheny website brings up this part number when I googled the cylinder part number. I'm not convinced these will fit. Website says $190 per, but I Emailed them, she says $80 per.
     
  11. materthegreater

    materthegreater Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2012
    Messages:
    235
    Location:
    VT
    Willie, how did this turn out?

    In testing my dump hinges today, I discovered that the "not leaking" used cylinder I bought leaks oil out almost as fast as the pump can get it in there. So it looks like I'll be tearing the cylinder apart and trying to find the problem.
     
  12. Willie B

    Willie B Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,494
    Occupation:
    Electrician
    Location:
    Mount Tabor VT
    The valve used is not the detent style that locks in the down position. Put a bungee cord on the handle to hold it in down position. It no longer leaks.
     
  13. 56wrench

    56wrench Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,433
    Location:
    alberta
    I never store a truck with the hoist in the raised position because it exposes the cylinder to dust, rain etc. i only raise it about 1 or 2 feet, enough to let moisture drain out of the box. Dirt and moisture can work their way through the wiper as it is lowered as well as the upper stage/stages can rust if left exposed if the wiper is doing its job
     
    doublewide likes this.
  14. materthegreater

    materthegreater Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2012
    Messages:
    235
    Location:
    VT
    Sounds like an easier fix than mine will be!