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how to make a living starting small

DoyleX

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2013
Messages
571
Location
Minnesota
Occupation
Lever Puller, Gear Jammer, Pipe Twister
The thing is you can have the best business plan, all the equipment and piles of money. But i you do not have the skills/talent to efficiently/safely complete a project and do it right your time is short lived. There is a lot of things in this trade that are only learned first hand.
 

dirthog

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2006
Messages
393
Location
central pa
Occupation
heavy equipment mechanic
Not sure about your area but even the bigger operations around here have all the equipment they need and rent next to nothing from the small guys. They used to hire out some of the seeding and such but now they are even doing that themselves.
 

thetabop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
59
Location
Victoria
In my state there seems to be about 5 general contractors looking for smaller owner operators.
And I know what you mean DoyleX, I'm working with the Dozer every day on our farm, forever learning! :)
 

CM1995

Administrator
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Messages
13,246
Location
Alabama
Occupation
Running what I brung and taking what I win
In my area the projects are so competitive that the GC's don't have the appetite for hourly work and only want a hard number for the job, which I don't blame them. All the large civil contractors have taken pretty much everything in house to keep their guys busy as well.
 

thetabop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
59
Location
Victoria
I cant yet really comment on that aspect of the competition here, but from what I can tell it isn't as bad as it seems to be where you work.

Was just talking to a GC on a phone a couple of minutes ago, about registering with them, and they were very interested in hiring me, and quoted some average hourly rates and indicated a couple of jobs in my area.
 

CM1995

Administrator
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Messages
13,246
Location
Alabama
Occupation
Running what I brung and taking what I win
Was just talking to a GC on a phone a couple of minutes ago, about registering with them, and they were very interested in hiring me, and quoted some average hourly rates and indicated a couple of jobs in my area.

Good deal!:thumbsup Your first step is to get your name out there and get someone to give you a chance to do a job.;)
 

monster76

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2013
Messages
526
Location
Miami Fl
Occupation
Contractor
In my area the projects are so competitive that the GC's don't have the appetite for hourly work and only want a hard number for the job, which I don't blame them. All the large civil contractors have taken pretty much everything in house to keep their guys busy as well.

thats pretty much how it is here. they dont want to hear the cost of an hour they want one price and that is it
 

Acivil

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
154
Location
Tennessee
I wonder if hourly vs hard bid is a cultural/market difference I never work hourly unless its on a custom project with no drawings. @DoyleX I couldn't agree with you more. I have never heard of a successful investor/business person entering this industry as a contractor, just because they think the return on investment is good. Every contractor I know is interested in/in love with the technical side of the business, which poses some interesting challenges for the typical contractor business model as a whole. I don't know any contractors who enjoy invoicing, or hammering out job costing to find their critical indicators :bash I see it all as being critical.
 

thetabop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
59
Location
Victoria
I agree with you acivil, but at first ill only want hourly jobs, cuz being able to quote accurately takes time and practice
 

Lindsey97

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
173
Location
oklahoma
Also having someone to update/maintain a website is important. I'm currently having that problem. I don't speak computer!
 

joispoi

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
1,284
Location
Connecticut
Make sure that the GC's that you're looking to work for don't owe money to other subs. It's better to avoid those guys before they owe you money and decide that it's time for them to avoid you.
 

thetabop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
59
Location
Victoria
The main GCs that i'm signing up with are the 4 biggest in the state, pretty sure they should be trust worthy, but what you say is good advice, thanks :)
 

rsherril

Senior Member
Joined
May 2, 2009
Messages
264
Location
Far West Colorado
Occupation
Geologist, Retired from teaching sciences
Business consultants strongly suggest that you come up with a realistic "Exit Plan" right along with your "Entry Plan". Think about it, then write it down. Financial institutions cover their bets and so should you. "Too big to fail" doesn't work for most of us.
 

Acivil

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
154
Location
Tennessee
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with hourly work, on the contrary I think it's the best variety of work a contractor can get- there's very limited risk associated with it... I would do nothing but hourly work if I could make the stars line up enough to keep it all the time. Also, I wouldn't necessarily say the biggest contractors are slow payers, I am aware of one of the largest retail builders in the world that will pay you within 48 hrs of invoicing if you are willing to give a 6% discount, but you definitely MUST have your paperwork/documentation in order or things can get rough.

@Lindsey97 I don't really speak computer either, but I recently learned to set up sites... it can be done in about 5 minutes by someone fairly computer illiterate. I use Godaddy.com, with a wordpress.org based site hosted on godaddy's linux hosting plan. You can sign up online, then call their customer support and they'll take you through it step by step on the phone, just tell them you want to set up wordpress for your domain, then start adding wordpress plugins (free programs that serve pretty much any function under the sun) through the wordpress dashboard (which tech support will help you set up) and it's pretty much plug and play from there.
 
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kshansen

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2012
Messages
11,127
Location
Central New York, USA
Occupation
Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
Also, I wouldn't necessarily say the biggest contractors are slow payers, I am aware of one of the largest retail builders in the world that will pay you within 48 hrs of invoicing if you are willing to give a 6% discount,.

That's how the company where I work was, so when I had to have a small machine shop or other business do work for us I would advise them to put something on the invoice saying: "Less 10% net 30 days" then told them to just raise the price 10%. Might be a little crooked to some but both parties involved felt they got a good deal. Otherwise payment took 90+ days. I don't know if the company still works this way, but I think 90+ days is the minimum now. That is unless you owe them something then it's COD!
 

thetabop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
59
Location
Victoria
im reading through the contract for one of the GCs, and it has some stuff in there that seems pretty bad to me, like if a customer doesnt pay in 90 days, or states he wont pay, or goes bankrupt or for any other reason hasnt payed the full amount in 90 days i have to purchase the debt from the GC.

on top of that it has a clause that states that i will never do any work at all for any customer that has been introduced to me by the GC, and that this clause survives the termination or expiry of this contract. in other words if i work for them long enough i would not be able to do basically any work anywhere on my own with out getting the job from the GC, i would effectivly remove any chance of making my own company in the future, because half of the pontential customers in the state had already had service from me, through the GC

this sound normal to you guys?

actually i reread, and it says 'for the restraint period' with no mention of how long that is
 
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CM1995

Administrator
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Messages
13,246
Location
Alabama
Occupation
Running what I brung and taking what I win
The first one yes, "paid when paid" is standard boiler plate.

The second, no I haven't seen that one. I don't know what the laws are in AUS. but that clause wouldn't stand up in court here.
 
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