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How is the John Deere 4024 engine? Reliable?

Discussion in 'Agricultural Equipment' started by Parts, Jan 16, 2022.

  1. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    Sort of a broad question but how is the Deere 4024 engine been for folks? I see them in all sorts of machines but I've never had my hands on one (as far as I remember). Good little engine or stay away?
     
  2. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    My recommendation would be to stay away. And that is for both the mechanical and electronic 4024 - 5030 engines.
     
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  3. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. Thats a shame because I see some nice machines with a 4024 lurking under the hood. Now my curiosity is piqued and would love to know more. What are the main things that make the 4024 less desirable?
     
  4. heymccall

    heymccall Senior Member

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    I've got 4014 motors. No issues to speak of.
     
  5. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Yes, considering the number of those engines that are out on the market the majority have been running without issues.
    You are one of the lucky ones. We have a customer with 100 Sullivan Paletek air compressors with that engine and we have seen aproximately 50 of them with issues. He had since started unloading them and is buying compressors with a different engine.

    Mechanical engines:
    When those engines first came out we thought it was about time Deere built a smaller diesel. Within months of the introduction we were seeing multitudes of injection pump failures. I myself have been into over 100 of them either replacing injection pump springs or the pumps themselves. Some of those spring failures caused the injection pump lifter to lift far enough out of the bore to disengage from the key in the block and spin which then ended up ruining the block. Then we started seeing injector issues with the little washer under the injector crushing and then losing it's sealing ability allowing compression into the crankcase (hard starting/blowby issues). Then we moved on to timing gear cover leaks and water pump leaks. Those items are fixable and can be made to be reliable. Since I have done so many of those repairs I came up with a solution that works better than the Deere solution. Then move on to aging engines. we saw a fair share of (again fixable) fuel return line check valve failures which makes for difficult starting. From that some customers starting using ether. Then we started seeing cam gears that spin on the cam (they are not keyed) and consequently causing the valves to contact the pistons bending the pushrods. Then we were getting a rash of injection pump cold start issues with the cold start thermostat (uses oil pressure to change injection timing). On top of all this there were many running issues due to the pumps not being synchronized correctly causing exhaust flutter, irregular running, cold start misfire, hard starting and what we call a machine gun hunt (which is a very rapidly changing engine rpm) which only happened in the 5030's. We also saw many rack issues with the injection system as well as the rack magnet displacing causing limited rack movement causing hard starting and if you could get it started it would only rev to about 1/2 throttle. Shall I go on?

    Electronic engines:
    We thought, finally getting rid of the mechanical injection pump issues, yay! NOT! The issues we have seen with the electronic engines, while fewer, were still a black eye on Deere. Cam gear spin is still an issue. We have one in the shop right now with that issue. Hard starting is the biggest issue with the electronic engine. Causes have been spread out. Fuel return check valves are still an issue. Slow cranking causing erroneous cam sensor readings making hard starting. Customers using 15W-40 oil which can make hard starting (I only recommend 0W-40 synthetic). Injector failures. And the biggie is injection pump failures again. We have had quite a few with this issue and are starting to see more as they age. I just had one 2 weeks ago with hard starting and that one was the injection pumps. They wear prematurely, enough so that air can get into the fuel system through the pump plungers causing what simulates bleed back of the fuel.

    There is a reason Deere stopped manufacturing this engine. And as far as replacement, you can no longer buy a complete engine, just long blocks. All the rest of the parts are still available however.....for now.

    So from my end working at a dealer and seeing an endless supply of work from these engines I am a little skewed in my opinion of them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2022
  6. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    Thanks so much. I didn't expect such detail but I do appreciate it. We were looking at some compressors as well as other machines with that engine and I think we'll slowly walk back lol

     
  7. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    You talk of it like it is a past product, what did they replace it with?
     
  8. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Deere stopped building that engine a few years back. The last Deere product with that engine was the "D" series skid steer loader. When they went to the
    "E" series they went back to Yanmar engines. For OEM applications (Deere engines in non-Deere products), if you want a smaller engine Deere builds and supplies a 3029 which is basically the 4045 platform but with 3 cylinders.
     
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  9. heymccall

    heymccall Senior Member

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    My only issue with them was the fuel system. Once I upgraded the filter setup, I've never had a pump or injector issue.
    BTW, running one at 4k rpm, on a Godwin pump, will outrun the cooling capacity.
     
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  10. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    I like the Yanmar engines. Seen many of them run ridiculous hours and never miss a beat. TPG does not seem to like the cockamamie injection pump on them, but they seem to work OK most of the time.
     
  11. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Me too, however we are starting to see injector issues with the FT4 engines at around 1500-2500 hrs.
     
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  12. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    Let me rephrase that. I like the Yanmar mechanical engines they still make. 1.6 liter and below get a free pass and are still "Final Tier 4". I do not know of anybody who has a T4 generator, yet. We always tell them to stay with the small mechanicals, or else use propane when running above that power level.
     
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  13. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    Well I got one in the shop today. Compressor motor. Starts like a dream, revs like a dream, no smoke, no silly sounds....but under load it won't idle. If you set it at 100psi and run it at idle the engine will pick up a slight shimmy (not anything insane) but just enough to shut her off. If you set it at 50psi or something lower it will sit there and idle all day long and it will run full throttle just find as well. Everything on the air side seems to be working fine. It makes me think I have an idle fuel starvation issue (possibly filter or lift pump?) or the idle needs to be raised a hair. I didn't want to start turning idle screws on the pump without reaching out to the experts first - please let me know if making an adjustment on idle screw would be a good place to start. Engine is 2011 vintage I believe and only about 1500 hours.
     
  14. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Electronic or mechanical injection?
    What brand of compressor?
    Engine serial number?
    Start with a fuel pressure check. Spec depends on the first question.
     
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  15. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    I will check for sure this week - we're having a concrete pad poured so machines are scattered until its poured/flat/cured.

    From memory its an Atlas Copco and I didn't check to see if mechanical or not but I didn't see much electrical and its only a 2011 so I think mechanical. Would a fuel pressure tester installed in the outlet line on the lift pump give accurate pressure data to us? I think I could probably splice one in pretty close to the lift pump outlet.
     
  16. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Tee into the fuel filter outlet.
     
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  17. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    Just got back to this machine and found it is mechanically injected. I only see a lift pump to fuel filter to the side of the block fuel fitting - don't see any ECM. The injection pump is inside the timing case? Does that tell you enough to know its mechanically injected? I will tee in post filter tomorrow - what PSI am I looking for at around half load (best I can probably get considering the air end will be spinning but I have it turned down to minimal PSI so as to not kill the engine).
     
  18. mg2361

    mg2361 Senior Member

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    Did you get the engine serial number?

    If it is mechanical, you want 10 psi minimum.

    Under the valve cover.
     
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  19. Parts

    Parts Well-Known Member

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    I took a picture of the side of valve cover tag like a dummy. I need to get the esn pic still. So right now I know its an R533065 engine family BJDXL02.4074 engine model 4024TF281A
     
  20. Vetech63

    Vetech63 Senior Member

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    Get ready to buy some set up and removal tooling if your going to screw with that engine.
     
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