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Green new hire

Discussion in 'General Industry Questions' started by Midnightmoon, Sep 15, 2021.

  1. Midnightmoon

    Midnightmoon Senior Member

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    Got the job of training a college educated green as can be "mechanic" I'm supposed to take this kid under my wing. Not a big deal I dont entirely mind but he has no business as a heavy equipment mechanic. No mechanical aptitude well very little. School didnt teach him much, not even familiar with tier 4 components, how to change a fuel filter, 0 on hydraulics. What a mess. Trying to teach him basic systems and he comes back with one sentence. So how should I proceed? Personally I'd fire him tell him to change careers. Not having mechanical aptitude is one thing but not showing any interest in spending the time to learn is a deal breaker. I still read through material on new systems, work hard to learn new things, and push myself to a higher level. I enjoy this trade of heavy equipment theres always something to learn and keeps the brain young. All I'm getting out of this are a bunch of stories how great our educational system is. I dont have the patience for this it will take years before he is ready if he can retain anything.
     
  2. grandpa

    grandpa Senior Member

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    You will weed him out on your own, you won't need any help.:D
    Years past I had hired a young man to help my head mechanic as he was getting older and I knew he was slowing down. The hire was about the same type of helper as you were describing. My old mechanic gave the kid an honest chance but to know avail. If the kid didn't get it my old boy would just do it himself. (If you want it done your way, then you should do it yourself in the first place)
    I observed this for a while, gave it a chance but finally let the young man go. It will work out, but if you do try to make it work, then treat him like your teaching your own grandson. We seem to have more patience with grandkids than we did with our own kids.:D
     
  3. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    The brain dead walk among us, No aptitude for anything beyond a PC or a program set of instruction. The first thought they have is "Any Trained Monkey can do it" until they prove to themselves they are NOT that trained or even trainable monkey. Are subtle hints as to Some people should not ever be allowed to wrench on any machinery or drive machines beyond their own car where even that is disputable, some should not ever own a home or structure that needs as little as a light bulb changed as they cannot handle that. Currently a huge detractor of new hires as either parents would/not could not instruct of basic hand eye mind coordination or the person just does not have it in their genetics to do that. AFAIAC the education system is a failure as to where it was some forty to fifty years ago, pressing kids for Mental Structure alone and developing a generation that cannot fend for itself.
     
  4. Aarons81

    Aarons81 Well-Known Member

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    The biggest problem I am seeing with the latest batch of the workforce is most don't want to think. I have a 23 yr old that has been with us for 3yrs laboring, doing a basic job repeatedly. I still get asked( what should I do?) With problems he has encountered in the past. So I then, Start down the common sense trail of questions about, what did you do in the past. The internet has ruined the thought process for alot of folks. If they don't know the answer, or don't want to think about the problem, they'll just look it up on YouTube. There to scared to take a chance.Still, He shows up to work every day, and has a good attitude. If I tell him to do something he does it, but I get 10 questions before he does it. I'm trying to be optimistic here...I'm sure those before my time were saying the same thing about my generation.
     
  5. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    Were never pressed to self thought or Self direction, see that more and more of late. Everything was handed to them or when they would steer into self thought were shut down to group think, not a good plan.
     
  6. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    We had a few Supervisors at the Nuke that understood the main body of hands on In Plant operators were generally self directed beyond a basic instruction to "perform a Watch Station Inspection" Many New hires could find and take the parameter numbers down but would miss obvious noise changes or odors or even visually presented faults occurring, were too Focused of Task at hand as to Writing Numbers Down even INCORRECT values, that was a fault of Navy(Never Again Volunteer Yourself) training as a Nuke or Ship enlisted person. There were others that had been Navy Officers that preferred to Direct Orders instead of allowing free hand, we would then fall back to awaiting EVERY little manipulation command, IE "Open that valve" followed by one of us with "How Far?", next up they would say "Full Open" so would open it and stand there staring at them, last one I did that to stated OK, you are quite funny I understand where I noted back No you don't but you will.
     
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  7. aighead

    aighead Senior Member

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    I worry about this sort of thing for my 15 yo son. He's a very bright kid with mostly zero common sense and mostly zero hand-eye coordination. I'm not sure how to approach it. He's been like this all his life, even though I feel like I've given him the ability to do things and think things through (granted maybe not as much as I should have but certainly some). He's the kind that picks up a hammer and to nail a nail he'd use the side of the hammer head, not the head itself. He's getting better but it's still a bit infuriating and I get impatient. I had him sweep up sawdust in the shop a while ago with a normal broom and his first instinct was to push against the bristles like a push broom... If it's possible (or even impossible) to do some backward he'll figure out how to do it goofy. Luckily, he's a good sport.

    I always go back to my experience with GPS (or Google maps or whatever) in the car. I love maps and geography. I typically have a pretty good sense of direction and can figure things out, like that. However, as soon as I started using the GPS to find slightly unfamiliar location I could no longer count on my sense of direction and I was lost everywhere I went.
     
  8. Vetech63

    Vetech63 Senior Member

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    Well, I guess I'm going to play Devils advocate here.;)

    Even 5 years ago I would not have the patience to train anyone. As I have aged since then, I guess I'm getting softer on this type of thing. If the kid shows up for work, every day and on time and isn't on drugs, then I would give them a shot regardless of how green they may be. It would definitely require a great deal of patience for sure and I believe I could figure out pretty quick if there was any interest n learning this trade. I realize a lot of these young people didn't have much guidance growing up whether both parents were home or not. Sometimes they need that guidance to develop.

    If this was me in the field with a green, this is what I would do...........
    1. I would assign specific tasks that are HIS job now .......for example
    A. I no longer operate a grease gun as long as your with me. I will show you how to load and use it, You ARE the operator. Regardless of what we are called out for as a repair, you are greasing the machine.
    B. I no longer clean track frames. You now have a shovel (put his name on the dam thing) and you will clean every track frame on every track machine we come across.
    C. This is a trash bag. You will clean up all trash inside the cab and around each machine we come across.
    D. I personally would make sure I had some windex and towels on my truck for him.........Your cleaning the windows too ;)

    I then would tell him that this is the type of stuff you do to start in this business, you work from the bottom up. Show me you can do these simple tasks, do them properly without whining or bitching about it. Prove to me you really want to learn what it takes to be a tech. If I need your help I will ask for it......I will check your work before we leave the job.

    I've learned with training anyone new to any business that if you start with simple tasks that they have the ability to accomplish it builds confidence, not only for him but for you also. Until they have some confidence, they are untrainable. Not only does this technique help with confidence and task oriented completion of work, the customers greatly appreciate these types of things. Make sure your customers KNOW that your helper did those tasks for them. A few operators thanking him for this type of stuff will boost his confidence greatly and speed up the process. This will also weed out the ones that cant handle getting dirty, hot, cold, or with no drive or interest.

    I have often thought about what I would do when I retire eventually. I'm thinking I would be a great trainer if I can do it MY way. I may volunteer at the local Tech schools, or even teach at one! Hmmmmm:) I feel like I really need to pass as much of my knowledge as I can......while I still remember LOL:D

    Soo..........Am I turning into a puss or what!??:p:cool:
     
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  9. mekanik

    mekanik Well-Known Member

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    Canada's Northwest
    The shop I work at needs at least two more bodies. A welder and mechanic. They have had a few
    that looked promising but drug and alcohol problems not showing up for work and not having the skills
    they claimed they had they did not last long.

    One of the problems with the generation that should be entering the workforce is social media addiction.
    We have had a few hires just out of high school. They are expected to prove themselves able to think
    and work. They start putting freight away and cleaning the shop. If they make the grade they would start
    as an apprentice. The last one looked promising but he decided he would rather work at Sports-Chek.

    When the current workforce retires I don't know who will replace them.
     
  10. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Damn my wife who has never owned a set of wrenches knows more than that green horn. She is a city gal or was and as I repaired something around here I would show her what I am doing, what the part is called, why I am doing it this way, this is what it's suppose to look like when fixed, the signs of when this part has broken or is going to break soon and ways to mitigate said problem.
     
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  11. aighead

    aighead Senior Member

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    Beautifully said Vetech63. We have an issue with some training with new folks at my work. This is partly my fault as I'm in charge, but also partly the fault of trainers being too soft (after I've given them the authority and obliged them to be strict). What we do is extremely foreign for a factory and extremely precise and delicate.

    When I started, 25+ years ago my trainers were hard, and if I didn't do something exactly right I was told to do it again, until it was done properly. I didn't think the trainers were mean, especially once I understood the processes, I just learned that the job was complex. I'm trying to be both accommodating to a decreasing workforce (meaning it's hard to get people in to work at all so I have to deal with what I get) and get things done properly. I'm the kind that can tell you you're doing things wrong while still being gentle or diplomatic but not everyone is that way. It's tough.
     
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  12. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    I like working with the twenty somethings lately. The current issue is the declining population of young people who have had to do any work at all. When I was a kid and wanted extra money in the summer I was able to pick berries or peel Cascara bark. In the eighties it was said that a chemical used on berry plants could cause issues with kids so kids picking berries was outlawed. Peeling bark went away because it was a local thing and the feed stores quit taking it. Many kids worked in dairies around here but that was seen as exploitation so was also outlawed. Some kids worked around logging companies cleaning shop or washing trucks. That was seen as putting kids in danger and taking time away from school kids who should have been studying.

    So to make a point, kids today don't have the same starting point in life that most of us got. They have been told every move to make and every independent thought has been ruled possibly injurious to their minds and bodies. The schools are being taught by people who came through the education system and never worked a day in their lives. On top of all that, there are fewer kids today than when we grew up so fewer with the aptitude for physically doing something. The other issue is the time frame from which we are working to get things done. Cost to do something has gone up exponentially so something I can do in an hour takes a green person three. What happens then? The conversations start getting intense and the decibel levels climb. In our day it was just part of life. In this day they are being "disrespected" and their feelings are hurt. Most are taught that this is taking a psychic and emotional toll so it's best to avoid those situations and take on another way of making a living.

    Put simply, fewer kids, more types of jobs around to compete for those who do have the aptitude and moxy to see what needs to be done and do it, and finally the kids won't put up with the old ways of screaming and belittling when something doesn't get done as fast or as well as someone thinks. I don't see it as they have to change to fit our world anymore. What has to change is the world we currently live in.
     
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  13. aighead

    aighead Senior Member

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    This is an interesting point I hadn't thought of like this... I was on the tail end of having a job when I was "too young" but I also had a stepdad who ran a big park, full of random junk to take care of. I did kind of fun stuff like run a mini-golf booth (learning to be bored), to not fun stuff like cleaning up after 500 person company picnics (learning to deal with summer heat, stale garbage beer, cleaning up hot garbage baked beans and cole slaw). I worked at a small boat dock putting trolling motors and batteries on small john boats (also learning boredom and balance). I cut grass on the golf course and had the miserable job of setting cups on the greens (I was the turd that would put the holes in really tough spots, I kind of knew what I was doing but kind of didn't, it made me laugh to put the hole on top of a little hill 10 feet off the side of the green). All those things taught me, early, what a rough job was versus an easy or good job.

    I think everyone should do some real boring or gross stuff and wait tables sometime in their life.

    I will say that as I get my son to do some more work he is getting better at and more interested in manual labor. It's good for him, making him stronger, and his work ethic is getting better. Now, I just need to work on his stamina.
     
  14. Aarons81

    Aarons81 Well-Known Member

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    I have 4 boys, My 13 yr old (the oldest)has a job at a plant nursery 2 days a week. 8-10 hr days. He has also been around equipment and laboring since he was born. I literally have a picture of him in my lap on a d5 at 5 months old. All of my kids have grown up on equipment. I couldn't imagine not having that exposure. We also limit there device time to 30 minutes a day. None of them have a phone, and won't get a smart phone until there 18, and I'm not buying it.. They can curse me now and thank me later. I always try and show them that work is important, and fun. I always give them something to work for, that way they understand why they are working. It also speeds them up. Alot of these kids have never been told or shown why working is important. Some kids probably only hear that going to work sucks, and will never understand the feeling of a satisfying/fun day at work... I'm just ranting now.... I'll shut up.
     
  15. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Let me have him for a summer, he will be too worn out to call home to complain which won't happen till he goes in town which is when I do once a month. I will have him in shape with stamina, knowing a few things on living off the land and learn a few skills.That's what I should do, start a 18 plus year old boot camp to help teach kids and get them in shape.
     
  16. cuttin edge

    cuttin edge Senior Member

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    NB Canada
    Sounds like you're not giving him much of a chance. At least he asks the question instead of pretending he knows what to do, and flubbing it up. Might not be his fault he knows nothing. Perhaps the school he went to screwed him out of his money. If he senses you don't want to be bothered with him, that can make things difficult for both of you. Is he giving you additude, or refusing to do anything. How is the kid going to learn if you won't give him a chance? I learned a lot of mechanic work from my father. Not every kid has that chance. You are being given the opportunity to shape a young mind. He might not work out, or he might be a great little mechanic. My mentor on the grader couldn't even drive a farm tractor when he started years ago, and he became a well know finish grade operator. You're still getting paid the same. I'm sure they will shift him or get rid of him if your work output suffers.
     
  17. chidog

    chidog Well-Known Member

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    I think young women have more on the ball than young men do. The male youth seem to act like they never want to do what is required to grow up.
     
  18. aighead

    aighead Senior Member

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    Spud, that'd be sweet!
     
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  19. Midnightmoon

    Midnightmoon Senior Member

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    Cuttin edge. My big issue is quality of work like having to ask him to do things 2 or 3 times and its still not right. I'm trying a different approach but he would rather do a crap job then walk away and play on his phone. He asks questions he knows the answer too and that have been told to him multiple times like yes punch in when it's time to work kind of ****. The big thing is he cant remember anything and has no ambition to learn. Some just cant be trained hope I can turn it around.
     
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  20. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    Start him on cleanup as noted, tell him its on Him to know where to start and how clean is Clean. Try to instill some Ethic in effort, cannot do that he will have to leave.