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Genie Z45/25 shutting down with Ford LRG 425 EFI industrial ford engine diagnostic help needed

Discussion in 'Other Construction/Demolition Equipment' started by tool_king, Jan 8, 2021.

  1. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    Hi Guys
    Working on a Z45/25 serial 24525-19630 with the Ford LRG 425 EFI engine . Machine is 2002 model .This machine got stuck and would not start for customer. They finally got it started but would only run on low throttle back to shop . Has engine check / oil light on .Check codes have code 51 for low oil pressure . Found oil pressure to have failed close not show oil pressure .Check oil pressure got 60 psi .If you go to high you will get 70 psi .Got new switch installed .Still shutting down . Switch is a single pole switch . At start up running you will have 13 volts at switch but then you will loose when engine dies . But if you put wire to engine ground engine will run with no issues .This has the silver
    ecm . Harness checks out good .Check other stuff like coolant and alternator . I don't the older scan tool for this engine that uses the 6 pin weather pack plug . The tool number is F8JL-6K947-AA .
    Leaning toward ecm but want to be sure on 100% . Would like see what ecm is looking at .
    thanks
    Ed
     

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    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
  2. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    I may have some info but it is a long shot.

    What does the ECM look like from the top? What connectors and wire colors?

    What manual are you working from and does the wiring in the manual match the wiring on the ECM?

    Do you have software already and just missing a cable?

    What color wires are in the DLC and what pins on the ECM do they go to?
     
  3. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    I am working out the Ford LRG-425 EFI Diagnostic book FPP 194-306 book and the Ford_LRG-425 Industrial Service 194-303 book . Ecm connector are black . Wire on oil pressure switch is green with white trace . Which has continuity from one end to the other . Pins are tight . Wiring schematic matches the machine . I do not have the have the cable . I am not sure on what software they used on this machine .I do the the Ford FPP software . I also have a connector I can make adapter from if needed . This is what the tool looks like out of the book on page 8
     

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  4. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    From reading the manual it appears that they use RS485 for ECM comms. I suspect that adapter is an RS485 - standard serial port converter. I have a USB version (no physical serial port any more, just direct to USB) that you can borrow if you want.

    But the manual seems to say it was a DOS program back in 1998. Can you get your hands on a DOS computer? You could try DOSbox software with my USB cable but that is a lot of kludge. I could also show you where to get a serial-RS485 converter that would work with a DOS computer. But I am pretty sure you are going to have to get your hands on the old software.

    The FPP software you have, is it the one made by EControls? Where you have to input a 16-digit password to get the software to open? I don't think that is the correct software for this ECM, too new.
     
  5. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    My Panasonic laptops have the serial ports on them .Yes the FPP is the one you have to put the sixteen digit in .The build date on the FPP is 4/1/2004 . Do you know where to get the software from . Let me know about the DOSbox interface .
     
  6. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    Serial port is good but even if we could find the software it might not work. The last version of Windows known to work with DOS programs is Win98, do you have a computer running 98?

    I don't think the 2004 FPP is going to work but you could try it. I have put out some feelers but nothing yet. While I am waiting I think you should try calling EDI, right in your backyard. They are the master FPP distributor or whatever, if anybody has it they will, or you can go bang on their door.

    One of these is probably the right equivalent product for the hardware
    https://iotmart.advantech.com/Seria...tors-Serial-Converters/ABB_13497.products.htm

    DOSbox is a program that runs in Windows and makes the old DOS app think it is running in DOS. But I have had variable results using it to communicate over serial ports to the outside world.

    Summary: I would get a BB works serial - RS485 converter first. Try FPP Display, you have nothing to lose. But the best way would be to find a Win98 computer and use the BB converter which is probably how it was originally done.
     
  7. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    I have contacted them in the beginning and told me the tool was obsolete .
     
  8. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    My hope was that they could find some gray hair that would have the computer program on his hard drive. I'm sure they do have it on the premises somewhere if they know who to ask or where to look, if they care enough. I think we can make the rest of it out of generic parts, but it is probably a 25 k byte DOS file on some old computer somewhere.

    Maybe try calling around to some other FPP distributors? Or try seeing if somebody that has been a long time at Genie knows where to find the program?

    It has been almost a quarter century, you have to give them that. This is why I keep copies of everything and back them up in multiple ways.
     
  9. mks

    mks Well-Known Member

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    Just a wag. If you tap on the ecm will it kill it? GM had that problem early on.
     
  10. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    This is why I keep copies of everything and back them up in multiple ways always too and run multiple computer. One guy said he thinks Dana made the software if I remember right .
    I am going to call some other FPP guys on Monday.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2021
  11. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    Engine will die with in 30 seconds to minute if oil pressure switch is hooked properly and not grounded out if had to guess .I did not time it.
     
  12. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    Let know what i need to buy if you would parts wise.
     
  13. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    If you can find the old DOS software and a DOS computer to run it, I bet you would only need the RS485 - RS232 converter box plus the wires and stuff. You obviously know your stuff and are resourceful to get this far, I am sure that part would be no problem for you.

    The only thing that is a real deal breaker on this is the software itself. Everything else I bet we can put our heads together and make it work.
     
  14. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    The software is the problem for sure.
     
  15. OFF

    OFF Senior Member

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    Check your battery voltage with the engine running (before it quits). If your alternator has messed up and gone into hyper-charge, the high voltage will shut the computer down before it gets damaged. Just a long shot, but I've seen it happen more than once.
     
  16. tool_king

    tool_king Senior Member

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    I believe I right at 13.5 to 14 when I was there last week. But will recheck it .