Genie z45/22 glitches: Need help!

[tjdokulil]

Hi everyone,
I just picked up a 1994 genie z45/22 at auction and i'm having trouble diagnosing what is probable a simple issue. THe machine starts up, drives, and steers like it should. HOwever, from the ground or the basket, you have one move (of any control) and then it disables. You can shut er down and restart (albeit a munte later, which i assume is stabilizing some kinda hyd pressure) and then run another control for about 5-10 seconds and then it disables again. I've checked through the troubleshooting manual quite a bit but nothing seems to match my problem. The alarm is disabled on it so I can't tell if the level indicator is sending an error message. I'd like to minimize the searching as best I can cuz the amount of wiring and relays is like the starship enterprise, and I'm just not that smart i guess. Let me know if anyone is familiar with these symptoms. Its got the ford diesel if thats helpful and around 4000 hrs. THanks!

 

[willie59]

What is the machine serial number?

 

[VoodooMojo]

are you sure it isn't a Kubota or Deutz?

By "disables", do you mean that the engine stops or the function just quits

 

[tjdokulil]

Functions just quit. Ill check ser numbers tomorrow. Thx!

 

[willie59]

Serial number is important as Genie lists their manuals by machine serial number, and there may be electrical and hyd diagram numbers on the machine ID tag as well that tells you which diagrams fit the machine.

Just so me and Voodoo understand your problem, you have no problem with drive or steer, no problem with engine running, only have problem with boom functions from platform or ground controls, can only work one function, then no other functions operate until you shut down machine and restart, even then it's just another single function that works, close enough?

 

[tjdokulil]

Yup, sounds like we're understanding one another correctly. Ill double check engine manuf tomorrow as well, but pretty sure the badge on the engine says its a ford. Im sure i can get all the info u asked for.

 

[willie59]

I agree with Voodoo, if it's a ford engine, most likely an LRG423 dual fuel engine, not a diesel. I don't know that Ford even made a diesel engine of that size.

 

[tjdokulil]

Great catch. You are correct that i might have made an error. It is a dual fuel engine, lpg and gasoline. Sorry for the error

 

[willie59]

No worries, just making sure we're on the same page.

 

[VoodooMojo]

Is this your machine?
This model, Jlg's 60HA and the Z135 are my all-time favorites!


Does the engine seem to bog down when the function stops or is there no sign of RPM drop?

Does it happen with all the functions (except drive and steer) or a select few.
By all I mean:
Platform Rotate, Platform Level, Primary Boom, Secondary Boom, Primary Extend, and Turntable Rotate.
If any of these functions do not cause the problem, let us know. This will help us immensely.
Also, does the problem occur in both the UP and Down directions or just UP?

One circuit that is important for boom operation is the Oscillating Axle Lock-Out.
These are the wedge blocks that extend to lock the front axle when the booms are elevated. There are limit switches at the ends of the lock-out cylinder that will prevent the boom from raising until the blocks are fully deployed.


Hydraulically, Steer and Drive are separate from the other Boom Functions. Drive has its own pump. Steer does get its oil from the Function Manifold but it is dedicated oil flow from a Priority Flow Regulator Valve in the manifold. Upstream of this valve is a Pressure Relief Valve and the Function Pump. We can safely assume that the function pump and pressure relief valve are functioning properly as you say steer always functions.
Downstream of the priority flow regulator valve are the function valves, proportional flow valves, flow regulators and the Load Sense (Differential Sensing) circuits. If all the functions after the priority flow regulator valve are acting up we need to determine if the differential sensing circuit, oscillate lock-out circuit or (please let it not be) a cracked function manifold is the culprit.


Here is the link to get to Genie's Parts and Service Manual download site:

http://manuals.gogenielift.com/Parts%20And%20Service%20Manuals/START%20HERE.pdf

Download the manuals for your serial number and keep them handy.
You will find it an extremely valuable addition to your purchase of the 1994 Z45/22.
The schematics and diagrams will be very helpful for us to assist you through the process of repair.

 

[tjdokulil]

Yup, that is the machine. Model/ser# is Z-45-001560.

 

[tjdokulil]

To answer your latest post, there is no change to the rpms of the engine when functions disable. And, yes ALL functions are inoperable, other than the drive and steer. Same problem whether you are trying to operate from the ground or the platform. My partner hopped in the machine sunday and everything worked fine. All functions, for about 30 seconds, then back to the same shenanigans. He was stuck 20' in the air and had to restart it over a dozen times to limp it back to the ground (like 2 or 3' at a time).

I think the link you sent has the same manuals/diagrams that I got with the machine. I'll browse through them later today to see if there is any difference. I'll also check out the oscillating axle lockout. Do you recall if there is a testing procedure in the manual for those sensors?

 

[willie59]

If it has Telemacanique contact blocks at control switches, I would look real close (check voltage) at P1 (E-stop) contact block and KS1 (ground/platform select) contact block in lower control panel. Over the years I've seen these contact blocks do some real weird stuff, one moment allowing current to pass through when closed, next moment, nothing. It's a possibility that P1 and KS1 can allow current flow, enough to power start switch. Once start switch activates Ign/Start module, power to ignition circuit comes from a different circuit than P1 to keep engine running, but once engine is running, and you have a problem with P1 or KS1, the result will be a running engine but no boom functions from either control panel.

 

[tjdokulil]

Hey Guys,
Thanks for all the input. I tested all the advice and elec. controls to no avail, then I ended up calling an aerial lift repair tech cuz i needed the machine functional asap. Thought I'd share the outcome.

Problem was coming from the unloader valve (you might call it a dump valve) in the front steering hyd manifold. Somehow, it was wayyyyyy out of adjustment and wasnt allowing the hyd pressure to flow to the controls manifold, since the drive manifold has priority. Once we got the pressure within spec, everything functioned as it should. I learned alot in the process about the machine, so the repair cost had educational value as well. Hope this helps someone else down the road!

 

[willie59]

Yep, it's different how Genie sends priority to steer functions. A problem with priority or the differential sensing will cause some weird things on those machines. Good to hear you got it sorted out and many thanks for the update.