Food plots

[UPPLOTTER]

Entering convsation late...

Hey guys...You seem to be the folks I was looking for!
Roddyo, nice work on the plots. I'm brand new here and searching advice, I've been putting in plots for 8 years, mostly for myself but of late for a few customers. I'm looking to grow that business. I had the previlage of using a friends tractor and implements, Skidsteer and a few other pieces of equipment. I own some ATV stuff: disc, Lime Spreader, 60 gallon trailer sprayer, A culti-packer and drag...it gets me by for everything except site clearing and turning unbroken soil. What peice of equipment should I be considering, you guys know what it actually take to break ground. That's what I'm facing alot of the time...I live the the U.P. of Michigan and it's Rocky, and heavily forested. What do you think?
Thanks in advance...

J

 

[Dane]

Hey UPPLOTER, What part of the UP are you in? Are you looking to clear virgin land? if so i would advise against cutting the trees down. get a dozer in and push the trees over, that is the best way to get rid of the stumps. then you can cut the root balls off the trees and do what you will with the rest. the after you get the stumps out then i would hit the area with a breaking plow, and then disc the hell out of it.

 

[roddyo]

Hey guys...You seem to be the folks I was looking for!
Roddyo, nice work on the plots. I'm brand new here and searching advice, I've been putting in plots for 8 years, mostly for myself but of late for a few customers. I'm looking to grow that business. I had the previlage of using a friends tractor and implements, Skidsteer and a few other pieces of equipment. I own some ATV stuff: disc, Lime Spreader, 60 gallon trailer sprayer, A culti-packer and drag...it gets me by for everything except site clearing and turning unbroken soil. What peice of equipment should I be considering, you guys know what it actually take to break ground. That's what I'm facing alot of the time...I live the the U.P. of Michigan and it's Rocky, and heavily forested. What do you think?
Thanks in advance...

J

How big are the trees you need to remove?

Also, can you scratch the ground with a disc? If you can you would be better off with a disc than a chisel or breaking plow. Around here a plow will pull up more rocks than you will ever cover up.

Around here we just try to get enough loose dirt to get a stand BTW.

 

[farmerblake255]

I still have to disagree steve. Ive seen what that heavy equipment can do to farm ground first hand. We have had some sewer lines ran through some of our fields, and the compaction that they have created is unreal. We had some ground that would normally yield 50 bushel beans, and after the sewer company got done tracking over it, it yielded 28 bpa. Sure what roddyo is doing is probley less intense, then this, but lemme tell ya, you wont see a dozer in my fields, no matter how long or wide the tracks are. Even with your math, I still cant agree with you guys on this theory. As for the burning steve, Im still confused, why do it if you know that you will be burning off good stuff?

Because if a rice feild is'nt rutted up down here where me and roddyo lives your better off to burn the thing off and no - till with a drill than work it up and spend the time trying to smooth it out ready to plant and you'll never notice it. we make 180 - 210 b/ac rice down here. When it gets time to rotate to soybeans work it up and put 2 ton of chicke litter out there and make perfectly good beans.....we have had under ground irrigation lines ran through our farm also and right down the pipeline the beans will be stomach high and green as a gord and then down the edge of it they will be shin high.....

 

[farmerblake255]

If anyone has any questions about the correct way to farm just ask me.

What most people overlook is the root system of a plant. This can rival the organic matter of the part of the plant that we see. When you factor in the roots and ash we may lose less than 50% of the organic matter by burning.

If you are on the cutting edge you need to grid sample your food plots using GPS and apply your Lime/Fertilize with a varible rate buggy.:notworthy

Roddyo we need to get Baxley involved in all this......lol.......who would've thought burnin of an acre plot and sowin some seeds out to have a place to hunt could run so deep......some people just don't understand how much we know what were doin huh......anyone need a grid sampled variable rate application on your deer plot call me ....ill hitch up and head that way....

 

[roddyo]

Roddyo we need to get Baxley involved in all this......lol.......who would've thought burnin of an acre plot and sowin some seeds out to have a place to hunt could run so deep......some people just don't understand how much we know what were doin huh......anyone need a grid sampled variable rate application on your deer plot call me ....ill hitch up and head that way....

At the time this was somewhat of a heated debate.

There would be a lot less crop grown down here if we couldn't farm with a match every now and then IMO.

BTW, I always liked Farming with a Match:drinkup

 

[Dane]

At the time this was somewhat of a heated debate.

There would be a lot less crop grown down here if we couldn't farm with a match every now and then IMO.

BTW, I always liked Farming with a Match:drinkup

I also believe in burning off a field, it is a good way to "put back". i wont profess to knowing everything but i have learned some things. around here in northern wi we used to burn alot, but it seems to be a lost art. not many small farmers left, and alot of people who try to burn make bug mistakes, and have collateral damage. i rember back in the day we all would get together to burn fields, there was such a small window in the spring (about 2 weeks) to burn what you could.

i still burn off our fields (about 40 acers hay, and 40 acers in rotated deer crops) in the spring, but since times have changed and the window to burn is much smaller i am lucky to find a day to do it.

i take all the safty procedures right down to 600 gallons of water on the truck.

but last spring it was to wet i did not get a good burn, i was haveing problems with burning bans and rain. i hope for better luck next spring.


Also my buddy is a drywall contractor, and he save up his shhet rock scraps and disc them into the field, it seem to be a good sorce for cheep lime. the deer crops seem to enjoy it.

 

[UPPLOTTER]

Trees and Land...

Yes, most of what we do is virgin land; with trees varying from saplings to mature oak/pines...And this area (Marquette, MI) is VERY rocky. If I look at a larger tractor (say 50hp) would I be able to push over 5" diameter trees without wrecking the loader bucket/Hydraulics? Lot’s of the work is along logging roads or skidder trails, we then trim them back with a saw for optimal sunlight. I'd like to disc everything, I hate picking rocks! Is there a certain piece of equipment that would act as a “do all” for this situation? Don't forget I' need to disc, spread lime, grade, and run a no till-drill either way I go, and I'd hire a dozer if I want to do big stuff, but I dont' find that too much.

Thanks!

 

[UPPLOTTER]

Hey UPPLOTER, What part of the UP are you in? Are you looking to clear virgin land? if so i would advise against cutting the trees down. get a dozer in and push the trees over, that is the best way to get rid of the stumps. then you can cut the root balls off the trees and do what you will with the rest. the after you get the stumps out then i would hit the area with a breaking plow, and then disc the hell out of it.

Due East of you...Marquette.

 

[Dane]

Yes, most of what we do is virgin land; with trees varying from saplings to mature oak/pines...And this area (Marquette, MI) is VERY rocky. If I look at a larger tractor (say 50hp) would I be able to push over 5" diameter trees without wrecking the loader bucket/Hydraulics? Lot’s of the work is along logging roads or skidder trails, we then trim them back with a saw for optimal sunlight. I'd like to disc everything, I hate picking rocks! Is there a certain piece of equipment that would act as a “do all” for this situation? Don't forget I' need to disc, spread lime, grade, and run a no till-drill either way I go, and I'd hire a dozer if I want to do big stuff, but I dont' find that too much.

Thanks!

I would advise agaist just using a tractor, i ran an 85hp 4X4 with loader for a few years, and there is no way i would put that machine through that kind of hell. it might be able to do it a few times but if you are going to invest that kind of money i dont think you want to beat your equipment.

i installed satelite in your area for a few years and have a bit of an idea of what your dealing with, i saw a guy in watersmeet pushing popple trees of about 10in with a very large skid steer but that machines loader is built a lot tougher, and he was able to dig a bit before he pushed.

i dont think your are going to find just one wounder machine to do it all. depending on the size of the area you are working, and if you have some Fab skills, a large skid steer might be the closest your going to get. you could fab up alot of impelments depending on your needs, however your would not want to pull a disc with a skid steer.

if your working larger areas a center articulated tractor might be the trick, i think there might be one at HOOD equipment they might part with cheep, i think they were going to fab up a skidder out of it on a custom contract that fell through, you could have them equip it with a dozer/ skidder style blade.

 

[UPPLOTTER]

I would advise agaist just using a tractor, i ran an 85hp 4X4 with loader for a few years, and there is no way i would put that machine through that kind of hell. it might be able to do it a few times but if you are going to invest that kind of money i dont think you want to beat your equipment.

i installed satelite in your area for a few years and have a bit of an idea of what your dealing with, i saw a guy in watersmeet pushing popple trees of about 10in with a very large skid steer but that machines loader is built a lot tougher, and he was able to dig a bit before he pushed.

i dont think your are going to find just one wounder machine to do it all. depending on the size of the area you are working, and if you have some Fab skills, a large skid steer might be the closest your going to get. you could fab up alot of impelments depending on your needs, however your would not want to pull a disc with a skid steer.

if your working larger areas a center articulated tractor might be the trick, i think there might be one at HOOD equipment they might part with cheep, i think they were going to fab up a skidder out of it on a custom contract that fell through, you could have them equip it with a dozer/ skidder style blade.

Dane...Thanks, I've experienced the same. Nothing has proven itself to be the Wonder Drug. The Skidsteers have so many attachement these days I think your on to something. I need to focus on what I'm going to take on for jobs within the "norm", then figure something out for the projects that would require more. Which are not that much as I've found...usualy a logger is coming in before, or has recently been on site. Maybe working a relationship up with the loggers in the area would benefit me. It seems money from logging is funding most of my work. Do you have any experience with lime buggy's or know someone here that does? Lime is king here...every job I've done has required it. Ph's usually in the 5's. Thanks!

 

[Dane]

Do you have any experience with lime buggy's or know someone here that does? Lime is king here...every job I've done has required it. Ph's usually in the 5's. Thanks!

I have not had the need to buy lime, i have not had the need to get that technical, and have not did any ph samples on our plots. ( i am not for hire right now) I have spred cow manure, as a favor to local farmers. I spred drywall scraps as i get them ( dont get enough to wory about burning out 80 acers) and i have a friend who has a septic service who might spred some poo per dnr regs. some times i have to haul water as it has been dry around hear.

i do burn the fields in spring if i get a chance. and between our own personal consumption and the deers consumption it is not possable to harvest all 5 acers of turnips and rutabagges so the are alowed to freeze and rot, and are disced in the next spring. the crops are rotated each year.

from what i do know about lime is i see it get droped off in fields by dump trucks and farmers use what ever the got to spreed it, i have even seen them use manure spredders. i think you can buy a spredding cart full from ashland ag center, they pull it out with a truck and you hook it up to a tractor and spred. not sure though if sell lime in those carts or just other fertelizers/ chems. the cart is rented but convenient. i would call them and find out more for you but i do not have the time i am on my way to do some loggin right now, but here is there phone number if you wish to call them...(715) 682-2688

oh by the way we farm all that land with an old allis chalmer tractor a disc and a drag. we seed with a hand broadcaster. in the srping we pull wagons behind a forn 9n and a honda 4x4 fourwheeler picking rocks, it takes about 2 people 2 days to go over the whole thing. it is just a hobby.

 

[Dane]

Do you have any experience with lime buggy's or know someone here that does? Lime is king here...every job I've done has required it. Ph's usually in the 5's. Thanks!

I wonder... you have to disc the lime in right?

so what if insteed of putting weight on your disc in you fabed a hopper and a hyd powered spredder on your disc and take care of it all at the asme time.

i also wonder if that would work for seeding, rase the disc so it barly scrapes, and set the payout rate and spin speed acordinly.

Just a thought

 

[UPPLOTTER]

I wonder... you have to disc the lime in right?

I'll certain give them a call in Ashland. You're the first person I heard that picked rocks for a hobby! I know a thing of two about lime, if you not discing it in...1000lbs. per acre, but you can go 2-3 tons/ac if you disc it in down to 8". For seeding, I use an ATV mounted spreader and I also cultipack with the ATV too. Thanks again!

 

[UPPLOTTER]

I wonder... you have to disc the lime in right?

so what if insteed of putting weight on your disc in you fabed a hopper and a hyd powered spredder on your disc and take care of it all at the asme time.

i also wonder if that would work for seeding, rase the disc so it barly scrapes, and set the payout rate and spin speed acordinly.

Just a thought

Dane, a before and after of a nice opening we worked on this summer.

 

[Dane]

UPPLOTER nice, here is a link to a google map of there area i am working with, http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF&msa=0&msid=
112587902225609550850.00047c4acc5eb10792c25

and a link of some pictures, i dont hae any of just the plots right now http://s799.photobucket.com/albums/yy274/danefi2/

 

[roddyo]

Tree Puller

Dane...Thanks, I've experienced the same. Nothing has proven itself to be the Wonder Drug. The Skidsteers have so many attachement these days I think your on to something. I need to focus on what I'm going to take on for jobs within the "norm", then figure something out for the projects that would require more. Which are not that much as I've found...usualy a logger is coming in before, or has recently been on site. Maybe working a relationship up with the loggers in the area would benefit me. It seems money from logging is funding most of my work. Do you have any experience with lime buggy's or know someone here that does? Lime is king here...every job I've done has required it. Ph's usually in the 5's. Thanks!

Here a home made shear that we used to use a little. The good thing was it pulled almost everything by the roots, very little shearing. If your not carefull you could tear the frontend loader off of a tractor pretty quick though.

If you have or need a skid steer this could be a something to think about.:beatsme

 

[Dane]

Hmm looks like some sharpened grader blades welded onto a fork frame. I cant imange that this form of pasive shear do much shearing like you were saying, but i can see how it could get a great grip on a tree and rip it right out of the ground.

I think something like this would work a little better though, and it dont look hard to make. http://www.everythingattachments.co...Grapple-Bucket-p/cal-grapple wickstumpsxd.htm

This one looks easyer to make http://www.everythingattachments.com/Skid-Steer-Tree-Spade-s/3008.htm

 

[bill allen]

Dane, a before and after of a nice opening we worked on this summer.

That sure looks like pretty country.

 

[bill allen]

My above post didn't upload the pics. I guess I still have some learning to do on how to use this forum.:beatsme