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first dump truck

Discussion in 'Trucks' started by shadow, Apr 14, 2011.

  1. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2010
    Messages:
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    Location:
    ct
    I was wondering if any hear of putting super single on dump truck.

    What are the benefits or downside to air suspension on a dump truck.

    how are the alison transmission and how much more do they coast then a standard.

    how is new mack for dump truck
     
  2. Willis Bushogin

    Willis Bushogin Senior Member

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    Occupation:
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    Location:
    NC
    A friend of mine, put super singles on a single axle dump truck, he didnt like it so he took them off. I never heard him say why he didnt like them

    Air ride, a favorite subject of mine. About a year ago I replied to a similar thread about air ride dump trucks and I said then I would never buy another one
    HUMMM about 5 months ago I bought another (air ride quad dump truck) Sold it about a month ago, this is my last one
    Some of the things that the drivers complained about was the truck leaning over in curves (while loaded)
    Having to remember to dump the air bags, if you are on uneven ground
    Remembering to inflate the air bags, if you dont the load just sets there and bounces on the rear end housing, thus cracks the a housing (I had it happen twice)
    Seems like air ride gets stuck in soft ground quicker, than a non air ride (my opinion, backed with experience)
    Always worrying about is the air bag going to bust, with a load of asphalt on it where I cant dump my load (my opinion, backed with bad experience with this, load of asphalt $2000)
    Dump bed not level, loaded. If you are loaded uneven, the truck leans to one side. The only way I ever corrected this issue was to put two leveling valves on the truck, then are two valves you have to keep adjusted or repaired
    The positive side, they ride more comfortable than the walker beams

    Final few thoughts
    I own 4 dump trucks, and I do contract hauling, mostly asphalt and rock. Air ride trucks are mostly converted road tractors, so they are mostly single frame.
    I think if you are a owner operator (you are going to drive it yourself) if you get a good deal on a air ride, you probably can put up with the negative stuff. The 8 bag air ride is better suited for dump trucks verses the four bag system. I know there are a bunch of people using air ride dumps and like them, but its not me NEVER again.

    I dont understand the allision transmission question, but if you are asking how is the automatic verses standard trannies. I have owned 3 automatics and I loved them, them pulled good in soft ground, didnt get stuck as often as the straight shift, doesnt ring drive shafts like the straight shift.

    My first air ride truck was a Mack 1996. It was a road tractor and I converted it to a dump truck. I forgot the model but it was the newer style, not the R or RD model. I sold it about 4 years ago, the guy I sold it to is still running it. It had the E7 Mack engine and all he has done is replace the turbo.

    The best trucks I have ever owned in ex-state trucks. I have a 1984 Ford L9000 factory tandem dump, 120,000 miles Cummins Big Cam, Jake brake that works, great interior. Try to go to a State sale and check them out

    Sorry for the long reply, everyone can wake up now Im finished
     
  3. Greg

    Greg Senior Member

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    Last thing first. I have run Mack's for better than 20 years. In my opinion since Volvo took over the Mack line and "volvoized" it I won't have anymore of them. Fellows I know that bought Mack Granite dont like them. Volvo tipped the Mack CL line upside down so for me that one is out also. I am just glad that I won't have to buy any more dump trucks because I don't know what I would get.

    For my money Mack RB or CL, with E7 400HP mechanical injection with 18 speed, double frame and camel back suspension. Set them up with as a quad axle with two pusher axles and a 17 or 18 feet long box.
     
  4. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    ct
    What about Kenworth for dump trucks
     
  5. akroadrunner

    akroadrunner Well-Known Member

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    Occupation:
    Gravel Pit/ Trucking/Owner
    Location:
    Alaska
    If you only own one end dump, it should be a KW T-800. If you own more than one, well, most of them should be a T-800. Hendrickson extended leaf only in the rear, unless you get Chalmers. It should have full lockers. Second, it should have a high lift gate, Third, it needs a body vibrator such as Humper Dumper. No more shoveling sticky loads. Don't buy a converted highway truck. You need construction specs for an end dump. Never buy an end dump with air ride. Big mistake! Also, it's better to go broke by charging too much than too little. You're SURE to go broke not charging enough. old equipment, moose, truck 040.JPG old equipment, moose, truck 040.JPG
     
  6. Dirtman 61

    Dirtman 61 Member

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    Location:
    Jamestown, N.D.
    Macks are good trucks. I ran a '94 CH-series with the E-series engine for 3 years. It was a converted OTR tractor, double framed. Had the New Way 4-bag air ride. Leveling valves on each side so it would ride pretty level as long as you loaded it close to even. I got in the habit of dumping the airbags when I dumped, no matter what the ground conditions were. Otherwise, the load comes off of full bags and the axles don't float. You are stuck on level ground until the air levels out.
    As for getting stuck? If you have good shocks, an air ride doesn't wheel hop. Tires stay in contact with the ground better.
    Now for Super singles. It depends on the truck. We had one mack, CL with the V-8. It weighed 12,000 on the front end empty. The narrow fronts cut into the ground when you turned, snapping stud bolts all the time. We put an 18,000# axle under it and 16" wide tires. 18's would rub the frame under a full turn. Cured the stud bolt problem as the wheels could skip under a full turn. The front also floated better on soft ground. The only thing I hated was the way it handled on the road. Wide tires will follow every groove in the pavement. You're constantly fighting the wheel.
    Take my observations however you like, I won't tell you how to think past that.
     
  7. JDMGrading

    JDMGrading Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
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    Location:
    Charlotte
    For your first dump truck, I'd look for a L9000 with the walking beam suspension (check for play in the beams by turning the truck sharply) Full lockers are a must have!

    Being your first truck your gonna take every job you can get, atleast I did! and it put me in some predicaments that only lockers can get you out of!

    They're extremely reliable, I have the CAT 3306 oddball turned up to 400HP its very strong and runs good. The BIG CAM cummins is also reliable and a fuel sipper. (sometimes)

    They can also be picked up cheap!

    Make sure you get the long hood version, makes working on it a helluva lot easier.

    Good luck!
     
  8. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2010
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    Location:
    ct
    i was looking for a new truck and i was looking at anything how the truck should be specked axle weight body companies

    i was wonder what scr vs egr and witch one is better

    my biggest ? is that for at ten wheeler that hauls 17 tons about and is going to tow 55000lbs what size engine should the truck have
     
    woods450racer likes this.
  9. rami1

    rami1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2011
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    Occupation:
    just started my own earthworks bussines
    Location:
    Australia
    hi there im new to this site and have just started my own earthworks business iin nsw Australia ive got a 3 ton kubota k-030 and a 9 ton gvm isuzu tipper if any one has any similar machines i would love to hear from you to get some info and pick yuour brain abit !

    Cheers
    Ray
     
  10. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2010
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    Location:
    ct
    cant you put a 12 or 13 foot bed on a tandum truck with a total side hight of 100in and still get at least 12-15tons in the truck

    t would like it so the bed is small for the truck very heard to overload

    i was looking at a truck like this to tow a 55000lbs trailer and wondering what size engine would be good
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2011
  11. bpogue

    bpogue Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Missouri
    I don't know of any legal configuration for a single axle that would allow you to haul 12-15 tons, unless you had a drop axle. And you certainly wouldn't want to tow 55,000 pounds with a single axle truck of any kind.
     
  12. Willis Bushogin

    Willis Bushogin Senior Member

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    100 in, thats over 8ft, thats mighty high for a dump bed. I have a tandem with I think with 13ft x about 5ft, I do haul 15tons, Im not sure it will pass the bridge law if I get stopped.
    55,000 lb trailer, are we talking about a tag along trailer? They probrably make them, but Ive never heard of a tag along that big. I have never seen a tandem dump truck, pulling that kind of load. That would take a big pintle hitch and a real good welder to make the hitch.
    I hope the truck isnt air ride
    I would think you would need at least 400hp and then it depends on the tranny and the gear ratio on the rears
    This kind of a load requires a load boy trailer, in my safety opinion
    good luck
     
  13. Willis Bushogin

    Willis Bushogin Senior Member

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    Im just a few hours east of you and I agree with all of your statements. In the last 15 years, I bet I have owned 10-12 Ford dump trucks and they all served me very well. My first quad was a 1985 L9000 dump truck, Cummins Big cam, 18ft steel bed, hauled 22tons. I now have a 1984 Ford L9000 tandem, Cummins Big cam with a working jake brake great great truck, ex NC state truck 125,000 miles. I have a 94 Ford LTL9000 quad, Cat 3176, greatpulling truck I really dont like the 3176, but I havent had any problems with it. I also have a 1988 KW T800 L10 Cummins, quad, 1989 Freightliner triaxle, Cummins big cam, jake brake. This was a converted road truck, but they did a good job on the conversion.
    The best trucks I have ever owned was ex state trucks (NC & Pa)
    People be careful of what you are buying, usually cheap trucks are problem trucks, so make sure you know what you are buying, its very costly to repair engines and trannys
     
  14. 2004F550

    2004F550 Charter Member

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    Location:
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    Shadow we have mack's but have switching to KW overtime, being that your in CT you might have noticed how many KW's are now on the road. We have had great luck with our T800 triaxles and service has been excellent. I don't know if you have yet but contact Tri-state KW in Enfield there are some very knowledgeable people there and they have sold many many trucks in the area, they know what will work and what won't. We have triaxles mostly but have thought about a tandem like you are talking about for tight areas. We explored the s/a with a tag idea but after thought and talking to some with the configuration a regular tandem makes more sense in most cases. In either case the tandem will cost close to that of a full size triaxle being that the main difference is only a tag axle. We have Cat C-12 and C-13 Cat engines at 430 hp. They have been good motors for us but Cat is now out of the business the choices are somewhat limited. For a tandem I think 430 hp or so would be more than enough. Also I would vote for an Allison auto. They have come a long way and are a very reliable transmission now.
     
  15. hammerman

    hammerman Well-Known Member

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    Give at yourself the pleasure to test one,if it´s possible
     

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    Last edited: Apr 20, 2011
  16. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    ct
    i was trying to decide between a 6 and a 10. if igot a six wheel dump truck could it two a 35000lbs trailer. weight of trailer and mechince

    With the ten i was wonder if it could two a 55000lbs total weight trailer.

    i was looking to keep the side hight of the dump be to 100in from the ground so it can be loaded with dirt from a small excervator
     
  17. shadow

    shadow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2010
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    Location:
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    i want to spec a tandum truck i was wondering if thease specs would be good

    perterbilt 365 truck

    46000lbs rears full locking difs

    20000 wide track front axle set back

    pacecar 405 engine

    alison 4700 rds 7 gear with the 2nd deep reverse

    walk beam suspesion
    jake brake

    13 foot dump bed

    high lift tail gate

    permiear 880 air aujust hitch
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2011
  18. Willis Bushogin

    Willis Bushogin Senior Member

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    Im just guessing, but this sounds like a $100,000+ truck new. 13ft bed with a high lift gate, I guess its possible, but I think its like a $6000 add on for a HLGate, is it really worth that with a 13ft bed? As stated before, I have a truck with a 13ft bed, but its a speciality truck. Its a short truck, carries 15ton and I can get anywhere a single axle can get and carry more payload. Would I only have this size truck, if I just had one truck "NO" I wouldnt, you need a truck to carry at least 16 ton +, I would never spend big bucks on a truck with a 13ft bed. I paid like $3500 for this truck (ex state truck) I wouldnt take $7000 for it now, 1984 Ford L9000 tandem. I would hate to make payments on this size truck, Petes are nice trucks, but they dont fit in my budget. My older trucks will make the same money and no payments and they look good also. Trucks like this are beyond my dreams, I couldnt sleep with a payment like this new truck would have, so no sleep, no dreams
    Unless you have good backing and alot of work, dont start out in big debt, its hard to climb back out
    Good Luck from the school of hard knocks
     
  19. Willis Bushogin

    Willis Bushogin Senior Member

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    yellow ford dump 003.jpg
    I finally found out how to post pictures
    Cummins Big Cam, Jake brake that works, I added a A/C system, very good interior, 1984 L9000
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
  20. mitch504

    mitch504 Senior Member

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    Willis, anybody who has spent any time in NC knows that is either an ex-state truck, or was bought from a banana farmer.;)

    I also have a short tandem dump(12' bed and snub nose C90 chevy) , and like you, I don't use it all the time, but when I need it, it can take 13-14 tons where my competitions single axles can only take 10.

    I agree with Willis, and will state it more strongly: Nobody in their right mind would start out with that kind of debt in good times, much less now.

    Willis, where are you from? sounds like you may not be too far from me.

    Mitch
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011