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Eco block forms

Discussion in 'Mining/Aggregates' started by Spud_Monkey, Oct 1, 2020.

  1. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Y'all going to drive my wife nuts with giving me ideas like this though is feasible, problem is how far away I would have to haul said equipment. This is Montana, they don't have many people here and even less amount of equipment and even lesser amount of equipment they will let go of.

    Got plenty of water, and I do need to build a shop or two besides the house so it might seem feasible...
     
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  2. repowerguy

    repowerguy Senior Member

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    A clapped out precaster special isn’t hard to find, just gotta know where to look.
    With no water reducing admixtures you’re gonna need about 35 gallons of water per yard. With low range and high range if you’re fancy the water goes down a lot.
     
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  3. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Yeah that's the problem, knowing where to look. Will scour across the world wide web and see what pops up.
     
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  4. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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  5. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    I'm a couple degrees south of you, and a lot of degrees east of you. I've never lived through a winter in your area, so that's understood. Earthships are designed for and work decent in the four corners area, if I was you, I'd be moderating that design for your climate, less mass, less glass, more insulation. Also, in floor heat, GRAVITY, wood fired I'm guessing. 16" concrete is mostly wasted for thermal storage and strength. Arch that back wall and you could get away with 4-6" reinforced concrete back there, that would be more than adequate for the solar gain you'll get and economically store. The soil behind the concrete can sub for the extra concrete, neither one will do squat day to day. For your climate, look up sand bed seasonal storage if you're still considering seasonal storage, that is, thicker than a couple inches from surface. you can hook the wood heat to that, unless you're way sunnier than I'm assuming, you'll be using the wood heat, and the storage will make it easier to use.

    Or forget the concrete and build a block wall, much easier than forming, mixing. Or if you have lots of rocks, slip form the walls with stone layered with concrete/mortar.

    repowerguy, what do you think of this one? decent price? probably make a $1,000 difference if it was closer, but it's the range of what I see advertised. Call your local redimix place is probably the best answer.

    https://wausau.craigslist.org/hvo/d/minocqua-1985-advance-fdm-mixer-truck/7188365381.html
     
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  6. repowerguy

    repowerguy Senior Member

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    The front discharge Advance is the best way to place concrete hands down. An Advance will plow through mud where a rear discharge or an Oshkosh front will be stuck. The single frame Advance [ and Phoenix and Maxim] will move and twist and flex to keep going. Now the bad news, that same single frame is good for about 15 years or so then the stress cracks begin usually at the spring hangers and behind the rear pedastal on no tag axle models. On an old TET-Advance from the 80's it's likely to have been re-railed before so it could be fine. At $5500,well that's maybe about $500 more than what I would spend on a 85 model front.
    Show up to buy with cash and your best middle eastern haggling game and it may well be yours. The usual mechanical and drum inspections beforehand are expected.
     
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  7. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    I have planned to arch the walls along the back with if you look at the plans they include insulation along the back wall. I have studied Earthships for over 10 years now and understand the whole functionality of them and they have one built in Canada where it's close to the climate that is here. Way it works is sun comes in winter time and hits back wall that will store the heat along in to the floor which having porous bricks wouldn't retain the heat as solid pour would and in summer the sun only comes in where the greenhouse or front foyer is gets it hot and as the heat escapes through top hatches it pulls by convection cool air from cool tubes in back of the house to front of the house. The roof unlike Earthships will be buried under few feet and it being clay I doubt water will trickle down that far even so it will be covered with vapor barrier/waterproofing for any droplets that make it down and the roof will slop back and be arched too. No rocks here only silt stone and rarely can find scoria that's not worth picking up, though there is clay rocks here that are fragile.
    Sixteen inches may be too much but there is no 100% way to know unless you are engineer in this field of thermal mass and what is in this climate, it's just what the max is on this thickness, I will experiment with time before I start building.
    As for sand bed seasonal storage I will divulge deeper into that later tonight, seems interesting. There will be backup heat in the house, but from what I experienced last winter staying out there towards the end in a camper it's not too bad.
     
  8. crane operator

    crane operator Senior Member

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  9. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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  10. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    When Pour the walls need to continuous pour or will leak at every seam regardless the sealant or rebar or any other attempts to not allow to leak, same as will ECO Blocks. The key to concrete is Solid Base Footer then situate wall atop that, pour as dry as can accept into forms then use vibrating compactor(Donkey DIck) to force trapped air and water to surface. Too wet all the aggregate floats out to bottom, all together Too dry and air will not escape nor will the mix adhere well to aggregate. Is a science to this.
     
  11. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    Do what you want. My suggestions: based on your elevation and latitude, I bet you don't have a lot of cooling degree days? no two week stretch of hot humid weather expected? Ditch the cooling tubes, those are a poor cobble job patch for an overheating earthship in AZ in August and September when the temp is at the highest, and the sun is already going lower in the sky. Open your windows at night, and close them during the hot days, and I bet you never miss AC. Humidity/condensation is one drawback of mass, why you don't see mass used as much outside of the West. In FL you'd want a doublewide on blocks, least mass. I'd guess you can live with it, but you'll have more issues than AZ, NM, CO, and UT.

    Less glass, 20x60 is closer to the doublewide. I'd want a more compact footprint to be able to heat it comfortably when the snow is blowing horizontal for days on end of below zero. They put doublewides all across Canada I'm sure, but I wouldn't recommend it. I know the theory, I've seen them in the midwest, it's not pretty, I've never seen them in their native habitat. I know what I've done and how it's worked, and what I'd do differently next time. Earth sheltering or underground/earth cover is nice for blast protection/emf/emp but it's a bitch to waterproof. Insulation aboveground is cheaper than underground.
     
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  12. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Where I live at there is very low humidity, only gets 13 inches of rain a year and ton of sunlight! Storms move through fast cold fronts and heat waves last a week at most unless some freak storm or one is lined up behind the other one.
    I'm curious of where you got your experience/knowledge from, built something of your own, been in or built any of them i.e. passive solar homes, earth bermed homes or Earthships?
     
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  13. Tugger2

    Tugger2 Senior Member

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    [​IMG]
    If were doing a home pour and i couldnt get ready mix id find one of these. Easy to fix up an old one and easy to maintain. I have worked with these up in logging camps over the years doing shop floors ,we did a small dam (10' high) for the camp water system with one. Id bet you could scout out one of these somewhere.
     
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  14. DMiller

    DMiller Senior Member

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    Then only need a front end loader to move it to the foundation site.
     
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  15. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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  16. john hofer

    john hofer Well-Known Member

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  17. JPV

    JPV Senior Member

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    I was going to suggest those ICF blocks too, I am not sure if they would work in that application or not but they sure are slick to build with.
     
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  18. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    Ah ICF's yes I thought about them though problem with passive solar home is they will insulate from collection of heat in winter time when sun shines on the wall.
    Not me set on concrete mixing it's, you aren't getting a 70k lb cement truck up the last 3 miles of ridge and when you get to the property where house will be sitting in behind a U shaped ridge of different elevation which then will require a pumper truck too.
    I know cause well I tried it with my rig at 28k lbs and sunk it after this picture. 9055CE2F-07BA-489B-9BF0-52A0A11AAA01.jpeg
     
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  19. Spud_Monkey

    Spud_Monkey Senior Member

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    And this is where it got stuck. Where I’m standing is where the house will go. 1BEAA834-C92E-40D8-985E-BCEA33E7ADBA.jpeg
     
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  20. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    You've got a longer wheelbase, poor weight balance for traction, and undriven axles. A mixer would make it, wouldn't need much of a road smoothed out. They go crazy places and get stuck all the time, farmer/hippie bridges are the worst. If they get stuck, all they care about is being able to transfer the load to a second truck, and get pulled out by something, eventually. Collapse a bridge, even a small one, it ruins your morning.

    I haven't thought of a way to do ICF with the mass open to the inside. I suspect most solar people are too individualistic to use a product like THAT anyway:rolleyes: you and me both Spud.

    Check your private messages.