Deere 244J Boom Stutters

[PeteG]

Hi,

We have a Deere 244J loader serial 711681 having issues with the loader hydraulics. The boom, tilt and aux 3 and 4 functions all stutter. The loader was running perfectly today for 4-5 hours and it just started. You can work the functions back and forth and they slowly get better, but as one function gets better, another gets worse. And when you increase engine speed, the hydraulics “lock up” for lack of a better term, and the function you are using stops. The stuttering only happens at idle, and the hydraulics only seem to work while at idle when the issue is present. Also, the hydraulics lines move significantly when the stuttering takes place, especially watching from the valve under the loader arms.
I thought it seemed like air in the lines, and we loosened pretty much all the lines under the front cover at the main valve assembly and cylinders with no change in results. The loader drives very smooth, so it’s within the loader hydraulics I believe. There are also 2 accumulators under the front cover. One I know is for ride control, but there was another that I wasn’t sure if that could be the cause of the problems if it was leaking air into the system, but not sure on that. When looking at the hydraulic level, the oil isn’t foaming of milky either so I don’t think the pump is cavitating. The float/return to dig and ride control haven’t worked for years on this, but I thought I would mention that in case it could cause issues. Not sure where else to look besides the pump pressures, so any help definitely appreciated. Thanks.

 

[mg2361]

Check the filter for debris?

You sure it has no air in the reservoir? The fan pump shaft seals on those like to pull in air.

Need to check pilot pressure, charge pressure and system pressure.

I would advise acquiring the Operation and Test manual TM11214.

 

[PeteG]

Filter was new a few months ago along with a new seal kit for the filter housing. Also did replace the fan pump seal for a surging drive issue. Machine ran great for maybe 200 hours and then this popped up, but it does seem like air is in the system. I checked filter today and it was clean as well.

Reservoir does not seem to have air this time, when I replaced the fan seal the fluid was clearly cavitating, so that’s what I’m comparing to.

Is there a specific way to bleed the loader valve? I cracked the hoses but if there is a procedure Ill try to rule that out first as I believe there may be air somewhere by the accumulators.

 

[mg2361]

Is there a specific way to bleed the loader valve?

No. System is self bleeding. If it is air then the source of that has to be repaired.

I suggest pressure checks I mentioned above. Start with system pressure since that is the easiest to check. There is a diagnostic coupler on top of the control valve for that.

 

[PeteG]

Ok thank you for the help. I will order some gauges and then check the pressures to get a baseline. Would there be any specific fittings I will need, or just the diagnostic quick connect for the gauge?

 

[mg2361]

Something like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/232943137486?chn=ps&mkevt=1&mkcid=28

 

[PeteG]

Thank you! Got it ordered and should have it next week. Will report back with the pressures. Thank you again

 

[PeteG]

Ok was able to check system pressure today and I was reading right at 900psi which seems very low to me. If you slowly feather the throttle up, I could get to 1000, but then it would start to stutter and bounce from 400-1100.
Another thing was if you went wot, it would stop completely and pressure was reading 0. Is it possible the control valve could be bad? It seems as if something isn’t allowing full hydraulic flow through. And this is contained to the system within the control valve. Steering and drive act normal. Just the lift,tilt, and aux 3 and 4 are having the issue

 

[SmokeyRiver]

Make sure the suction line to the pump is not sucking flat- killing pump flow.

 

[mg2361]

Is it possible the control valve could be bad?

No. Your problem is most likely within the hydraulic pump. Either the pump itself or the priority valve. The pump has he priority valve built into it which sends oil to the steering system first. When that is satisfied then it sends oil to the hydraulic system. Like Smokey said, make sure the suction side of the hydraulic pump does not have issues. Otherwise my suggestion would be to perform a flow test with a flow meter to confirm pump integrity.

 

[PeteG]

Ok so had a little more time to mess with this machine. Unfortunately I don’t have access to a flow meter, but am trying to find someone nearby. If I’m understanding correctly, if steering is working as normal, the pump and suction line are most likely good. Visually the suction hose seems good, but I haven’t taken off the hose to look inside, as I was thinking the above. I might be completely wrong here though. This would lead to the priority valve as MG2361 stated. Looking around on the Deere website, i couldn’t find the valve separate from the pump, but I may be looking in the wrong spot. Thank you for pointing me in the right direction everyone!

 

[mg2361]

Looking around on the Deere website, i couldn’t find the valve separate from the pump

And you won't. Priority components are not sold separately. You would have to buy the complete pump. I would take the priority spool out to make sure it moves freely and that the spring is not broken. Post a picture of your hydraulic pump.

 

[PeteG]

Here’s a picture of the pump

 

[mg2361]

 

[PeteG]

Figured it out! So I cleaned up the priority valve and everything looked ok in there (spring and spool). That didn’t change anything. But I realized the stuttering got worse if I tried to hold it on relief, like when I checked pressures. Turned out to be the relief valve on the main control. Got a new one and it solved the problem completely. Thank you for the help everyone!