D7 clutch brake

[Billhook]

I remembered this thread and now have the same problem with my 1956 D7 17a. I bought it in 2000 and it has done great work, digging out a small lake, grubbing stumps on the farm and levelling the chalk roads with the blade set at an angle.
I was just finishing some work pushing a load of saplings into a heap ready to burn, which was easy first gear work, when I noticed a small amount of white smoke coming out of the gearbox filler, no unusual noise and I assumed this was a sign that the transmission brake needed adjusting so followed the instructions in the manual, but like LG 78 said I saw that the linkage was worn and needed welding. It still works as there is just contact but I have not had time to do that yet. I had one more short run to do, only a half hour job, so I set off. Initially I found that my clutch brake adjustment had worked and it was easy to engage gear. Then there was an unusual noise from the gearbox and for a second I thought that I had lost the drive but it came back. But the transmission first gear was now noisy, not broken cog noisy but perhaps bearing noisy, and there was an improvement in second gear and even better in third, which sounded normal
However the clutch brake is not working at all now and I was wondering if the brake band had broken off and fallen into the gearbox. Is this even possible in theory. The white smoke may have been from the band disintegrating. The gear oil looks fine and no sign of debris and is up to the full mark and is nice and clean looking
I drove her all the way back to the yard about a mile in third with no incident, reverse is also fine. Any ideas before I start taking things apart?

 

[epirbalex]

The clutch brake is outside the transmission . Is your dozer a wet or dry main clutch ? . I can understand smoke coming from a dry clutch breather . If there is smoke coming from the transmission it will be created by extreme heat . Best option is its the clutch break has dismounted and engaged causing the smoke and noise .

 

[Billhook]

Thank you for that advice. Although I have owned it for 24 years I have no idea whether it is a dry or wet clutch, how can I tell? If your best option is the cause, what would need to be done to repair it.?
When I inspected the dipstick, the oil was not hot and it was clear and fresh when I wiped it with my fingers, this fact together with the fact that it seemed to drive the mile back to the farm without a problem. The fact that the clutch brake worked initially after I adjusted it according to the manual and then suddenly stopped working at all seems to confirm your theory.

 

[epirbalex]

Thank you for that advice. Although I have owned it for 24 years I have no idea whether it is a dry or wet clutch, how can I tell? If your best option is the cause, what would need to be done to repair it.?
When I inspected the dipstick, the oil was not hot and it was clear and fresh when I wiped it with my fingers, this fact together with the fact that it seemed to drive the mile back to the farm without a problem. The fact that the clutch brake worked initially after I adjusted it according to the manual and then suddenly stopped working at all seems to confirm your theory.

Mine has the clutch break return spring , close to that is a breather then there is a large filler plug . This is all under the air cleaner area . Someone should know what serial number the wet clutches started at . Lift all the floor panels and check if there is an oil leak from the front of the transmission , just in case it has a collapsed bearing . Once the floor panels are out of the road it should be easy enough to pull the clutch break apart .

 

[hector gemme]

This master cluch is wet cluch we can see the depp stick

 

[Billhook]

This master cluch is wet cluch we can see the depp stick

Not quite sure what you mean here Hector
Epirbalex I will remove the floor panels to see what has happened
Where is the serial number and would this tell me if it has a dry or wet clutch?

 

[hector gemme]

The tube for checking oil is bolted in front cluch housing and the dry cluch has no drive shaft joint

 

[Billhook]

The tube for checking oil is bolted in front cluch housing and the dry cluch has no drive shaft joint

So I just looked and found the dipstick which has is it red auto transmission fluid? up to the mark and the gearbox also is full. I was struggling to lift the footplates on may own and a friend is coming over tomorrow to help, but I did remove one on the left side and could see the ring with a torch. I was expecting to see bits and pieces of debris but. nothing visible so far
The ring looks very shiny and I assume I should be looking at the dull back of the brake band which may indicate that it has broken away and been flung off which would account for the noise I heard at the time

 

[epirbalex]

Not quite sure what you mean here Hector
Epirbalex I will remove the floor panels to see what has happened
Where is the serial number and would this tell me if it has a dry or wet clutch?

There are three places where you can find the serial number . Best place is the brass tag on the left rear side of the block few inches below the rear head . Second tag is on the rear of the dozer left had side , if the dozer has a winch on it you won't be able to read it . Third place is on the small flat area of the block below the magneto .The 2 following pictures are on a D4 , pretty much like the D7 position . Number is between the two sticks . I looked for a dip stick on mine last night and could not find one , it is either well hidden or the clutch relies on a plug to show level .

 

[hector gemme]

The auto transmission oil is no good for the cluch and all 17a have a wet master cluch and the master cluch housing should not be over full

 

[Billhook]

The auto transmission oil is no good for the cluch and all 17a have a wet master cluch and the master cluch housing should not be over full

I only said that it looked a bit like auto trans fluid, so is it special oil?

 

[Billhook]

There are three places where you can find the serial number . Best place is the brass tag on the left rear side of the block few inches below the rear head . Second tag is on the rear of the dozer left had side , if the dozer has a winch on it you won't be able to read it . Third place is on the small flat area of the block below the magneto .The 2 following pictures are on a D4 , pretty much like the D7 position . Number is between the two sticks . I looked for a dip stick on mine last night and could not find one , it is either well hidden or the clutch relies on a plug to show level .
View attachment 311229View attachment 311230

Unfortunately, the block cracked with a severe cold spell in 2017 and I had a "New" secondhand engine fitted. She also has a winch so cannot see the number there. But definitely established wet clutch, also hydraulic blade with three positions, straight, angle left and angle right so does that narrow down the numbers, I was told it was 1956 manufacture

 

[hector gemme]

The red oil is ATF transmission auto or oc46 hydrolic oil

 

[Billhook]

I have removed the foot plates and the brake band looks intact but the little lever on the pivot looks worn as in photos. Is this a fine piece of engineering tolerances or can I just gob a bit of weld on the end a file it
Looks as though it has been messed with before