D6c cat loss of oil pressure

[Tinkerer]

But was the head itself damaged in any way? What would you think about reinstalling a head subject to such abuse?
Mechanics 101.

Any head that was overheated like Steve's should be scrapped.

 

[olfolks]

I am starting to understand how MOM felt when AS the world turns went off the air

 

[thepumpguysc]

Post # 1062>> new head..
Lol> olfolks

 

[Wes J]

Any head that was overheated like Steve's should be scrapped.

I don't see why the head needs to be replaced if it's not cracked. Mag particle check or die pen testing is a must. Surface it, new guides, check that the seat have not sunk, leak test, etc.

 

[Tinkerer]

I don't see why the head needs to be replaced if it's not cracked. Mag particle check or die pen testing is a must. Surface it, new guides, check that the seat have not sunk, leak test, etc.

I don't know what all those tests and work would cost ? Any idea ? Just curious.
After all the mental turmoil Steve and his wife have gone thru, I'm certain he would want a new head, especially after he saw the photos and reading the report of what the head alone went thru.
Also the pros that did the analysis recommended a new head.
I am guessing its going to be Zieglers expense anyway.

 

[Birken Vogt]

I don't see why the head needs to be replaced if it's not cracked. Mag particle check or die pen testing is a must. Surface it, new guides, check that the seat have not sunk, leak test, etc.

I don't know what all those tests and work would cost ? Any idea ? Just curious.
After all the mental turmoil Steve and his wife have gone thru, I'm certain he would want a new head, especially after he saw the photos and reading the report of what the head alone went thru.
Also the pros that did the analysis recommended a new head.
I am guessing its going to be Zieglers expense anyway.

All those tests are standard practice anyway when you rebuild something. I guess if it survived all that abuse it should be the strongest head Cat ever made.

 

[Welder Dave]

After all this time and effort by people on this forum I can only hope that Steve finds a way to post up a video of this machine pushing a blade full of dirt just so we can have some feeling that the work was worth it!

Also hope that anyone new reading this has learned how important listening to people with experience and giving accurate replies to the questions they put forth is to the successful completion of a repair.

No one on this forum had anything to gain financially from this situation, unlike the dealer or outfit that supplied the replacement short block. So if someone said to check this or that or do this test, it was not so they could profit but understand the problem better.

I'm not a mechanic but it was obvious to me that the dealer was trying anything and everything to try and shift any responsibility off themselves. I'm sure the Cat team felt the same way and came to the right conclusion. I've been shafted before so when it's blatantly obvious someone else is going through it, I'll try to help them as much as I can. Without this forum, I think Steve would have had a much more difficult time getting to the same conclusion.

 

[Hobbytime]

View attachment 179763 Here is the full report from the professional failure analysis team that spent the whole day at Ziegler caterpillar in St Cloud one day last week.I hope all 9 pages uploaded! If not ,I will try again . Meeting went well. We came to a good agreement.I am getting my machine back with a full warranty on the engine and parts, All new original caterpillar parts, new pistons ,liners,camshaft and lifters ,new water pump, new head,all the labor included, plus delivery. I am responsible for the radiator recore expense.

wow, is that in writing? and before you agree are they detailing exactly what your new expense will be? if they are agreeing to that then that is a sure admittance from the dealer they screwed up big time, I would have them write that up and give it to you signed then tell them you want to radiator covered for all the time you didnt not have use of your dozer and all the aggravation they gave you and on top of that they were ready to bend you over raw, you deserve compensation for that and if it went to court you would get more....but its your call to determine if that deal covers all your pain....another question, they are going to let the same idiots try again to rebuild it? will the team that analyzed this failure inspect or sign off on the 3rd rebuild and testing to make sure its done correctly or can you have it shipped to another dealer that knows how to rebuild an engine? if in fact you have to pay anything more I would have in writing no further payments till the dozer is proven to work as it should and you should work it for a few months till you make any more payments to the dealer...

 

[thepumpguysc]

I think your right about getting "MORE" in court.. & I dont know how much p-u & delivery charges are BUT...
Don't you think it equals out?? Rad. VS delivery??
I think he did alright for not having to GO TO COURT..
{ personally, I'm w/ you Hobby but that's just "US"}
Steve.. what was your ORIGINAL BILL?? when you picked it up/it was done the 1st time..
You know.. when they shoulda replaced the rad. to begin with.. Lol

 

[Steve.ahlgren85]

I think your right about getting "MORE" in court.. & I dont know how much p-u & delivery charges are BUT...
Don't you think it equals out?? Rad. VS delivery??
I think he did alright for not having to GO TO COURT..
{ personally, I'm w/ you Hobby but that's just "US"}
Steve.. what was your ORIGINAL BILL?? when you picked it up/it was done the 1st time..
You know.. when they shoulda replaced the rad. to begin with.. Lol

Pretty close to $10,200!!!

 

[Steve.ahlgren85]

You have to consider court costs involved! My lawyer gave me some good advice ,he said try your best to work out your differences between parties involved.They were willing to help out alot,but I am putting forth also .Try to live by the golden rule, "Do unto others as you would have them to do unto you "Great bible passage!

 

[Hobbytime]

You have to consider court costs involved! My lawyer gave me some good advice ,he said try your best to work out your differences between parties involved.They were willing to help out alot,but I am putting forth also .Try to live by the golden rule, "Do unto others as you would have them to do unto you "Great bible passage!

I agree with that and the dealer tried its best to fuk you over the hardest they could till you called them on it with some backing from this thread...did you forget what they tried to do to you???? so the only reason they are caving in now and trying to make you happy is they would get their balls nailed to the wall if it went to court, and I agree with your lawyer and others to settle out of court, but you can do alot better and you need to remind the dealer of what they were trying to pull and also let cat corporate know what the dealer was going to pull as that all goes against cat reputation and I doubt the corporate bean counters would want that and with social media reaching around the globe, so will your story of a cat dealer screwing you over..what I would call fair is you get your dozer back in top running condition with a full warranty on the engine delivered to your door and nothing less for not 1 more nickel.I bet if you put that on the table and tell them if there is an issue with that you will take your chances in court,im sure they will cover the radiator too..at this point you have nothing to lose by calling them on that...yes you probably could get some more in court and also get legal fees covered by the dealer, but if you can get what I said then you can give up any extra and legal fees...

 

[Steve.ahlgren85]

NO....the only new expense to you should be the radiator and any labor directly related to fixing the radiator, anything failed by a clogged radiator is the dealers fault for not properly repairing and testing the dozer to make sure all is good....you are getting a ton of support from both guys in the industry and others that have businesses and have dealt with these issues of having equipment repaired and all of them are on your side that you have a good running dozer coming to you from this dealer at no more expenses other than the radiator and some minor related costs....the dealer is already backtracked on what they want just with the resistance you have given them so far, enter your lawyer and all the proof they screwed up and it seems cat corparate is even on your side from the comments you provided from him, so for a little more aggravation you should end up on top of this in the end, dont give up and try to explain to the wife all is not lost and the flower is about to bloom in your favor..

Wasn't it you that posted this hobby???

 

[Hobbytime]

Wasn't it you that posted this hobby???

that was before they caved and gave you almost everything you wanted, now that they showed 100% at fault, screw them and go for everything, before it was still a battle who would pay for what, this is how litigation goes, you keep getting a little more at a time, the dealer just folded their hand and you win and they know it, so you deserve the whole thing go and take it...if the report came back against you and they were still gona fight you then you have to decide at what time of the battle is satisfactory..but now you have them by the balls so squeeze hard, they lost and knew they were screwing you, so now its all in your favor show no mercy, because the dealer now knows with that report from cat will kill them if this hits court..so yes now I know they are done I changed my mind and would want them to pay it all..you took enough aggravation and im sure lots of stress at home with the mrs, so its your payday , if you wanted to really kill them goto court, but you can get more without going to court so having them pay for the radiator and related expenses is your compromise not to goto court..

just look at the change of events in the last few weeks it went from you losing everything and paying them $4000.00 more..they were looking to rape you and now they are offering to rebuild the engine with all cat parts and give a warranty..why do you think that is?? because they know they screwed up and were going to take royal advantage of you, but the evidence from cat people that did the report showed and proved the dealer wrong..the dealer didnt think twice before trying to hurt you, so its only fair you make the dealer feel a little pain back..
now if the dealer from the beginning was truly trying to work with you and was willing to cover the damage they did without trying to take your dozer and make you pay more then yeah you paying for the radiator would have been fair, but since they are proven wrong and tried to hurt you. all bets are off, go for the jugular..

 

[Wes J]

The OP is still going to have to pay for something. He brought them a broken engine. They tried to fix it once. Now they are going to fix it again.

It's not like he brought them a brand new engine and they screwed it up. He brought them a screwed up engine and they screwed it up again. The OP is still on the hook for getting it from broken to fixed. The failed attempt should be wiped clean, but they don't "owe" him a new engine.

 

[etd66ss]

I would agree that since they tried to bone Steve up the rear by offering to take the tractor off his hands and he pays $4000 or whatever it was, the gloves are off. They would get their asses handed to them in court for that!

CAT corporate ought to look at this dealership and decide if they want them to keep representing CAT, that is what I would be asking.

 

[Welder Dave]

He should try to get everything covered but a lawyer is a few thousand a day in court and even if he wins everything, it's very rare to also be awarded all your legal fee's. I think Steve might get compensatory damages in court too but anything can happen. A lot of times it depends on the particular judge and who they feel sympathetic to.

 

[Tinkerer]

They were willing to help out a lot,but I am putting forth also .Try to live by the golden rule, "Do unto others as you would have them to do unto you "Great bible passage!

Good for you Steve !
The world needs a lot more people with your belief and attitude. It is no wonder to me why you took all this in stride and got really decent results from Ziegler.
I live by what goes around comes around.

 

[Hobbytime]

The OP is still going to have to pay for something. He brought them a broken engine. They tried to fix it once. Now they are going to fix it again.

It's not like he brought them a brand new engine and they screwed it up. He brought them a screwed up engine and they screwed it up again. The OP is still on the hook for getting it from broken to fixed. The failed attempt should be wiped clean, but they don't "owe" him a new engine.

the OP brought them a broken engine agreed and he paid to get it fixed, so he already paid to have it fixed and then the dealer blamed the OP for the 2nd engine failure and wanted to screw him big time and for more money, so for that and all the time the dealer had the dozer that we now know for fact the dealer screwed up the 2nd engine they should also compensate for all the lost dozer time, so having them pay for the radiator can be considered their punitive damages for the dishonestly from the dealer, they plain out lied to the OP and wanted to take further advantage of him, this can be considered fraud on the dealers part, so if the dealer wants to push it, this can easily go from civil to criminal quite easily...I would even be tempted to go to the state district attorney and see if they would prosecute the dealer or parties involved for fraud..

 

[Welder Dave]

I think it would be a little different if the dozer was used as a source of income (owner/operator) and the owner lost work because of the downtime. I don't disagree that Steve shouldn't have to pay anything but I think it would be better if he got an agreement and a specific date that his dozer has to be on his property in perfect running order. Setting a court date will likely be about 3 month's away and even if Steve wins everything the dealer could stall around even longer. In fact winning in court doesn't guarantee you get paid. Sometimes you have to take further steps ($$$) to enforce the judgement. I think it's one of those times you have to pick your battles. If Steve can get the rad done for under 2K, I think is not too bad of a trade off. Also a lawyer will want money up front to go to court and no guarantee on the outcome. He could look into fraudulent actions by the dealer but that wouldn't result in any money in his pocket.