Cost of moving dirt...

[crazycajun]

What is the cheapest price a man could move dirt about 500-1000ft. about a 8 ft cut. it is over burden for a sand pit. so you would just dump the dirt back into hole after the dredge passses.. what would be the best way to do it...

 

[Squizzy246B]

A throw charge

I believe, and its fairly well documented, that the biggest dozer you can manage will do that relatively short distance in the most economical fashion with the least operators. It does depend on the material and any slope though.

 

[crazycajun]

Well i would need to move about 10,000 yards a day. and i think it would have to be hauled because it has to go around the dredge. i was thinking of adt's and a big excavator. i can load 4000 yards with my 330. i was hoping to move 10,000 with a 385. in a 10-12 hour shift, and price has to be around $1.25 per yard. We are dumping in a 100ft deep hole so a dozer isnt really needed. Think it's possible??

 

[BrianHay]

How about 4 637's tag teaming? I have never been the number cruncher on a job, but I do know that if the conditions are right on a haul that short we can cycle in 5 minutes. All 4 push pull loading in a train can be loaded and gone in under a minute. It takes some realy good operators and a good blade man on the haul roads though to keep the producting going that good. I was realy lucky when I was tag teaming like that. The guys I was working with were among the best I ever worked with.

 

[BrianHay]

As an after thought I should note that when we were putting out like that it was in near perfect conditions. Fairly flat ground with a 16H grader working with us and dumping in 8th gear. What a riot! loved every minute of it

 

[surfer-joe]

Scrapers would be fastest and probably cheapest. Either way you will need at least one dozer and a blade for haul road and clean up work. 627's would be good as would TS14's, 637 size for small amount of dirt like this is probably overkill, but they would move a lot of muck quickly.

Artic's and an excavator are slower, and you still need the blade and dozer. If ground conditions are really sloppy, then these might be better. Artic's don't come cheap, nor does a 385.

Course, you can top load scrapers with a hyd ex, if your operator is good, and careful!

Good Luck!

 

[Squizzy246B]

Well i would need to move about 10,000 yards a day. and i think it would have to be hauled because it has to go around the dredge. i was thinking of adt's and a big excavator. i can load 4000 yards with my 330. i was hoping to move 10,000 with a 385. in a 10-12 hour shift, and price has to be around $1.25 per yard. We are dumping in a 100ft deep hole so a dozer isnt really needed. Think it's possible??

So if you have to haul it and its loose spoil use a loader for ADT's rather than an excavator, this will half your loading time.

 

[crazycajun]

well it isnt loose dirt, and its 1400 acres 8 ft deep. i tried pull pans but the tractors couldnt get traction. i guess 637's would work. i have never been around one. how much dirt can one move and what does it cost?

 

[BrianHay]

As I said before I have never been the number cruncher on a job. But I do pay close attention to the people who are doing it and often ask them how we did in a day after they are done crunching them. So with that said here is my 2 cents. You can expect to get about 3000 yards per shift moved with each 37 or 2000 with a 27. They will run 12hrs on a tank of fuel no prob but after 13 they are running on fumes. (i can't remember for sure how much they hold but cats website will have that info). machinerytrader.com will give you a good idea on rental and puchase costs...huge $$ but huge production numbers to. As far as maintenance costs go I can't hazard a guess on that one. If you are not going with new I would consider the the series II E. Very good machine. Lots of power, operator friendly and they will keep up with the new G's.

 

[BrianHay]

I went and checked it out 27 holds 292 gallons and the 37 holds 335

 

[crazycajun]

so at 850 dollars a day for diesel, 1000 for a note and 250 for operator.
$2100 for 3000 yards. a cost of 70 cents per yard. so with a cost of 6300 per day i could move 9000 yards. then i would need motor grader and dozer?

 

[BrianHay]

A grader for the haul roads will be money well spent to keep the scrapers moving fast. But should be fine without a dozer. The scrapers and grader can take care of everything. Provided its not to soft that is. But I would see how things go without the dozer first....is it soft or was the tractor having troubles with traction due to sand?

 

[Mike J]

Hi,

did you mean 140 acres?

 

[crazycajun]

traction problems were from sand. and it's 1400 acres. needs to be destumped before we could start.

 

[BrianHay]

Ok if its sand you shouldn't need a dozer to work with the scrapers. Wide tires on the grader will help a lot though. One scraper on its own will have the same troubles the tractor did. But hook 2 or more together push pulling and they will have no problem. The good news for you is that when we were putting out those great production numbers it was in sand. Southeast Alberta is almost a desert. Once you get good haul roads established it will be good going. Bad news is that if its the scraper ops first time working in sand, its a little tricky to figure out the technique. But some things that help out big time are. Always load with the cushion hitch left on. This will likely be foreign to them and lots of guys will even tell you it will wreck it, but it won't. I learned that trick from a guy who worked for the same company for over 20 years as a scraper op. He ran the same scraper from new for 7 years and never in any conditions shut it off. They never had any problems with the hitch on it. I did the same with a 37 for 4 years after learning that and I became way more productive and never had any problems with my hitch. In the sand loading with the hitch off you can't get traction and the machine bounces violently every time you try to get on the throtte. But the second you kick it on it stops bouncing and grabs traction. As well when they are push pull loadig you can't pump load (this is when you keep diving the bowl in and pulling it back out). Scrapers should never be pump loaded, its usually the first sign of a green operator. But in the sand its 10 fold. In the fill the faster you are moving when you dump the easyer it is to spread smooth. If the grader runs through the fill for them once in a while it will help them out a lot.

 

[surfer-joe]

If you are going to be placing the spoil into a pit that a dredge has made, you will need the dozer. 637's can't swim.

 

[crazycajun]

yeah and i'm not sure if a motorgrader could roll that much dirt

 

[BrianHay]

Ok my bad. Guess I misunderstood. When I asked if it was wet and the response was no its just sand. I thought that meant mud was not an issue. If its 2 wet to knock a ramp into the hole for the scrapers to fill it on their own then obviously you need a cat. But I would still only use the cat long enough to make a ramp and pad over the mud enough for them to travel over it and dump on their own.

 

[BrianHay]

Btw I've never worked with a dredge so I realy don't know what that's all about. Is that like a dragline?....Or are we taking like dredging the bottom of a lake? if someone could clear that up for me that would be realy cool thanks.

 

[BrianHay]

Hey Joe I would just like to clear something up. Since I found this forum I have spent a lot of time reading through the threads. It is a great libray of knowledge. I think I have read nearly every thread pertaining to dirt and some of them more than once. Reading some of your past posts it is very obvious to me that you realy know your stuff and you are someone I could learn a great deal from (and have reading your posts). I love dozers too, have about 4 years on them. So I especially enjoyed your input into the thread what's better D8k or H. Great stuff!! So if I came across as trying to undermine your input in the beginning of this thread it was for surely not my intention. If ever I got the opportunity to sit down and have a good b.s session with you and listen to the stories you have to tell of the places you have been and the things you have done. I would jump on it. I have the utmost respect for men such as yourself. So with that said now that the conversation has turned to cats I'm going to be quiet and listen and learn.