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compact loader vs skid steer

Discussion in 'Compact Wheel Loaders' started by barklee, Jul 28, 2010.

  1. Bison

    Bison Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Messages:
    140
    Occupation:
    Bison rancher
    Location:
    Northern Alberta CAN
    I got a Waldon 500 articulated wheel loader and a ASV 4810 tracked skidsteer.
    The waldon (ancient)is build like a tank and will prob outlast the ASV. Its not to bad pushing snow with tire chains on the wheels,I find it very handy for jobs in tight places and inside buildings as it is only 4' wide and has lots of visabillity,it wont tear up the ground as a skidsteer will but is very rough riding on uneven ground.Mine lifts a tonne easy and has lots of pushing power.But it slower than the ASV
    It prob helped that i put a 140 hp 6.2 diesel in it.:D

    The ASV is mostly used on the brush cutter and mulcher,it moves much better on rough terrain than the waldon but maintenance cost are high(tracks and rollers)

    They both have their uses
     

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  2. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Waldon loader

    Bison I've got a Waldon 5000 too identical to yours. I added a skid quick mount plate and it's got the original Ford diesel engine which has been rebuilt once. How's you get the 6.2 diesel to match up to the pump? I've pretty well been advised by almost everyone I've talked to that the ASV track system is a maintenance problem and got the choice down to a Deere, Cat and Takeuchi.
     
  3. Bison

    Bison Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Messages:
    140
    Occupation:
    Bison rancher
    Location:
    Northern Alberta CAN
    Laketreefarm,if you look closely you can see the quik mount on the waldon,i build it myself,i think it is superiour to the skid mount.

    The orig vane pump was wore out.I put a commercial stackable pump on it,50 and 30 gal/min.I made a adaptor plate to mount it to the bellhousing of the 6.2 and it is driven by a splined shaft bolted to the flywheel and a matching coupler sleeve to the pump shaft.

    Any track system can be high maintenance.
    It depends on how one uses them, I think Cat uses the same system as ASV
     

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  4. AKRentalMan

    AKRentalMan Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2010
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Alaska
    Nice fabwork Bison! :cool:

    Best use for a compact loader is a one man show landscape in the summer/snow removal in the winter operation. The guy runs a Cat 906 and zips around town from job to job plowing parking lots ranging in size from residential to the local sears. He has a set of mounted turf tires for it also that make it almost zero disturbance to existing lawns for building retaining walls and such.

    Visibility is the vastly superior compared to skidsteers.
     
  5. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Compact loader vs skidsteer

    Well folks I demoed and looked at over 10 different machines and for this years purchase and to qualify for the 100% tax deduction expiring soon, we bought a Takeuchi CL-60 as a replacement for one of our Terex SCL 515's. For the first time in our memory we were offered a mid-size 14,000 loader for less than a large TL-250 track skidsteer. The dealers are cutting prices to dealer cost to sell machines in this economy. Even more of a surprise was to get it with hydraulic tool mount system, HD forks, HD bucket, extra skid steer conversion adapter, full cab and H-flotation tires all for under 50K.
    The previous post mentioned the ease a CL wheel loader moves around job to job. We agree and even more importantly that it's transport agility on it's own wheels is the very low maintenance of those very same wheels. No tracks and rollers to wear out, 2-3000 hrs. on a set of tires, better traction on rough terrain as the frame twists and with limited slip and locking available on both axles has lots of pushing power on the ground plus superior lifting power with bucket or forks. The only situation I would want a skid track loader is on a slope with wet ground. Now I'm on the hunt for deal on a Optimal 1400 55" tree spade to mount on our new loader.
     
  6. stuvecorp

    stuvecorp Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    307
    Location:
    lake wissota, wisconsin
    I like the small wheel loaders and have plowed with them but I think a big skid is better for how I roll. It gets to be a tougher arguement seeing some of the used prices for the small loaders. There is some jobs where a small loader would work good but I wouldn't want to grade with one although it could be done.

    Laketreefarm, that sounds sweet on your TK loader. Would like to see and hear about it more as I've never seen the TK loaders, but have ran the Cat 906 and Case 221/321.
     
  7. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Takeuchi CL 60

    We chose the Takeuchi over Terex, Deere, Cat, Kubota, JCB and New Holland for the following reasons:
    The engine access was supurb. Standard warrenty of 2 years. Instead of having a pivoting rear axle the CL 60 has a center pivot as part of the articulation which makes it more stable on slopes, puts the pivot up where it won't get dirty and is real easy to maintain, allows the entire front carriage to pivot instead on the entire machine as it crosses rough ground. Manual locking differentials on both front and back locks up all 4 wheels at the touch of the joystick button, gives real good breakout power. Hose pathway from front to rear was above the articulated joint, so easy to change out the hose and very protected where as some of the other machines had hoses running through or under the center joint thus prone to failure, The creep control is standard and hydraulically metered where all the other machines was a $2000 extra option, not available, or actually a disk brake on the drive-shaft to slow the machine for creep or inching and thus wearing the brake out. Very strong hydraulic pin mount bucket coupler rated at 10K more than twice as strong as a standard skid mount coupler. Came standard with a very HD digging 1.5 yd. digging bucket with most of the others supplied a HD bucket only as an option. 22+ GPM (can be adjusted higher) standard Aux valve flow is as good as many of the other optional hi-flows.Came standard with very nice quiet cab with excellent visibility. Standard 4 front halogen lights and two rear lit up 270+ degrees, some of the other loaders only offered small little backup lights and extra cost to get big lights. Very HD solid 1" loader arms with nice parallel lifting action. 8500 working load and 10K plus tipping load gave big loader capacity in a compact machine. Dealer threw in 10K quick mount forks and hi-flotation industrial grade tires to close the deal. We ordered a skid mount plate to quick coupler adapter also made by Takeuchi so we can use all our existing skid mount tools with the Takeuchi mount system. The auto brakes and joystick button direction changes were flawless with no sudden jerks we experienced on several other loaders we demo'd. I'll have to work with it some before I can report more of it's abilities on slopes, digging and if it has any bugs the engineers missed. We ordered the tires foam filled as we plan to use the machine in demo work and brush clearing with a shredder when it's not on landscape and snow plowing jobs. Best of all we get a 100% deduction we can save for 5 years and write this machine off in any year we want as a normal business expense.:D
     
  8. moore

    moore Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    illinois
    ive operated both. we have a T190 bobcat and ive operated a 902 CAT. skid steers are better for final grading and landscape jobs and are really handy because they can of course turn on a dime. a compact wheel loader would be better loading and unloading stuff and moving stuff. as for tracks vs tires on a skid steer i like tracks more. they dont tear up the ground near as much, you dont have to replace them as often, and you cant get flat tires. but tracks suck when you have to plow snow. they dont have any grip and just slide around.
     
  9. PipeGuy

    PipeGuy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    79
    Location:
    Indiana
    I'm a water and sewer contractor. I do a lot of HDD. I just purchased a JD 304J. We have close to 2000 hrs on it. The cost is higher than a skid but it will lift more travel faster and is much more comfortable to sit in for 10 hrs / day. I think they will last twice as long as a skid or CTL also. Many of the skids I see are pretty much beat by about 3000 hrs. I orginally looked at the 244J but I found a pretty good deal on teh 304. It has a 1.4 yd bucket. I have an adapter plate for all skid steer attachments. I have a power rake that I use on the 304J. You can see it much better than if it was mounted on a skid.
     
  10. DGODGR

    DGODGR Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2009
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    791
    Location:
    S/W CO
    Are you sure about that?
     
  11. Colorado Digger

    Colorado Digger Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,169
    Location:
    Carbondale,co
    try one of these. but i will take a bobcat s300 all day.:usa:usa:usa:usa
     

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  12. dr_gonzo

    dr_gonzo New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2011
    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Ft. Simpson
    I'm currently looking at compact loaders for a start up. I'm looking to haul logs for milling,build trails,etc. I'm wondering about forest mulching compatibilities...would a hydraulic unit work with a compact loader? Just questions to think about...I thought of a skid,but I'm thinking a small loader's the way to go...any ideas out there?
     
  13. pconnelly

    pconnelly Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2009
    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    We are running a Bobcat 963G. I have 2 sets of wheels, pneumatic and foam filled. I have run the foam filled with Loegering over tire tracks. That combination can drive anywhere!

    The 963 is actually 105 hp and very low profile. Its been great in tight places. It's so heavy that we try not to do much turning on muddy roads but great in the woods. It has the high flo attachment for grapples etc. Very powerful machine!
     
  14. Topwater

    Topwater Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Nipawin
    I'm looking at the skid steers and the compact loaders right now. I really want the compact loader but there doable the price of a skid steer so i'll probably get the skid steer just because there cheaper
     
  15. KSSS

    KSSS Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2005
    Messages:
    2,958
    Occupation:
    excavation
    Location:
    Idaho
    Compact wheel loaders are cool but man they are expensive.
     
  16. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Skid vs compact loaders

    Compact loaders are cheaper than ever and in many cases cheaper than same size skid. We just compared a Takeuchi TL-250 and Takeuchi CL-60 and ended up buying the CL-60 wheel loader for $10K less than the Tak-250.($46K) including hi-flotation tires, 2 yard HD bucket, HD forks and skid to pin mount adaptor plate. It lifts 10K, travels at 12 mph and has greater visibility. The Tak 250 can go on steeper slopes and greasier mud than the wheel loader. However tires outwear tracks years longer.
     
  17. KSSS

    KSSS Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Occupation:
    excavation
    Location:
    Idaho
    I don't see a compact wheel loader and CTL in the same catagory.
     
  18. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Compact wheel loader v compact track loader

    Well almost identical weights, both use skid plate attachments, both used for identical work, both often have identical engines or very close to same horsepower, similar widths and heights (wheel loaders are usually longer) which is an advantage in stability and load carrying/lifting capacities ( usually a ton or more better in same size machine) Skids and track loaders can turn in own length but in doing so tear up the ground and churn mud. Wheel loaders tiptoe on environmentally sensitive surfaces, can move under their own power from job to job, while skids and tracks need to be hauled if moving over a 1/2 mile. Wheel loaders are, faster and superior snow pushers and loading out in all circumstances. Skids and tracks dig better and handle slopes better. Tracks are high maintenance, skids medium maintenance and wheel loaders low maintenance. Skids and tracks beat you up while most wheel loaders are usually quite comfortable. Exceptions are ASV's great riding, but very high maintenance suspension system and older wheel loaders with fixed axles which are hard on their operators. I have used wheel loaders as tool carriers since the 70's (my first was a AC 540) also used/owned NH 190 skids and ASV RC-80 tracks and my wheel loaders are still working, my oldest a 1978 Waldon has only had one engine overhaul and one starter in 15,000 plus hours, while my skids and tracks expired or became high maintenance and worn out at 6-8000 hrs. I currently work 5 wheel loaders and they do it all .:D
     
  19. Marc V

    Marc V Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2009
    Messages:
    9
    Occupation:
    General Contractor
    Location:
    New Hampshire
    Hey LakeTreeFarm how is the Takeuchi working out? I may be in the market to replace my 2001 Kubota R420 and Takeuchi is on my list of possibilities.
     
  20. laketreefarm

    laketreefarm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    59
    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Frankfort KY
    Post purchase comments on Takeuchi CW 60 wich is now available for lease or sale

    Takeuchi CW-60 (made by Atlas in France) has been a great machine so far with just one problem (Bosch starter malfunction) which dealer corrected within 2 days with new starter. Outlifts a skid easily and drives like a Caddie. Very comfortable cab. We do wish we had bought the CW-65 instead of the CW-60 as the CL-65 comes with factory air while the CW-60 did not. This summer has been so hot that air would have been nice. Windows and doors lock open and running the cab fan helps. The two features we like best are the hydraulic creep pedal (3 pedals on the floor, gas,brakes and creep) which allows you to go really slow with high rpm's like when you need to creep up to dump into a truck or to run a rotary broom or trencher. We also like the HD pin quick coupler system that is so much heavier than the skid plate mount system. We ordered it with a skid adaptor plate so we can also use it with all our older skid tools. Visibility is excellent in all directions. The only operational caveat is that it's not as slope capable as a skid. Straight up and down a slope is good but go crossslope and it lifts a front wheel as a warning that the balance is changing. All in all a great machine> That said we need work for it. In 8 months of ownership we've only put 41 hrs. on it (we have 4 other loaders so I told the guys to minimize use on the new Takeuchi) and currently have it For lease or sale at $58,000 which is way under list. So if you need a machine we can lease it with very low payments as we paid cash and it's better if it's working than sitting. This economy is a killer for landscapers/dirt movers and we're going long distances to find work. We're partnering and subbing just to keep busy. :mad:
    540-397-1367