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Cat 3000 Hour Code

Discussion in 'Compact Track/Multi Terrain Loaders' started by Kenskip1, Feb 23, 2020.

  1. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Sometimes it's just a matter of asking the right questions. If the dealer is propsing to strip the machine down, send the removed DPF away to a 3rd party supplier and have it cleaned, then reinstalled when it's returned I can see it certainly taking more than the "couple of days" that 92U3406 mentioned above in post #32.

    At that point the next logical question would be - "OK, that's 3 weeks if you send my DPF away for cleaning and wait for it to come back. Do you have a service exchange/Reman program for that job and if so how much does that cost..?"
     
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  2. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    For something like a DPF, I very much doubt it bearing in mind the wide variety of units that are out there. They're far more likely to send it out to a company that specializes in cleaning them.
     
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  3. Mark250

    Mark250 Senior Member

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    DPF filter location
    upload_2020-3-4_16-19-53.png
    upload_2020-3-4_16-21-6.png
    upload_2020-3-4_16-22-21.png
     
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  4. JD955SC

    JD955SC Senior Member

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    We clean ours. Each branch that has a truck shop has a DPF machine and our turnaround time is pretty quick. Now of course that’s the ones that are round and come apart I am not sure about some of the funny shaped ones.

    I can definitely see a longer time if it has to be sent out.
     
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  5. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Holy cr@p. Never was the expression “a quart squeezed into a pint pot” more apt....
     
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  6. 92U 3406

    92U 3406 Senior Member

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    The above photo is from a 299D/272D. Those use the C3.8. The smaller machines in the Cat lineup use the C3.3B and they have "slightly" more room. Oh yes, the rad does lift up. But only about 4 inches.
     
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  7. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Getting that DPF out the back of a skid steer reminds me of the story about the lady surgeon who enrolled in a car maintenance class. After the test at the end of the class she was awarded a 150% score by the teacher - 100% for doing everything in the test perfectly and an additional 50% for doing it all via the exhaust pipe & muffler.........
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2020
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  8. Cmark

    Cmark Senior Member

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    Removing the cooling pack is a prerequisite to doing just about anything on the D series skid steers. It isn't that difficult though.
     
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  9. PetersPatioLandscape

    PetersPatioLandscape Member

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    This reinforces my trade machines right around 2000hrs theory.
     
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  10. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    Jeez, if that was us we'd be changing machines 3-4 times a year ...!!
     
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  11. PetersPatioLandscape

    PetersPatioLandscape Member

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    We do landscaping and our machines don't run all day everyday. We trade machines every few years.
     
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  12. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    I guess it will work as long as your income stays up and you don't mind making payments, endlessly.
     
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  13. PetersPatioLandscape

    PetersPatioLandscape Member

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    We only make payments when its 0%. We only put a few hundred hours on a year typically. We do a lot of paver patios so there are a fair amount of days the loaders sit and only move pallets around as they are needed. It seems like once you get over the 2k hour mark you start to have more issues.
     
  14. Birken Vogt

    Birken Vogt Charter Member

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    I'm no fan of being in hock for everything, but you have to think of it as "making payments" even if you own the machine outright. Opportunity cost for the money and all that. Of course in this era of 0% interest the opportunity is low. Of course the interest on financing is low also.
     
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  15. KSSS

    KSSS Senior Member

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    I always find these conversations interesting. I don't know that there is a universal right answer for everyone. A SSL/CTL for nonproduction type work, making endless payments on a machine that holds that kind of role is hard to understand. So running them longer would seem be a better value. The same machine that is instrumental in the success of a business it can make more sense to rotate earlier, even if that includes payments at least to me. It is not just an hourly or mechanical breakdown issue for me to replace, but also what additional productivity (if any) a new machine can bring. Money has been cheap for a long time, and that allows for options that are not available when interests rates are high. There is a long list of effects that drive buying decisions and they vary in importance for everyone. Nige are you putting 6-8K hours on a SSL/CTL a year?
     
  16. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    When I was appraising for the Cat dealer I ran into this stuff all the time. Someone buys a small machine and runs it till the first big maintenance item, like undercarriage is nearly worn out and then wants to trade it in trying to avoid the cost. It doesn't work at the franchised dealer level that has people like me on staff as the cost to repair is taken out of the trade value up front and the salesmen then adds another years worth of payments or another point on the interest rate and we just start the show all over again. That's why I say you have to be high balling in order to support that type of cycling capital cost. It will work when you figure all the inputs and outputs, finance costs, taxes, ,maintenance, repairs, people costs and income and monitor them close. I've also seen the blood bath in 2008 catch a few of those guys on the payment cycle who brought the machines back and dumped them in the yard saying they couldn't make the payments anymore.
     
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  17. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    As John rightly says, dealers are neither stupid nor are they running a charity. Anyone who goes to trade a machine that is coming up to major component or undercarriage replacement then the value of doing that work will be factored into the offered trade-in price. Nothing is free.

    KSSS - our SSLs will probably clock around 2-3k hours a year. My comment was more related to our general fleet working 24/7/365, but the same philosophy still applies. The chassis is IMO the critical item, so long as it’s repairable then everything else is bolt-on and and can be replaced ad infintum so long as the chassis remians good. Our excavators, dozers & graders are set for an 80k life, trucks 120k.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
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  18. 512high

    512high Well-Known Member

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    Boy some great comments! I do commercial snow plowing during the winter months, however thank god two out of our three lots were contract, crappy winter here in the northeast ( I'm located 38 miles north of Boston), with that said, we had a 2011 John Deere 244J compact wheel loader, travel speed 18.9 mph, we rode to various lots most within 2-4 miles from our shop, did not have a skid steer coupler, NO RIDE CONTROL!

    We bought it used, 2014 for $48,000, had about 2,100 hours when we bought it, sold it to a friend who has a landscape company wanted it for yard and snow removal, our shop is heated and always was garage and cleaned. February 2019 I sold it to him with 2,440 hours give or take, again sits all spring-Fall , just used in the winter months, sold it for $45,000, I found a CAT 908M, pretty well loaded, Travel speed 22 MPH option , 1,200 hours, CAT just did oil change/filters, diffs, wheels etc,(owner was OCD) , he wanted $70,000 for the machine, I offered $64,500 he accepted. So I took the $45,000 from the Deere I sold,(I owed nothing on machine), And put in another $19,500 cash, I am 57 now, and finally I don't have any payments, etc., yes, a lot of my stuff is old(er) but very good shape etc.

    Now the CAT 908M again will be used for just snow, we have a Metal pless wing plow, few more HP and weight then the 244J, I was told this machine today with all the options is over $108,000 ! for a baby CAT! Holy Crap......but when I see zero percent financing its a tough one, yes a small machine , for us a good size based on our lots, but down the road for service, who knows, but we own it out right, maybe I paid too much for the 908M, but I checked online, seemed to be in check, But I will say you "Pros" bring up valid points , this is a great site.

    I also want to thank everyone that is always offering to help us novices!
     
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  19. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    After reading this post again I probably need to add a caveat here.
    I fix 'em, I don't buy the new ones or have to sell the older machinery (although TBH usually when we're finished with them cutting them up for scrap is probably the most likely option).
    So my comments above are purely from a "repairability" perspective. I let the bean counters worry about their beans, I have enough to worry about with my own sh1t without worrying about anyone else's....... :confused::confused:
     
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