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Cat 2017 259d loses power and is sluggish

Nige

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I thought you said that the water separator bowl was only half full when you had the problem with the power loss.? Is it still the same.? It may be full when you first start up but what is it like when it becomes sluggish.?

See the link I posted above. Refer to the illustration of the fuel filter in Post #20 on Page 1.
Remove the entire fuel filter assembly from the machine, remove the element, then finally remove ALL the fuel line fittings and blank plugs from the head.
Clean each of the passasges in the filter head using either compressed air or by pushing a length of wire through it.
Then make sure all the fittings are clean by blowing through each one in turn.
Reassemble everything and see how you go.
 

Cgray

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The fuel separator wasn’t filling due to the bad fuse/priming pump, I was hoping that was the issue, but when it was running sluggish, I checked the separator and it was full.
 

Nige

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I would pull the separator anyway and clean the head. It's another box ticked.
Also don't forget to check the O-Rings in the head. Again the thread linked above touches on that subject also. @heymccall posted some info regarding what he found.

The next step would be to drain any water & sediment from the fuel tank. That's the logical place to start when diagnosing any fuel issue.
 

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  • Fuel Tank.pdf
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Cgray

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I would pull the separator anyway and clean the head. It's another box ticked.
Also don't forget to check the O-Rings in the head. Again the thread linked above touches on that subject also. @heymccall posted some info regarding what he found.

The next step would be to drain any water & sediment from the fuel tank. That's the logical place to start when diagnosing any fuel issue.
I’ll try that tomorrow morning
 

Nige

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I take it that when the engine power loss occurs there are no messages regarding Diagnostic Codes or Events appearing on the screen at that time.? None of the digital gauges suddenly reading "weird".?

Press the soft key located directly under the "settings icon" (#40) on the screen. That should get you into the Main Menu. Scroll and find the "Service" section and then to the "Diagnostics" sub-menu. AFAIK it should have 4 sub-sections - Active Diagnostic Codes, Logged Diagnostic Codes. Active Events, & Logged Events.
First check for any Active Diagnostic Codes or Events.
If there are none then go to the sub-menu for the Logged Codes/Events. Take a note of everything that is listed there, noting also the hour meter reading at which the Code/Event occured. Post back with your findings.

1685034632175.png
 

Cgray

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No active events, logged events are E459-2, E875-2, E876-1,
No active diagnostics, logged diagnostics are 653-1 engine
652-3 engine
653-3 engine
41-4 machine
91-3 machine
144-5 machine
346-5 machine
350-3 machine
458-3 machine
458-4 machine
1627-5 machine
There are not any clock time reading on any of the alerts
 

Nige

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There are not any clock time reading on any of the alerts
I was afraid of that. I think maybe ET would be the only way of relating Codes/Events to Diagnostic Clock hours, bugger.

Starting with the Events. E875-2 is low system voltage, E876-1 is high system voltage. Could be an indication of an alternator starting to go on the fritz or nothing more than a battery connection that needs to be removed, cleaned, reinstalled & tightened. You should do that anyway as a next step.

I left the doozy for last. E459 is a "power mismatch" Event. Sometimes this can be so serious that the engine won't even start. I have something regarding E459 that I'll send to you on a PM.
 

Cgray

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Not sure when the codes appeared, but I’m leaning on the electrical having been when changing the fuse block/disconnectin connections, when I was spraying the contact cleaner
 

Nige

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Not sure when the codes appeared, but I’m leaning on the electrical having been when changing the fuse block/disconnectin connections, when I was spraying the contact cleaner
The three in the engine that I'm going to dicsuss below are created from within the Engine ECM, so very unlikely that they are related to you messing with the wiring, which I assume you did with the key off. Most or all Codes/Events will only register when the key is ON.
logged diagnostics are 651-3 engine, 652-3 engine, 653-3 engine.
These three below are specifically related to the E459, or at least I am reasonably certain that they are, and the 2nd one should explain your loss of power...........

651-3 TWV1 Driving Circuit Error. Battery voltage is normal. Open circuit of discharge in ECM
652–3 TWV4 Driving Circuit Error. During injection. Engine derates 25%.
653–3 TWV2 Driving Circuit Error. CPU is normal. EGR stops.

So in summary remove/clean/reinstall all the battery connections, repeat with all the ground cables you can find (I think there are 6 in total) and do the specific stuff I sent you related to the E459 Event.
 

Nige

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Do you have a diagram where the six grounds are located?
They're on the schematic I sent to you which is searchable.
Go to the schematic on Page 8 and search for "GND" or "GROUND" using the Acrobat search function.
Locations such as the example below will pop up. Hover your cursor over the Hyperlink and click, it will take you to an illustration (on Page 16 on this example) of where the ground strap is located on the machine. Hover your cursor over the "35" hyperlink and and click again; it should take you back to the same location on the schematic from where you originally started.

The ground strap locations I found were 35, 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 158, 159, 160, 161, 162, 163, and 164.

1685045903292.png1685046051375.png

One of them on the engine block you will be checking as part of the E459 issue.
Also check the engine ECM which may have its own short ground strap from the ECM body to one of the mounting bolts.
 

Cgray

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They're on the schematic I sent to you which is searchable.
Go to the schematic on Page 8 and search for "GND" or "GROUND" using the Acrobat search function.
Locations such as the example below will pop up. Hover your cursor over the Hyperlink and click, it will take you to an illustration (on Page 16 on this example) of where the ground strap is located on the machine. Hover your cursor over the "35" hyperlink and and click again; it should take you back to the same location on the schematic from where you originally started.

The ground strap locations I found were 35, 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 158, 159, 160, 161, 162, 163, and 164.

View attachment 286852View attachment 286853

One of them on the engine block you will be checking as part of the E459 issue.
Also check the engine ECM which may have its own short ground strap from the ECM body to one of the mounting bolts.
All I had was my phone, thanks
 

Cgray

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Did you get any further yet.?
I have a feeling that one or more of the high-voltage injector driver circuits inside the ECM are breaking down when the ECM warms up.
I haven’t checked the grounds, (been busy), but I’m not thinking that’s the issue.
 

Nige

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I haven’t checked the grounds, (been busy), but I’m not thinking that’s the issue.
It's simply one of the diagnostic steps on the way to finding the root cause. I agree that there is a chance it's probably not the issue but unless you have cleaned all the grounds and ticked the box the process can't move one.

I'm trying everything I know here to avoid you having to buy a replacement $2k ECM, but if you want to shell out for one right now knock yourself out, don't let fear stop you..........
 

Cgray

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It's simply one of the diagnostic steps on the way to finding the root cause. I agree that there is a chance it's probably not the issue but unless you have cleaned all the grounds and ticked the box the process can't move one.

I'm trying everything I know here to avoid you having to buy a replacement $2k ECM, but if you want to shell out for one right now knock yourself out, don't let fear stop you..........
I understand process of elimination, I’ve got the grounds on the schedule for the weekend
 
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