case 580b overhaul and transmission

[Papa Goose]

Thanks Phil, that's really helpful. There's a pipe plug in the pressure regulator that looked suspiciously un-original, and your graphic confirms that this is where the temp sensor is supposed to be. I know I should probably just go get a new sensor, but I've got an IC temp transducer already mounted in a 3/8" pipe plug, so I'm going to put that in so I can monitor the actual temps for a while. I don't have any reason to believe they're going to be high, but I'd like to know what's "normal" for my machine.

 

[oh Danny Boy]

New guy with 580b power problem

Ok I'm brand new to this so bare with me. I took my 580b to the mechanic because it was not powering up hills. Gas pedal to the floor and engine sounded OK. Hydrolic fluid dripping out starter. Mechanic said engine rebuild. He rebuilt the engine and I got screwed still low power and still dripping out starter. It sounds like a 1/2 diagnosis or bad one. Anyway I've learned alot and told it's tranny issues probably front seal. Before I find a new mechanic can anyone tell me the best and worst case senarios for the issues it could be. It has shuttle shift and no hi or low range just straight gears I guessed you'd say. Any help would be appreciated I'm not a mechanic but I understand basic engine tranny talk.

 

[Phil]

Danny,
It sounds like you have a torque converter drive model, in simple terms you cannot stall this engine by driving into something immovable and not releasing the clutch.

Oil dripping out the starter is the 'starter to torque tube' gasket, or the seal in the starter itself. These machines have a wet flywheel housing so the starter has to be sealed or it will fail, sooner or later.

There is a 'My 580B won't even move' thread here and I suggest you read it also, from beginning to end. The B was a sluggish machine especially when cold and any hill you climb with it ,off road, will probably have to be in first gear. Does your shuttle pressure dash gauge work? Phil

 

[oh Danny Boy]

thanks and a couple more things

Phil, Thanks for the information. The thing that worries me is I had a JD 400 and you could put the bucket down and scrape the dirt up like crazy. I can hardly scoop a bucket of loose dirt and we could barely get the backhoe up the trailer backwards. Can you comment a little further on that and I'll check out the thread you mentioned. Thanks for your time.:usa

 

[oh Danny Boy]

one more thing

I'll check the pressure guage in a day or two. It seems to have trouble in first gear which I call a creeper gear scooping dirt or going a small hills.

 

[Phil]

Danny,
A 'B' should spin it's wheels in 1st gear, on dry ground, while pushing into a bank of dirt. Loose dirt, no problem, it should fill the bucket. Backing up on to a float...some of those ramps are pretty steep, but yes, rev it up enough and it should do it, although it does make them work hard.

I think I would still take a 'B' over any other backhoe from that time period. Compared to a later C model though, there is a noticeable difference in the way they climb hills.

A 'B' model was known for not wanting to move at first when cold, like at freezing temp and below. Once moving they were okay. Some will park them on a grade or just lift the rear wheels off the ground and get them spinning.

Another thread here to look at is: My first backhoe-580B

As a start, take a look at the shuttle oil level, the dipstick is in a cover, just in front of the trans gearshift cover. It has a big hex head on it. You have probably already checked this. Pull one of the torque tube's 2 drain plugs, the rear one(1"socket), located directly underneath the shuttle dipstick, at the very bottom of the casting. Take a small sample of oil and see if it has any aluminum grindings in it. I really want to know if your dash gauge works and if so is it in the green. Phil

 

[Matt580B]

Hi people! Lots of great info here. I found a 580B close to where I live, and of course it has the "wont move" problem. I tried to PM papa goose, but I don't think I have enough posts yet. I just want to know a little more about your machine if possible, so I can maybe compare it to what I might be buying. Can you try to PM me? Thanks!

 

[Phil]

Matt,
I see you posted over on Papa's thread too. Regarding buying a 580B with shuttle problems(torque converter drive), I think the buyer should generally be prepared for some major work. One should be mechanically inclined and have a good hoist. A hoist on wheels is best, I suppose an automotive engine puller may work, not sure about that.

Sometimes it's a simple fix, but one should be prepared for the worst(splitting the tractor). I think there are 2 old threads here, My 580B won't even move, and My first backhoe 580BCK. These two big threads have lots of pictures and info in them.

A 580CK or BCK that won't move could present a buying opportunity, if the price is right, but keep in mind that used parts are hard to find. That is, the parts you need. New parts are still available from Case, so far.

As I recall a good working dash gauge will tell you if the pump is working. If at idle the gauge goes up in the green, after shifting to forward or reverse, the problem is generally in the shuttle assembly itself. With the transmission in gear, you shouldn't hear a whine, like shafts moving, or the problem is farther back.

Some 580B's have a big 'R' or a 'T' stamped on the right side of the serial # plate, on the steering column. A 'T' could mean a Twin Disc shuttle assembly. These are hard to work on, and require a press, unlike the Rockwell unit.

In general, I think one should consider buying a newer Case, like the C or D model, unless you want the challenge of the older design. Phil