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Buying Case 1845B with drive problems?

Discussion in 'Skid Steers' started by mmurray70, Sep 12, 2019.

  1. mmurray70

    mmurray70 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2019
    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    canada
    Hi guys, Im considering buying a Case 1845B for cheap (around $3000 US), but it has some drive issues. The owner only had it for plowing snow around his house and really doesn't know much about the machine or heavy equipment in general. He said the machine jams up on the left side in reverse and makes a clicking sound in forward. Its been parked for 2 years now since it developed this problem.

    The machine was 3 hours drive away but i couldn't stop thinking about it and decided to drive out and take a look at it today. I was crossing my fingers that this was a problem with the park brake and not the hydraulics, and sure enough after fiddling with the park break mechanism it ran fine in reverse and forward, smooth as silk with no clicking! The engine ran great, tires were brand new, and rest of hydraulics were in good shape so I said I would buy it. But my excitement of fixing this machine soon ended unfortunately. As we were moving the machine for a couple mins to gather up all the attachments, it lost power on the right side. No funny noises or load on the engine, just no response at all from moving the controls all the way ahead and back.

    I did a bit of reading about the hydro static drive system before driving out to look at it and it seems like this can be a major problem. Pumps and motors are very expensive, and most likely discontinued. So I decided to pass on the machine. Should I reconsider? Could this be an easy fix? Could the machine being parked for a couple years cause it to get air locked or something? Let me know what you guys think could be wrong with it, and if I should buy it or keep looking. Thanks
     
  2. phil314

    phil314 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2014
    Messages:
    169
    Location:
    Otsego, Mn
    If it's like the 1845c, the drive pump is connected to the hand controls with mechanical linkages.
    It would definitely be worth pulling the seat out and checking the linkages on top of the pump and make sure they are moving the drive spool lever on the top of the pump. Those would be a simple fix and could explain the problem.
     
  3. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
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    Occupation:
    Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
    Location:
    Central New York, USA
    I'd have to do some digging but being a "B" I believe the hand levers are connected to the swash plates in the pumps. I seem to recall at least one 1845 where the lever was loose on the shaft coming out the side of the pump.

    As to whether you should buy it or not that would be tough to answer without being there in person. I would expect that the asking price should at least drop a good amount due to the unknown problem. It could be something as simple as a bit of crud getting caught in a relief valve or a major failure of a pump or drive motor or speed reducer attached to the drive motor.

    Just one more thought, can you remove the covers on top of the right side chain box and see if the chain from the speed reducer to the center drive gear is broke? That would be a relatively easy fix!

    In picture below that chain would be the one going from Gear #11 to Gear #27. The covers are on top of the chain case above the two Gears #35, should only need to remove the front one to see the chain in question.
    Drive chains.png
     
  4. CASE1234

    CASE1234 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2016
    Messages:
    56
    Location:
    MISSOURI
    from what you are saying it sounds more like a drive chain issue. there are four inspection plates. plastic on top of case. two on each side. easy to check .I installed a new chain on my left side for 85 bucks so there not expensive. also could be a bad wheel bearing especially if they haven't been lubricated. an easy fix. hard to say but if it were me I would go back and see if you can pull those covers and if you think that is the problem offer him some what less and see what he says. pats are available for those machines good luck
     
  5. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
    Location:
    Central New York, USA
    Some of the older machines had flat steel covers. The plastic ones are good as long as someone hasn't got carried away and over tightened the nuts and cracked them!

    I do have to wonder if this machine had a problem in the parking brake pins and cables if someone damaged the small drive chain that goes around the gear marked #27 in the above picture and it just happened to fail while you were moving it.

    We had one of these where some so called "operator" managed to rip the pin guides right out of the frame either by putting in park while moving or trying to get machine to move with brake pins engaged. That was a fun project to fix! Just needed a little creative engineering to line those guides back up to weld back in place!

    If that machine was close to me I might be tempted to offer the guy $2,000 US for it as is!
     
  6. heymccall

    heymccall Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,492
    Location:
    Monroeville, Pa
    Block tires on working side. Jack up offending side. Disengage parking brake. Rock top of each tire front to back. Movement should be about an inch of rotate. Anymore and the driven chains are too loose.
    Remove front inspection cover on offending side. Rock front tire back and forth with more force while looking at drive chain. Slap in drive chain should be minimal.
     
  7. mmurray70

    mmurray70 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2019
    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    canada
    We had the machine on blocks at first so we could look at the first problem which turned out to be the park brake sticking. Once that problem was fixed both sides turned over very smooth both forward and reverse, I really doubt theres anything wrong with the planetary gears. I checked for up/down and side/side play in all the wheels and they all seemed tight too, bearings seemed good. Also checked the rotation and all 4 tires moved about an inch or less, no signs of really loose chain, although i did not pull covers to inspect it.

    Im thinking the problem is in the hydraulics somewhere. Seemed to loose power gradually, not like a chain popped off all of a sudden, but it is possible. I've been doing some reading and its not uncommon for damaged pumps to loose power after a few minutes of operation once the fluid warms up. Been looking at the diagrams of the pumps and yes, it looks like the linkages control the swash plate directly on the 1845b. Thats pretty cool, nice and simple without any pilot circuits to cause more problems. The linkages were turning the input shaft on the pump. I have read that these pumps/motors are no longer available, but looks like you can still get the pistons and valve plates to rebuild them, and prices are not terribly bad so thats good news.

    Does anybody know exactly how the cab comes off on these for service? I see that it slides ahead on the 1845C, but the B model seems different in the parts diagrams. Does it need to be lifted off instead? How heavy is it? How much work is involved with this? Depending on how much trouble it is to fix this pump, I may need to remove the cab several times. Im guessing this wont be much fun.

    I was thinking offering a little lower as well. I might give it a few more days, if it doesnt sell maybe he will be more likely to drop price. It needs work for sure, but should make a good machine after repairing a few things.
     

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  8. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
    Location:
    Central New York, USA
    As I think I said before it's been years since I worked on a 1845 or 1845B but I don't recall the cabs moving on them like the "C's".

    Seems I recall just having to remove seat pan and the floor panel that your feet rest on while operating the machine. There is also a belly pan as I recall that gives a bit of access to the bottom.

    Think to get the pumps out we may have removed them one section at a time. Starting with the gear pump at the very front for the boom and bucket then the two drive pumps one at a time. The "C" was much easier once the cab was slid ahead for sure!