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Bad turbo 160 Deere (pics)

Discussion in 'Excavators' started by Canadian_digger, Nov 14, 2007.

  1. Canadian_digger

    Canadian_digger Senior Member

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    So the turbo went on our 2003 160clc Deere today. It only has 4300hrs on it. Looks like the shaft snaped in two. What do you guys think?
     

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  2. Dozerboy

    Dozerboy Senior Member

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    Yep its broke...maybe some JB Weld...:D








    I would guess a casting flaw.
     
  3. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    That's the cold side. My first thought, I'm wondering what went through there. Broken impellers say foreign material got swallowed. It wouldn't take much more than a pebble to do that damage.

    Is the shaft frozen? A frozen shaft indicates hot shut downs. Turbo chargers spin so fast anymore that they keep spinning for minutes after the engine is shut down. That is time that there is no cool lubricating oil going through the bearings.
     
  4. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member

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    get hauled with exhaust not taped up?
     
  5. farm_boy

    farm_boy Senior Member

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    Not to hi-jack this thread.....but how many of you out there actually think that hauling a machine without the exhaust covered will spin the turbo and cause it to fail??

    There are many reasons that I think this to be an old wives' tail.:nono

    Your thoughts?
     
  6. Dickie

    Dickie Active Member

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  7. farm_boy

    farm_boy Senior Member

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    my bad....carry on:D
     
  8. Squizzy246B

    Squizzy246B Administrator

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    The first and most obvious thing in a failure like that is to look at the exhaust gas turbine. When bits of exhaust valve hit the turbine:eek: at high speed the sudden stop will snap the shaft like a carrot.

    Ingestion of foreign matter through the intake system capable of causing that damage is very unlikely as there is a thing fitted (hopefully) called an air cleaner.

    Then you are down to dropping a bush...as turbos don't have a bearing so to speak. They run on an oil wedge in the bushing like Steve said similar to the whitemetal bearings of a crankshaft but with plenty of radial clearance. The killer hear is axial end play (float) which allows rotor/stator contact. (the blades hit the housing but it doesn't look like that in your case) The other cause is a deadstop, shut down from redhot in very cold conditions perhaps without oil supply and this bends the shaft leading to eventual failure.

    You need to prove that the oil supply was good.
     
  9. John C.

    John C. Senior Member

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    I make the foreign material statement because I see bent and broken fins on the impeller. I usually see this from the washer seals that come taped to the inside of air filters. A green horn changes out the filter and leaves that washer on the inside and viola, you have the kind of damage seen here. I've also seen the nuts for the inner filters go through the cold side with the same results.
     
  10. Squizzy246B

    Squizzy246B Administrator

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    Quite correct, especially nuts going through the system. In this case it looks a little more like the fin damage is what happened after the shaft broke.
     
  11. Kgmz

    Kgmz Senior Member

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    Way back when we had our 690D, we had the nut come off of the impeller on the intake side and do something just like that.
     
  12. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member

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    i had the opportunity to have breakfast this morning with a mechanic from RDO equipment. he's been a deere mechanic for 30 years now....he said, you most certainly CAN take turbos out by hauling them without exhaust pipe capped. if you have one cylinder where both intake and exhaust valves are partly open, it will allow air to circulate through the engine, spinning the turbo with no lubrication to it, causing a failure.
     
  13. Squizzy246B

    Squizzy246B Administrator

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    G,day Dayexco. I don't doubt the deere mechanic but I have searched high and low through some equipment manuals for a precaution/warning relating to transporting and I haven't been able to find it.....can anybody find such a reference??......I might give my Cat dealer a call.

    (or maybe I should have looked in manuals for turbo machines:pointhead jk)
     
  14. Cat420

    Cat420 Senior Member

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    This is straight from the transportation section of the manual for a 2001 Cat 420D. It takes less than a minute to do, so even if the manual is wrong, you aren't really losing much time for the piece of mind.
     

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  15. RamDodge

    RamDodge Active Member

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    You will find the same warning in Volvo's instruction manuals also.
     
  16. coondogger1

    coondogger1 New Member

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  17. Countryboy

    Countryboy Senior Member

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    Welcome to HEF RamDodge! :drinkup
     
  18. RamDodge

    RamDodge Active Member

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    Thanks! :D
     
  19. Wulf

    Wulf Senior Member

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    Digger, Is this covered under warranty because your dealer/manufacturer will have to make a decision whether its a material failure or whether there is some other cause.

    Although out of scope for your failure, emissionised engine components such as turbos/fuel pumps/nozzles etc. have a special warranty of up to 3000 hrs or 5 years under EPA recommendations that manufacturers and dealers in the US and Canada have to follow.

    Getting back to your case, I have read documents that when turbochargers are inspected by manufacturers either under warranty or in remanufacturing 90% of them are related to:

    1. Improper lubrication, wrong oil, dirty oil or improper shutdown
    2. Ingestion of foreign objects, nuts, sabotage etc. in either the turbine or blower side
    3. No fault found (replaced in error during troubleshooting):rolleyes:

    Looking at yours I would agree with others that it was #2 or that the impeller/blower failed (cracked due to material structure or improper balance) but it would take an expert to analyse it properly preferably at the scene during the time of failure when all the evidence is available.