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953a vs TL12 takeuchi track skid steer?

Would you rather have a 953 or a large tracked skid steer for your bigger jobs?


  • Total voters
    27

Georgia Iron

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2012
Messages
872
Location
USA - Georgia
Occupation
Concrete building slab and grading contractor
Ok. So the cat and case sales guy came by and brought me some brochures on their equipment. A while back, I was looking at a new case mini ex and ended up buying a used tb145 after I sold my cat mini. Lately I want more pushing power on my skid steer which I use with a 953a model on larger jobs. Any way I have had my eye on a large type skid loader with tracks. I have been on the fence about them. My current machine is a wheeled mid sized case (7000 lbs /70 HP) which I love.

I decided to go by and look at a new takeuchi TL12 which weights around 12,000 lbs / 110 hp. They look great and the list price is now at $89,000 plus tax. : eek: The price has stopped my purchase but I might look for a used one.

I had several people tell me that it can almost match the performance of a 953 which weights about 31,000 and has about 110 hp. Sales guys of course say this to me. I have noticed that the engines are very different in size. My 953 is a brute and every skid steer I have been on feels like a toy in comparision. My 953 can load out a dump in just a few minutes and can carry a lot of dirt and can push a major load from one end of a building lot to the opposite side. Does a tracked skid steer fill the role of a 953 enough that I would not need to own one?

I use the 953 for loading full size dumps, pushing large piles of dirt or concrete, rough grading and large brush removal. The skid so far fills in the gaps when i need a little more finer control on my grading. It pretty much sucks at moving a lot of dirt fast.


I do not buy the sales pitch but I have not actually driven one. Any of you guys have any thoughts on this?
 

gwhammy

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2013
Messages
602
Location
missouri
I've run skid steers and track loaders all my working life. The skid steers are fast but in everyday hard pushing and loading you and the skid steer will be wore out long before the track loader. As you probably know the 953 is a good nimble all around machine for it's size. I don't see any skid loader keeping up with one in bulk dirt moving and loading.
 

topdigger

Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
20
Location
sw missouri
Occupation
excavation buisness owner
I have a takeuchi TL240 and have recently purchase a cat 939C track loader , if you are pushing trees or excavating for foundations the cat is the way to go , the takeuchi just can not compare with a machine that weighs twice as much even though the horsepower is within 15 of each other. The takeuchi is a great CTL but they are like comparing apples to oranges, two machines two different purposes. :my2c
 

CM1995

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Jan 21, 2007
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13,250
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Alabama
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Running what I brung and taking what I win
Ummm no. There is not a CTL on the market that can hang with a 953 doing excavation, clearing or loading trucks. CTL's have their place but they will not replace a 953.
 

lumberjack

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2011
Messages
1,044
Location
Columbus, MS
This is like saying apples vs Ford.

I needed a machine for a 8k yard house pad last year. I looked at track loaders but ended up buying a Mustang MTL325 (Tak TL250) as it's far easier to move, way more nimble, can run a myriad of attachments, operate on improved surfaces, etc. If they made a bigger ctl, I would look hard at it. 140hp and 15k lbs on rubber tracks would be a nice step up.

Ever got a track loader stuck? I've stuck my CTL many times to the tops of the finals and the mini ex can still pull it out. Transportation is easy with an F250.

A 953 will outwork and outlast a CTL 2-3x, it's a different ball game. Also the 953 will cost 2-3x as much as the CTL new. Cory has posted that for him, undercarriage costs on the 953 are less than or similar to the cost of his tracked skid steer.

Check out my YouTube channel to see the MTL325 working. www.youtube.com/RutherfordConLLC
 

Georgia Iron

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2012
Messages
872
Location
USA - Georgia
Occupation
Concrete building slab and grading contractor
I get the feeling that the sales guys have never even had there behind in the seat of a 953. The sales pitch is so smooth for the large skids. I love how they tell me that they move so much faster that you come close to doing the same amount of work. I smile and think to my self my 953 will plow right through a wet sloppy mess that the skid steer will struggle through and bog . I have always thought that cat built a very well thought out machine with the 953. You could always ask for more which when i get around 100 plus loads in a dirt pile my 53 starts feeling small.

I know comparing the two machines is apples and oranges but the sales guys really like to do it.

Hauling either of the two down the road requires a class a cdl. Using a dump truck to move either can make you more money because you now have two usable pieces of gear on site. Using a dually is great but it will not make money like a dump can.

I have been told that track repairs on the skids can get to 20 k real quick. So far i have only had to purchase 2 sets of tires for my skid. Maybe i should have compared the tracked skid to the wheeled skid. I guess you always want more power and traction. Which my 953 has spoiled me with. There is nothing quite like LGP.

I have not stuck my 53 yet. I did dig a hole that it would not drive back out of. I got a little nervous but i put dirt back in and got out. I have had it sink to the belly pans and got close to sticking it. I try to make sure that i do not give it thAt chance but the harder the job the more i charge so it will happen to me sooner or later.

As far as the cost 953s are worth every penny, good older used one run 20 to 30 k and they will make just as much money as a new one in my line of work. Break downs happen and it can suck bad. I just had a lift cylinder hose blow that required me to remove the front end and the fuel tank just to get to the connections. I have also blown a hose in the belly of my skids that was a real mother to fix.


All that said i am still interested in a tracked skid. 110 hp sounds nice. I bet it will suck down the fuel to.
 
Last edited:

CM1995

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Every machine I have in my arsenal has it's place or I wouldn't have it.:D

That being said, I have a 953C and a T250. Both machines have their place and both are used on a regular basis. The '53 is an all around machine, it can cut/fill/grade and load trucks. The 321 is used for demo, loading trucks in the pit, laying storm sewer and any other task where it's cheaper to use it when it's on the job.

For example, on the project I am on now there is undercutting poor soils for the parking lot and importing structural fill. The 321 is in the pit, as it's an abrasive material and all I am wearing out is the bucket and teeth loading trucks. If I put the '53 there it would be wearing not only the bucket and teeth but an expensive undercarriage as well.

The '53 is on the fill site, undercutting the poor soils, loading them out and spreading the new fill. This job was fortunate enough to be located near a pit that I can dump the muck and pick up a load of chert at the same place. For this operation the 321 is better suited in the pit and the '53 on the fill site. My D5G is there as well but doesn't fit the task of spreading fill and loading out the trucks for a back haul - neither would the track hoe.:cool2

The T250 on the other hand gets used for all sorts of tasks on this specific job which is a good representation of the work I do. I like using the T250 in conjunction with the track hoe in laying pipe as a bedding machine. Sure it doesn't carry as much stone as a '53 but it's very maneuverable and the visibility is better seeing the trench, the pipe and workers due to it's smaller size. The benefit as well is it's a smaller machine that uses less fuel.;)

When it comes to backfilling curbs/pavement and putting the final slick on a project before the landscapers come in, it's the T250 hands down. The rubber tracks allow it go across the finished surfaces and the ability to fine grade makes it a top choice.

You gotta have a toolbox full of tools that you need to complete the projects you do. Each machine has it's place.;)
 

JD8875

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2010
Messages
314
Location
Harrisonville, Missouri
A couple years ago I got suckered by the same idea. I had a small pond to build in an existing drainage ditch. At the time I had just a mini ex and a JD 8875skid steer. I looked at renting a 953 and our local cat dealer wanted $2800 a week plus trucking. A buddy of mine had just bought a tl230 and his salesman was trying hard to sell me on a 250. He swore like you said that a tl250 would move fast enough to move as much dirt in a dayas a 953. So I bit and rented it for a week. At the end of two weeks I got done with the conclusion that the 250 was a good big skid steer, but in no way could it compete with a 953. It lacked a lot of lead in its tail, bucket capacity, pushing power, and ground connection. Now I own a 953. The ctl's and skid steers have their place but they can't replace a full size track loader.

John
 

jcg

Active Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2012
Messages
32
Location
Illinois
Hey there Georgia Iron. I hesitate to respond, being a newbie and all but here goes... I think you should go with the CTL but ONLY if you sell the 953....to me....yeah I'm looking for one. I would be more than happy to take that old, slow, heavy 953a off yer hands!
 

Georgia Iron

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Messages
872
Location
USA - Georgia
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Concrete building slab and grading contractor
Hey there Georgia Iron. I hesitate to respond, being a newbie and all but here goes... I think you should go with the CTL but ONLY if you sell the 953....to me....yeah I'm looking for one. I would be more than happy to take that old, slow, heavy 953a off yer hands!

I know right. The more I use my 953 a models the better I like them.

I cleared 3 acres 2 months ago. I was pushing pine trees over and about 50' up the whole tree just snapped. I thought I was being gentle but maybe I hit it to hard. The trunk went forward and the whole top fell straight down onto the front of the 53. Nothing was hurt but watching it sail down in slow motion, I was thinking hope does not roll and get me in the cab.

I thought I would give a follow up. Everyone that posted has valid points.

I ended up finding a tl150 with 1700 hrs on it. I bought used because I did not want tier 4 or a payment on a machine. I can testify that a 953 will run circles around a 12,000 lbs machine. Both have their place. I am very happy with the tl150 which is the earlier version of the tl-12. It is amazingly strong compared to a wheeled skid steer. It feels 3 times more powerful than my 75xt. I believe that each machine has its advantages. A lighter wheeled machine is probably the best choice for having just one machine if your doing in town type construction work.

If you are running in the dirt mostly and have space the tracked machine is nice.

A 953 is basically a real big tl-12. Both machines claim to have about 100 hp. The 953 seems at least 3 times as strong as the tl150. The idea of buying based on just a horsepower claim does not mean it can do the same work. Do not just buy a machine on a sales man's words. I am very happy I went used. To hell with those big payments. I bought the tl150 for its additional weight lifting abilities and for a cab to keep dust out on big dry jobs. I have been loading a lot of large trees 30 "s plus and the 75xt can't stay on the ground.

If I find myself needing to move many feet of dirt, the 53 will be on site. You can bet on that!
 
Last edited:

Deliacorpny

Active Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
33
Location
Westchester ny
Occupation
Owner/operator excavation business
Ok. So the cat and case sales guy came by and brought me some brochures on their equipment. A while back, I was looking at a new case mini ex and ended up buying a used tb145 after I sold my cat mini. Lately I want more pushing power on my skid steer which I use with a 953a model on larger jobs. Any way I have had my eye on a large type skid loader with tracks. I have been on the fence about them. My current machine is a wheeled mid sized case (7000 lbs /70 HP) which I love.

I decided to go by and look at a new takeuchi TL12 which weights around 12,000 lbs / 110 hp. They look great and the list price is now at $89,000 plus tax. : eek: The price has stopped my purchase but I might look for a used one.

I had several people tell me that it can almost match the performance of a 953 which weights about 31,000 and has about 110 hp. Sales guys of course say this to me. I have noticed that the engines are very different in size. My 953 is a brute and every skid steer I have been on feels like a toy in comparision. My 953 can load out a dump in just a few minutes and can carry a lot of dirt and can push a major load from one end of a building lot to the opposite side. Does a tracked skid steer fill the role of a 953 enough that I would not need to own one?

I use the 953 for loading full size dumps, pushing large piles of dirt or concrete, rough grading and large brush removal. The skid so far fills in the gaps when i need a little more finer control on my grading. It pretty much sucks at moving a lot of dirt fast.


I do not buy the sales pitch but I have not actually driven one. Any of you guys have any thoughts on this?

You know the answer to this if you already own a 953 ! There is no ctl that can compare to a 953 and the sad thing is that most of these salesman at dealers have no outside experience with equipment and if they do it's very little! I remember a time when was little and would go with my father to cat and the counter guys and salemen really knew equipment! Now you get a guy that previously worked at a toyota dealer and is trained to read off a computer! And if you don't have a vin num forget it ! Same with sales pitch ! All the salesmen try to pitch is skid steers n ctls! It's almost like they force them on you ! Hopefully one day the crawler loaders who made operators out of men will make a come back among younger ppl and ppl will realize the value of having one !! Just my 2cents
 

CM1995

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Jan 21, 2007
Messages
13,250
Location
Alabama
Occupation
Running what I brung and taking what I win
You know the answer to this if you already own a 953 ! There is no ctl that can compare to a 953 and the sad thing is that most of these salesman at dealers have no outside experience with equipment and if they do it's very little! I remember a time when was little and would go with my father to cat and the counter guys and salemen really knew equipment! Now you get a guy that previously worked at a toyota dealer and is trained to read off a computer! And if you don't have a vin num forget it ! Same with sales pitch ! All the salesmen try to pitch is skid steers n ctls! It's almost like they force them on you ! Hopefully one day the crawler loaders who made operators out of men will make a come back among younger ppl and ppl will realize the value of having one !! Just my 2cents

That's sad your local dealer(s) are in that situation.

I can attest to my local Cat parts guys and salesman. There is one parts guy that knows his stuff, he's old school and damn good at his job. He's helped me more than I can remember.

My salesman will tell you straight out of the gate he can't run them but he knows his machines. More importantly he knows what we do and what we need to do it.

The most important aspect of a good salesman is to know your customers and don't be pushy. I went to a local dealer sale a few years ago and was looking at what they had. The used equipment manager was there and I talked to him for a while. My salesman later told me the used sales manager was hounding him with phone calls saying "he's looking at excavators you need to call him". My salesman replied - "He'll call me when he's ready" and I did, a few months later. My salesman knows when I'm serious and when I'm just curious about adding a machine but not ready to commit, as I'll tell him up front. On the flip side I don't wear him out pricing machines or looking for something used that I don't plan on purchasing.

Good relationships with your vendors are the key in this business, be it a material supplier, parts guy or equipment salesman.;)
 

stumpjumper83

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Joined
Jan 13, 2007
Messages
1,974
Location
Port Allegany, pa
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Movin dirt
ctl's are handy, I have a gehl ctl70, but they are not in the same class as 53's. Heck even a deere 450c has more power...
 

dirtmonkey

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Dec 21, 2009
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342
Location
norman oklahoma
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dozer monkey , self employed
I agree with everyone else. Apples to oranges. They both have their place. I don't have a 953 yet. Hell , there's days I would take a 939 ! I have a Gehl Ctl 80 , it is a beast but still not the same comparison.
 
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