8V92 Detroit Diesel

[td25c]

Where were the spec's for the 9290 being set at the 1.600 show up, did not see that in this thread?

There are not any Ken .

This was my screw up guy's....... I glanced at the service manual one morning at the shop looking at all the timing settings and 1.460 stuck in my mind for some reason and that was not even correct for the 9290 . Then when I saw 1.600 mentioned it sounded rite & agreed with it .

Mind must be going , should have just taken the time to scan in the page on the 9290 . Been pulling some long hot day's so you guys just have to pardon me .

Did spot a Detroit 9F 90 that sets at 1.520 , that seems to be the tallest factory setting I see for the 92 series .

 

[td25c]

Did spot a Detroit 9F 90 that sets at 1.520 , that seems to be the tallest factory setting I see for the 92 series .

That's pretty close to where we set the N 60 injectors on the 8 V 71 in the WABCO at 1.525 .

Still baffled over that mystery :beatsme. But she makes good power & hogs dirt & that's what counts .

 

[ms0115]

There are not any Ken .

This was my screw up guy's....... I glanced at the service manual one morning at the shop looking at all the timing settings and 1.460 stuck in my mind for some reason and that was not even correct for the 9290 . Then when I saw 1.600 mentioned it sounded rite & agreed with it .

Mind must be going , should have just taken the time to scan in the page on the 9290 . Been pulling some long hot day's so you guys just have to pardon me .

Did spot a Detroit 9F 90 that sets at 1.520 , that seems to be the tallest factory setting I see for the 92 series .

TD25C Thanks for the correction. I hate that I did not catch it before I passed it on.

 

[td25c]

TD25C Thanks for the correction. I hate that I did not catch it before I passed it on.

My bad Bro , just got a lot of irons in the fire now .

 

[RZucker]

That's pretty close to where we set the N 60 injectors on the 8 V 71 in the WABCO at 1.525 .

Still baffled over that mystery :beatsme. But she makes good power & hogs dirt & that's what counts .

Timing specs for the early NA industrial V71s were standard cam timing and 1.460 for N60 and N65 brown tag injectors. Later engines ran advanced cams and 1.484, It was recommended at overhaul the early engines be converted to the later specs. Your C-pull may have been converted before you purchased it. It is odd that 1,525 makes it run good. Maybe somebody goofed and advanced the cams an extra tooth? I've always built them by the book so I really don't know much about building a hotrod. The 222F Wabco I had ran N65s at 1.484 just fine with plenty of power. I did build that engine from the ground up, so I know what was in there.

 

[lantraxco]

The 1.600 showed up through one of td25's post from a shop manual. About 4 years ago I sold my diesel business of 20 years in SC. Moved to TN for semi retirement and started a new shop that hopefully my son will take over soooon. Regarding the drill rig, I came into this situation very late. This well drilling outfit has been a very good customer and has kept us very busy. After building several CAT deck motors, 7.3, 6.0, 6.4 and 3208's for them, they dropped this rig off that I have never seen. Here is the story I got; Ran it for 6 years, it had plenty of power. Started loosing about 400 rpm under full load and this was not acceptable for this application. The only people in this area at that time that would work on the dd was an actual dealership. They sold them on a rebuild, the problem continued. They ran it for about 6 months, carried it to a private shop. He sold them on bigger injectors and a new turbo; The problem continued. Then they spoke to the drill rig manufacture and they sold them on needing a new air end;And the problem continued. They parked it, bought a new rig and 2 years later they bring it to me to fix. Test ran and it seemed to have a restriction in air flow. Pulled the turbo and there were no problems, practically new. Pulled the blower, no problems there. The blower mounting gasket was bent over and pinched in one spot, may have been losing boost at that point. The inner cooler was partially stopped up apparently from a leaking oil seal at the turbo (gummed up). Repaired all these items. Running valves and injectors to see where they were at and here we are. They spent an excess of $50,000 before it got to my shop. Needless to say this is not a typical straight forward problem.

Okay, so now we know "The rest of the story" as Paul Harvey used to say. It had a problem, and it has NEVER run right since, to top it off a dozen people have screwed with it and Gawd knows what all is frooked up in the poor thing.

I know it's not what anybody would want to do, but if it was me I would rip it down and start checking parts against a build list, something is off, wrong pistons, wrong cams, wrong injectors, timing, as somebody suggested timing gear on wrong or slipped somewhere, wrong rockers? I know it's all supposed to be the same but how do you know? Really needs to be on a dyno when you tune it so you can see what you're getting, but who's got one of those in his garden shed?

Is this engine by chance running reverse rotation? Just curious.

 

[Heavey Metal]

Reman engine= no change

Reman air end= no change.

Wag: you have a bad air hose or a bad swivel .

 

[Nige]

Here is the story I got; Ran it for 6 years, it had plenty of power. Started loosing about 400 rpm under full load and this was not acceptable for this application.

If this information is correct (and personally I see no reason for it not to be) it could be the key. If the engine initially underwent a full rebuild which didn't cure the problem then wouldn't this point to something that wasn't replaced during that first rebuild..? Don't ask me what though, but whatever it is I'd suggest it won't be obvious at a quick glance.

 

[workshoprat92]

I know I am a johnny come lattley to this thread but why was a rebuild ordered? where there any diagnostics run on this engine before rebuild? IE compression test? Boost pressure or in case of a Detroit air box pressure. fuel pressure? fuel flow? air restriction? to name a few. If none of this information was gathered than just throwing a rebuild at it was just a guess and not proper diagnostics. It is not to late to do these tests. You might find something like a restricted fuel hose or a leaking charge air cooler that can kill HP.

Also if it is old mechanical engine with a rack it is realy important to have the rack set up right. when its right they scream when its wrong they are dogs. Its getting hard as heck to find anyone anymore that knows how to set one up and seems to be a lost art. Its all done by feel and takes a skilled hand to do it.

 

[workshoprat92]

Hey something else you can do. loosen or remove the exshaust manifolds and run the engine. You said lots of black smoke. notice is the smoke coming from one port or are all the ports smoking the same. if it is one port there is a good chance the injector at that port has blown the tip off the injector. All it takes is one injector to do this and it will smoke to beat all and be a real dog. This is real common if you get water in the fuel as the injector has a hard time passing the water and ends up blowing the tip off the injector. if this is the case and you loosen the manifolds you will find it as one port will be bellowing black smoke.

 

[td25c]

Timing specs for the early NA industrial V71s were standard cam timing and 1.460 for N60 and N65 brown tag injectors. Later engines ran advanced cams and 1.484, It was recommended at overhaul the early engines be converted to the later specs. Your C-pull may have been converted before you purchased it. It is odd that 1,525 makes it run good. Maybe somebody goofed and advanced the cams an extra tooth? I've always built them by the book so I really don't know much about building a hotrod. The 222F Wabco I had ran N65s at 1.484 just fine with plenty of power. I did build that engine from the ground up, so I know what was in there.

No idea RZucker although anything is possible ? Dad & I are still scratching our heads on the C pull timing setting running good at 1.525 ?

If I had it to do over again we should have checked the setting before pulling it all down but was in a hurry as we were in the middle of a job .

Took about a half day to get it sorted out with adjusting the injectors & then grab a load of dirt to see how the engine performs ( trial & error ) . Probably had the valve covers off six times , luckily it only takes 30 seconds to remove the valve cover

She runs fine , noticed a little more power after the rebuild , more than likely from good compression with the new pistons & liners .

 

[John C.]

It's been years since I've stuck my hands in any Detroit let alone a V8. I seem to remember that all N engines, those using N injectors had advanced cam timing and were set at 1.484. They started almost instantly and had a roar that was never heard anywhere in nature. As I recall all turbo charged engines that I had anything to do with ran retarded cam timing by one tooth. They usually had a can of ether somewhere nearby and always took good batteries and plenty of turning to get them to come to life. These were before the 92 models and all those I had anything to do with were green blocks.

One thing I have seen that is not mentioned in this thread is the affect of an oil slugged muffler. More than once I've things like broken baffles and clogged up insides of a muffler really screw things up.

 

[kshansen]

If this information is correct (and personally I see no reason for it not to be) it could be the key. If the engine initially underwent a full rebuild which didn't cure the problem then wouldn't this point to something that wasn't replaced during that first rebuild..? Don't ask me what though, but whatever it is I'd suggest it won't be obvious at a quick glance.

And also there could be two or more different things going on here.

Wrong assembly of engine, timing or liners/pistons, injectors.

Or a problem with what ever puts a load on this engine. Be it the air end, a hydraulic pump or a valve in either the air or hydraulic system.

I agree with workshoprat92, the real problem is a bad or total lack of diagnosis right up front. Then everyone after that just started throwing parts and money at it hoping they would stumble on to the problem. Now this far down the road there will be no simple fast answer. One question I always liked to start with on any problem is "Did this happen fast or has it been getting worse over a long time?" Next, I try to find out what happened since the last time it worked good. Did someone change another component or jack up the pressure on something, dump some crap in the fuel tank, change the gears in the rear end to make truck go faster and now it won't climb the hills in top gear? I know this is not a truck but the idea is the same.

I attended an air compressor school years ago and instructor told about the time he was called in to trouble shoot the failing air compressor his company had sold this factory. They had something like two 100 horse power electric compressors running this plant. As luck would have it the only chance he had to get there was on a Saturday when plant was shut down. Story went that they started up one of the compressors and even after running for a few minutes it could not reach cut-off pressure. Only with both compressors running would they get to the full air pressure. Long story short the only real problem with either of the compressors was there were so many "small leaks" throughout the factory it took over 100 hp just to supply them! After he convinced the manager that was the problem and they spent the next several weekends fixing leaks the plant was able to run just fine on one of the two compressors.

Point being just because one item in a system does not seem to be doing it's job it could be it is fighting an uphill battle that it can not win.

 

[ms0115]

Update on 8V92

Thanks for all the input. Do not what was wrong with the 9290 injectors that would not adjust to 1.484. Ordered in a new set, everything timed out well.Cranks easy and runs strong. Will test run Monday in the field.

 

[kshansen]

Thanks for all the input. Do not what was wrong with the 9290 injectors that would not adjust to 1.484. Ordered in a new set, everything timed out well.Cranks easy and runs strong. Will test run Monday in the field.

So did the new injectors adjust to the 1.484 or did you set them to the 1.600?

 

[ms0115]

so did the new injectors adjust to the 1.484 or did you set them to the 1.600?

yes 1.484 thanks

 

[Sohaib]

Wondering if there were any Detroit diesel mechanics out there that would let me ask some questions about problems that I am having with a 8V92 Industrial .

Thanks

We have two 8v92T on our pilot boat which runs well but one is making brown smoke and when we check turbo rpm it us a difference of 3000 rounds as compared to the others means it is making low boost but both the engines are same also tuned similary and are kept at same place
Can you tell me what the problem is

 

[Tenwheeler]

Do not thank brown smoke is on the low power trouble shooting flow chart. Always start with the simple stuff like filters. Do both engines operate off the same fuel tank? Can you send pictures?

 

[old-iron-habit]

Aint that the truth RZucker !

And Grove truck cranes , HyHoe excavators , & GMC trucks with the two stroke noise makers .

Along with the goofy people that use them . Now there is where the real problem is ...........:drinkup

I am to dang old to change from being goofy. I love the 2 stroke Detroit's. Whaaaat???

 

[Sohaib]

Is there any difference between camshafts lobe degrees of 8V92T and 8V92TTA