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1985 Case 1155D engine removal

Bobcat Crazy

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Go rent a bigger machine, like a backhoe, to lift the engine out. Then strip it down later.

Good evening Lindsey,
I have a John Deere 310D but it is at my brothers place about 3 miles away so I can go get it if the Bcat will not do it. I pretty much have it stripped down, I started on it around 4:00 today when I got home from work and stuck with it until dark. So sometime next week I will get around to trying to pull it.
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Good evening Guys,
I was able to get a good amount done after work today! The heads look good, the top of all the pistons look good no damage there or in the sleeve walls. The number 4 cylinder was not firing but that could be a bad injector or a bad valve but I did not see anything obvious that was wrong with the valves. Once I get it all torn down and if the block is good and I can find all the parts for the build the heads will visit the machine shop.

I originally thought it was a broken because the knocking was so bad but all of the pistons go up and down so the rods are still connected to the crank.

When I rock the crank back and forth at least one of the rods has play in it because the at least one piston does not move immediately when I changing direction with the crank. With the amount of play in it I doubt the crank is salvageable but we will see once I get it out.

As long as the block is good and the parts are available I will be in good shape. If not I guess it will be plan B, which is buy.ing the running engine for the guy I bought the loader from. I can get that for $3K but I will still have a used engine, I prefer building this one. That way I will know what the engine is when I put it back in.

I am posting a couple of pics but nothing earth shattering. One shows engine with heads removed. The other is the flywheel plate showing a few of the many bolts in it. I am assuming these bolts are holding the torque converter to the flywheel. Could you Guys tell me if that is correct?

I thought these bolts would be a larger diameter if they are the torque to engine bolts but there are several of them and I already have about half of them out.

Talk soon!
B-Crazy
 

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Randy88

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Those look like the bolts that fasten the flex plate to the flywheel, on the c and e model machines they are either 5/16ths or 3/8ths, I'd guess the same size that bolts the torque to the bell housing.

Again if it were me, I'd remove the torque and engine together, far easier to both remove and reinstall than separate, but do as you wish. I'm guessing you don't plan to have the torque converter checked over, new bearings and seals even??
 

Cat977

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Time and Money, I sure Wish I had more of Both! When I had a Choice I picked Time. Time to spend doing the Things that are the most Important. I just Wish I was better at Knowing what those Things are!
Best of Wishes
 
Last edited:

Bobcat Crazy

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Those look like the bolts that fasten the flex plate to the flywheel, on the c and e model machines they are either 5/16ths or 3/8ths, I'd guess the same size that bolts the torque to the bell housing.

Again if it were me, I'd remove the torque and engine together, far easier to both remove and reinstall than separate, but do as you wish. I'm guessing you don't plan to have the torque converter checked over, new bearings and seals even??

I am going to pull them separate. I don't have a deadline for getting my play toy fixed so the is no time issue or issue of holding up a person that works/makes his living with his machine. That way I will not have to be as concerned about the weight.

It is a good idea to do the seals in the torq. I had not thought of that at this point but hopefully I would have, thanks for the reminder! Are the torq bearings something I can replace or is that a machine shop item?

Thanks for the advice!
 

Bobcat Crazy

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If you separate the flex plate from the flywheel there is no risk of damaging the seal on the convertor shaft.
As Randy said you may want to service the convertor-- and install a new shaft seal.

Hi Tink!
If I am understanding this correctly, the bolts I am pulling separate the flywheel from the flexplate. The flywheel will stay with the engine just like a car or truck and I assume the flexplate will stay with the torq. That will separate the interior components and once I unbolt the two housings the engine be ready to pull, (I have already disconnected all cables, hoses, exterior components) I am correct in that?

I am familiar with pulling engines, transmissions etc. but I have not played with a loader torq before. I know all of you guys that can do this is your sleep think these are silly questions. And they are for an experienced person but if a few silly questions can keep me from breaking something more that would be worth showing my ignorance on this subject. :confused:
 

Tinkerer

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Hi Tink!
If I am understanding this correctly, the bolts I am pulling separate the flywheel from the flex-plate. The flywheel will stay with the engine just like a car or truck and I assume the flex-plate will stay with the torq. That will separate the interior components and once I unbolt the two housings the engine be ready to pull, (I have already disconnected all cables, hoses, exterior components) I am correct in that?
Yes, you are quite correct.
If you leave the flex-plate bolted to the convertor, you eliminate the need to center the flex-plate on the convertor when they are re-connected. It is important that it is centered.
The best thing about taking the flex-plate off the flywheel is that you can do a careful inspection of the flex-plate for cracks. It is common failure on a high hour machine.
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Time and Money, I sure Wish I had more of Both! When I had a Choice I picked Time. Time to spend doing the Things that are the most Important. I just Wish I was better at Knowing what those Things are!
Best of Wishes

Hey Cat I think we can all agree with that for sure! It is funny how the time slips away from us. Long gone are the days when I thought I knew it all and nobody could tell me any different. Now I realize how little I really know and I have forgotten some of what I did know.

They say hind sight is 20-20, it may even be better than that for hard heads like me. :oops:
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Good morning Guys!
I haven't pulled the engine out yet but I am very close to trying that, maybe even later today after work. I have another question for you all who know these engines well. The web searches I have done on a crankshaft for the 1155D/504 are all showing a crank for the 1155E. Can you all tell me if there are still cranks available for the machine that I have which again is the 1155D/504. Also if you could share a little about the difference as far as the 504 engine goes between the 1155D and the 1155E.

Thanks!
B-Crazy
 

Cat977

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Good day to you B-Crazy! When you pull the engine watch for shims and what corner of the engine they belong to. You may also need some horizontal alinement when it goes back in. I don't know if its true for this machine, but it is for others.
Best of Luck
 

Tinkerer

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Um, I believe the 1155D had the Case 504 cubic inch motor.
The 1155E has the Cummins 6T-590 or possably a 6T-830.
But with any older machine someone may have swapped out the 504 and put the Cummins in it.
OR vice versa.
 

Randy88

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The 1155e came from the factory with the cummins 12 valve 5.9, the 1150e dozer models came with the cummins 8.3 rated at the exact same hp as the loader models with the 5.9. There is a turbo on the 5.9, the 8.3 is naturally aspirated with no turbo on them, I own both e model machines, have for over 20 years now. I've never seen an E model machine of any age that came with a case engine in them, not saying a really early year version might not have one Tennaco was trying to use up before switching to cummins, not sure what other countries had in that model either, maybe case stuck something else in and shipped them overseas somewhere.

As for your crank in the 504, if you want to spend money on that engine, I'd start by asking your local machine shop what they can get for parts, [don't think case offers much anymore for parts on the 504] I'm sure they'll want to see your crank first to know if they can or can't grind it to spec. If it were mine, I'd take them all the parts, have them looked over, heads, block, crank, cam, rockers, oil pump and all the rest to assess if its worth fixing at all. There's no sense in taking in the crank, either grinding it or finding a good one, if your heads are junk and the cam's shot and those parts aren't available either. I'm sure a pump shop can look over the injection pump and injectors as well and give an idea of cost to fix them and check them over. I'd have all the estimates in hand before I gave much of any go ahead to actually go through them. You can also check with some engine rebuilders, to see if by chance they have a complete rebuild sitting on their shelves to find out what that cost is, also if they'd be willing to buy your core and if so what its worth, or maybe trade your core in on a rebuilt 8.3 or 5.9 which would be ideal in my opinion.
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Good day to you B-Crazy! When you pull the engine watch for shims and what corner of the engine they belong to. You may also need some horizontal alinement when it goes back in. I don't know if its true for this machine, but it is for others.
Best of Luck

Thanks for the FYI Cat. I didn't find any shims so I don't know if that is a good thing or bad.
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Um, I believe the 1155D had the Case 504 cubic inch motor.
The 1155E has the Cummins 6T-590 or possably a 6T-830.
But with any older machine someone may have swapped out the 504 and put the Cummins in it.
OR vice versa.

Thanks for the info Tink! This gets more interesting all of the time! o_O
 

Bobcat Crazy

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The 1155e came from the factory with the cummins 12 valve 5.9, the 1150e dozer models came with the cummins 8.3 rated at the exact same hp as the loader models with the 5.9. There is a turbo on the 5.9, the 8.3 is naturally aspirated with no turbo on them, I own both e model machines, have for over 20 years now. I've never seen an E model machine of any age that came with a case engine in them, not saying a really early year version might not have one Tennaco was trying to use up before switching to cummins, not sure what other countries had in that model either, maybe case stuck something else in and shipped them overseas somewhere.

As for your crank in the 504, if you want to spend money on that engine, I'd start by asking your local machine shop what they can get for parts, [don't think case offers much anymore for parts on the 504] I'm sure they'll want to see your crank first to know if they can or can't grind it to spec. If it were mine, I'd take them all the parts, have them looked over, heads, block, crank, cam, rockers, oil pump and all the rest to assess if its worth fixing at all. There's no sense in taking in the crank, either grinding it or finding a good one, if your heads are junk and the cam's shot and those parts aren't available either. I'm sure a pump shop can look over the injection pump and injectors as well and give an idea of cost to fix them and check them over. I'd have all the estimates in hand before I gave much of any go ahead to actually go through them. You can also check with some engine rebuilders, to see if by chance they have a complete rebuild sitting on their shelves to find out what that cost is, also if they'd be willing to buy your core and if so what its worth, or maybe trade your core in on a rebuilt 8.3 or 5.9 which would be ideal in my opinion.

Good morning Randy,
You Guys have so much knowledge and it is awesome that you all would take the time to share it with hard heads like me! :D
I will give an update below, but I pulled the engine yesterday after work. I certainly didn't need to be worried about an in-frame rebuild, the crank is broken in half :eek: but I didn't find any other damage other than possibly the rod on the #4 cylinder where the crank is broken at.

I don't think there are many hours on this engine since it was rebuilt. the engine is clean as a pin inside, the pistons and rings look almost new, without an gum or gunk even in the oil rings. I don't know about the diesel engines but on a gas engine I have never pulled one down that didn't have some gunk in the oil ring.

It is early in my check over of the components of the engine but the early look over shows few hours. The two crank journals I looked at last night show the rods were turned the thousands and the mains were turned twenty thousands. In your opinion what would cause the crank to in half one an engine like this?

Full update with a few pics coming later this morning.

Thanks Guys
B-Crazy :cool:
 

Tinkerer

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Crankshafts sometimes break for no apparent reason.
Not all 504's used the same crankshaft.
I would recommend that the main bearing journals in the block be checked for the possibility of being out of round as result of the broken crankshaft. The same with connecting rod journals. That broken crankshaft could have done bad things before it was stopped from turning. IMHO.
 

Bobcat Crazy

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Guy Guys, what's up this morning?
I was able top pull the 504 out after work yesterday and pull the pistons out just before dark! My dad, my brothers, and myself were always workaholics and my Mother has always said that God made the night time so workaholics like would know it is time to stop working and get some rest.

So I am still following God's time table on that, even at 61 I know when it gets dark I need to stop. I thought I would gotten smarter than that by now but as I have already admitted "hard headed"!!! :confused: I hope you see the comedy in some of my statements. ;)

Below are a few pics, I have already covered some of this in the reply to Randy, Tink, and Cat above so I will try not to bore you to death.

Short story:
  1. Bobcat S185 lifted the engine with power and lift capacity to spare.
  2. Removing valve covers and heads gave me the room I needed between the top of the engine below and loader arms and cylinders above to squeak it out without any problem. I was really worried about having enough space to do this with the skid steer 4-1 bucket still in place. I don't have a skis steer boom if I owned one of those I could have pulled it with ease which the engine was still fully assembled. I could have purchased and if I was planning on doing this much I would spring for one. But as I mentioned early in the story I am working on a shoestring budget to get this play toy going.
  3. Crank completely broken in to two pieces.
  4. All other items look good, no other damage found.
  5. Engine has been rebuilt, the rod journals were turned .010 thousands the mains .020 thousands
  6. looks like not many hours since rebuild, engine extremely clean inside. Even oil rings are clean without any deposits. I have never seen that before in any engine I have disassembled.
  7. Not sure what I will do at this point, I may end up buying the running engine the guy I bought this loader from. I can get it for $3k and be playing with my toy before long.
  8. Any way i look at it, it will take more than $3k to get this one up and running.
  9. My only concern is, if I build this one I know what is in it. If I buy his I have a running engine but it will still be a used engine that I have no idea of its history.
  10. I my decision I have to factor in my shoestring budget. My time is free to me and this is not something I am tryin to get running to make my living with so that plays in the equation also.
Thoughts, Ideas?
B-Crazy
 

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Bobcat Crazy

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Crankshafts sometimes break for no apparent reason.
Not all 504's used the same crankshaft.
I would recommend that the main bearing journals in the block be checked for the possibility of being out of round as result of the broken crankshaft. The same with connecting rod journals. That broken crankshaft could have done bad things before it was stopped from turning. IMHO.

Very good advice Tink!
Thanks!
 
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