Welder Dave
Senior Member
You also don't want the metal grindings from the steel braids in the hose.
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Hydraulic hose fittings on a CAT 426 backhoe?
- Thread starter Billy Mac
- Start date
Ct Farmer
Senior Member
If you don’t get the hoses from Cat, make sure that what they give you is the same spec. There are dozens of different spec hoses in each size. Different number of wires, pressure ratings, some that need to flex a lot, others that take a lot of frequent pulsing. Pressure rating and number of wires is not the only thing that counts.
For example 100R2 and 100R16, both 2- wire hose with close pressure ratings but the 100R16 has 1/2 the bend radius for tight spaces or things that really flex and bend hose tightly.
It is also important to have the correct fitting. Just because the end attachment is the same does not mean it is rated for the hose or pressure it may be used on. I only use bite to the wire fittings and avoid those Weatherhead type-U bubble fittings that just grab the covering. Saw one guy putting type-U on 4,000 psi hose once...
Some local guys are pretty good, especially if you only need low pressure tractor type stuff, otherwise, at least around here, I didn’t find anyone who stocked what I needed for ends and didn’t end up selling you a bunch of adapters to make their stuff fit.
For example 100R2 and 100R16, both 2- wire hose with close pressure ratings but the 100R16 has 1/2 the bend radius for tight spaces or things that really flex and bend hose tightly.
It is also important to have the correct fitting. Just because the end attachment is the same does not mean it is rated for the hose or pressure it may be used on. I only use bite to the wire fittings and avoid those Weatherhead type-U bubble fittings that just grab the covering. Saw one guy putting type-U on 4,000 psi hose once...
Some local guys are pretty good, especially if you only need low pressure tractor type stuff, otherwise, at least around here, I didn’t find anyone who stocked what I needed for ends and didn’t end up selling you a bunch of adapters to make their stuff fit.
Nige
Senior Member
Any hose-builder worth the name will sponge-gun every hose after fabrication. The sponges should be in the bag with the o-rings that is taped to one end of the hose.
Billy Mac
Member
Time to sharpen my axe!
heymccall
Senior Member
Cat calls for XT3-ES -6 100R12 with a 4000psi rating.
As to the post above regarding fittings for a skived hose, (is that what you meant by "bite to wire", I dunno where you've been, but very few, if any, of my high pressure hose assemblies are skived. They are just crimped to the outer jacket. Even my 78C -20 parker hoses (5k psi) , and, never have I had a hose end failure here where the fitting has come off, save for Caterpillar's thermoplastic bullshit hoses.
As to the post above regarding fittings for a skived hose, (is that what you meant by "bite to wire", I dunno where you've been, but very few, if any, of my high pressure hose assemblies are skived. They are just crimped to the outer jacket. Even my 78C -20 parker hoses (5k psi) , and, never have I had a hose end failure here where the fitting has come off, save for Caterpillar's thermoplastic bullshit hoses.
Ct Farmer
Senior Member
Not talking about skived hose, either internal or external. Talking about the difference between a fitting that has large enough ridges(??) inside that when you crimp it they cut through the outer jacket and grip the Wired’s opposed to one that only grips the outer jacket.
Per Parker, “Parker's 78 series fittings are cost effective, permanent, bite the wire style fittings made for easy and quick assembly using our family of Parkrimp crimpers”
Welder Dave
Senior Member
A lot places don't even blow the hoses out with air. Cut the hose, put the fittings on, crimp and there you go.
Nige
Senior Member
In that case they aren’t real hose builders, even though they might claim to be.
Welder Dave
Senior Member
I'm thinking places like Napa or some farm stores that don't fully understand how clean a system needs to be.
Nige
Senior Member
Comments above still apply ........... don't care what name is above the door.
I agree.
If you're not getting something approximating this, then you can't be sure your hose is clean. It's been best industry practise for at least 20 years.
Nige
Senior Member
^^^^^^^^^^
And that, good people of HEF, is the difference between a proper hose shop and a shop that says they can build hoses.....
I hope the OP's question has been well and truly answered.
And that, good people of HEF, is the difference between a proper hose shop and a shop that says they can build hoses.....
I hope the OP's question has been well and truly answered.
mitch504
Senior Member
About the only hoses I get made at a part store are ag stuff (you know, 15-2500 psi, gear pump, etc). I have seen a lot of methods used to "clean" out the hoses, I have seen parts store guys think I'm weird when I insist on taking the hose before the fittings are installed and beat it on the floor. I have been to a couple of hose shops that had the sponge gun, but whether they actually used it....
The only place I have ever seen the sponges in a little bag was at the Cat house.
My local NAPA does a bunch of hoses, up to about 2" six wire. They stock the Cat, (code 62), fittings; but, they don't stock, and claim not to have a source for, the o-rings for them. Mostly what I do with them is buy a fitting if I don't have it and need it now, or go in their shop and make the hose I need. They have no system for cleaning out hoses.
At my shop, I have a 3/4" air line with a cone on the end, and I stick the end of the hose out the door and open a ball valve, not a sponge gun, but better than sticking my mouth on it and blowing, too.
The only place I have ever seen the sponges in a little bag was at the Cat house.
My local NAPA does a bunch of hoses, up to about 2" six wire. They stock the Cat, (code 62), fittings; but, they don't stock, and claim not to have a source for, the o-rings for them. Mostly what I do with them is buy a fitting if I don't have it and need it now, or go in their shop and make the hose I need. They have no system for cleaning out hoses.
At my shop, I have a 3/4" air line with a cone on the end, and I stick the end of the hose out the door and open a ball valve, not a sponge gun, but better than sticking my mouth on it and blowing, too.
hosspuller
Senior Member
Are the sponges blown through before the fitting is crimped ? My thinking is insert sponge, blow through at home.
Nige
Senior Member
Attached the Hose Assembly procedure to answer all your questions......
Welder Dave
Senior Member
I'm not disagreeing. Just saying that some places that do hoses don't properly clean them out. I don't think hoses necessarily need to have the sponges returned but some places don't even put caps on the ends. Places that do hoses as a convenience for their customers may not have the best practices.
On my Cat somebody, before me, used non Cat hose with Cat reusable fittings and stuck steel and plastic shims on the hose to take up the difference. This was on the main hose to the control valve. The Cat fittings require special tooling so how this could happen makes it even more baffling. Hoses aren't where you want to cut corners and on the other hand some places charge ridiculous prices for hoses. I found a hyd. repair shop that does good work and charges reasonable prices to make up hoses.
On my Cat somebody, before me, used non Cat hose with Cat reusable fittings and stuck steel and plastic shims on the hose to take up the difference. This was on the main hose to the control valve. The Cat fittings require special tooling so how this could happen makes it even more baffling. Hoses aren't where you want to cut corners and on the other hand some places charge ridiculous prices for hoses. I found a hyd. repair shop that does good work and charges reasonable prices to make up hoses.
Nige
Senior Member
It certainly seems like you are from where I'm sitting.
There is a right way to build hoses - see the doc 2 posts above. This is a standard that was first published close to 20 years ago so it is nothing new. Any repiutable hose shop will use it or something like it, not just the Cat dealer.
If a customer wants hoses built the right way then with the information provided they ought be able to locate a hose shop that works to industry standards. If they choose to do it another way then they cannot claim they were not informed before taking that decision, and presumably accept any negative consequences that might accompany said decision.
kshansen
Senior Member
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Sorry if there was some confusion but on my desktop monitor the two pictures are side by side.
Nige
Senior Member
The two photos appeared side by side on my screen also.
Welder Dave
Senior Member
I was just trying to point out that although there are industry standards for cleaning hyd. hose not all places follow it. It would be best to inquire before having a hose made at a shop you're not familiar with.