Any tricks for getting a blade center pin out?

When I bought my TD20G it had a piling blade on it (no center pin used) and came with a tilt blade separately. Last year I turned a pin out of some 80mm excavator pin. Hole was kind of worn on the upper hole, c-frame and lower hole were pretty good. I machined a step in the pin to accommodate the wear. Installed the pin with no problems used it, manually angling the blade with no problems. Went to take it out today to swap back to the piling blade, won't come out.
I pushed up on the pin with a 30 ton jack, pushed down with the dozer hydraulics. Pushed down, even hammered down with the excavator on the blade, it's stuck. Thought about welding a ring on top to pull on but I don't know if it will be enough.
Hoping to salvage the pin as I don't have any stock or time to build another right now. Suggestions?

a picture would help so we can get a better idea

200lc1 said:

When I bought my TD20G it had a piling blade on it (no center pin used) and came with a tilt blade separately. Last year I turned a pin out of some 80mm excavator pin. Hole was kind of worn on the upper hole, c-frame and lower hole were pretty good. I machined a step in the pin to accommodate the wear. Installed the pin with no problems used it, manually angling the blade with no problems. Went to take it out today to swap back to the piling blade, won't come out.
I pushed up on the pin with a 30 ton jack, pushed down with the dozer hydraulics. Pushed down, even hammered down with the excavator on the blade, it's stuck. Thought about welding a ring on top to pull on but I don't know if it will be enough.
Hoping to salvage the pin as I don't have any stock or time to build another right now. Suggestions?

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break out the big heater & keep the excavator handy

Sometimes you can weld a large bolt to a stuck pin use a piece of pipe and plate washers to put a good hard pull on it with a big impact

petepilot said:

break out the big heater & keep the excavator handy

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Or get out the goold old exorthermis torch and blow straight through it.

Do you have a slide hammer or can you fabricate one? Assuming there is room to use one, if you weld a nut to the pin for the slide to attach to, sometimes a slide hammer is better as it will pull on the pin rather than push. Less chance for mushroom deformity at the end of the pin.

Otherwise, fabricate a pusher clamp that will accept a hydraulic bottle jack as your force. Once a fair amount of force is applied to that pin, keep the load on it and strike the surrounding bushing area with a sledge to provide shock to get movement initialized. Heat can also be applied with the bottle jack in place until you see movement.

You can make a good creeping lubricant with Acetone mixed with ATF that will help penetrate the assembly. Mix at least 25% Acetone. I usually make it 30%-50% with the balance ATF.

Or, as Nige said, "Or get out the goold old exorthermis torch and blow straight through it." If you drill out a pilot hole of at least 1/4" diameter through the pin, your Oxy/Acet cutting torch will blow through it faster and stay on course. Hollow it out at least an inch diameter and then let it cool. It should contract the OD of the pin considerably once cooled, then a few easy hits to remove it.

Good luck. Frozen pins are not my favorite things to deal with.

Some great ideas, I'll try welding a bolt on and rigging up a puller arrangement with a pipe, plate, nut, and impact. I put a lot of up force with the excavator and jack, maybe it's sideloading the pin and holding on enough to prevent movement. This way I can try unload it, moving the blade around. I'm curious to see what is holding it, it was not a tight fitting pin.
I'll save burning through it as a last resort. My oxy/acetylene torch is a bit weeny for this and I don't have an air arc.......yet. Watched a couple vids on the exothermic torch, those very cool.
Thanks all

If I understand you sorrectly your OP mentioned that the upper pin bore was somewhat egged and so you manufactured a stepped pin to compensate for that. What do you think are the chances that the centreline of the bores was not 100% correct as a result of the oval one at the top and consequently the pin has been bent in operation.?

The exothermic torches in the Youtube videos are generally giant ones. The ESAB SLICE is more compact but even so is still not the smallest one on the market.

My favorite part of burning with the exothermic torch is there is generally no one standing there trying to talk to you for long

Nige, could very well be right on the alignment and deforming the pin. Probably should have fixed the hole before installation. I figured with the amount of force I focused on the pin it would have come out. With Jonas' idea I can probably unload the bore a bit by manipulating the blade using the hoe, with the pulling force applied. Should be able to take a run at it later today or tomorrow.
Cheers

Well, it won't give. It must be bent or swaged in somehow. I tried every way with the impact on it. Wishing I'd better prepared the hole before putting the pin in.It will have to stay in for now, will look into an exothermic torch kit. Would an air arc torch work for this length of pin? Or do you gouge the majority of it out with this type torch?
Thanks for the ideas, a great pool of knowledge to draw from.

If you are well versed with a gouger, it could work. Generally a lance or exothermic torch is best for pin removal. Usually gouge best for cutting welds or removing material on a flat surface. When cutting into pin have same problem as oxy/act torch and material will want to pool. This is were lance is best shoots the material through thus creating area for pin to contract. If you have a rose bud for torch and get it cherry red might be worth a try with the puller set up and a bottle jack underneath.

How hard was the pin you made? If it was soft can you get to pin to cut with saws All? Can you remove swivel from machine to separate blade from machine for more room. I agree with Nige exothermic torch is the way to go but they’re expensive ($800———$2000).

You can get extended torch tips but they are expensive and likely to get ruined with all the heat in the deep hole https://www.ebay.com/itm/VICTOR-033...360?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c10#viTabs_0

An oxygen lance can be homemade depending on your skill set

5.9Jon said:

If you are well versed with a gouger, it could work. Generally a lance or exothermic torch is best for pin removal. Usually gouge best for cutting welds or removing material on a flat surface. When cutting into pin have same problem as oxy/act torch and material will want to pool. This is were lance is best shoots the material through thus creating area for pin to contract. If you have a rose bud for torch and get it cherry red might be worth a try with the puller set up and a bottle jack underneath.

Click to expand...

I think if you heat around the pin housing with a rosebud and have a way to put pressure on it and then beat it with a BFH at the same time might work. I think an air arc gouger would just be blowing lots of hot metal and sparks everywhere including back in your face.

200lc1 said:

Well, it won't give. It must be bent or swaged in somehow. I tried every way with the impact on it.

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Did you keep it under pressure, then go push some dirt or trees. Preferably try to shock load it a bit within reason. Make the blade jiggle around under pressure.

.RC. said:

Did you keep it under pressure, then go push some dirt or trees. Preferably try to shock load it a bit within reason. Make the blade jiggle around under pressure.

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Or just angle the blade back and forth while under pressure.... I'm guessing the pin got bent in there because the machine side bore was hourglassed... I would try to anneal the pin if it's too hard to drill then start drilling if you don't have access to the kind of torch you need to burn the center out, if you can drill down to where the step is you should be able to get it... just take some time depending on what kind of bits you have and the patteren you use to get the hole upsized.

I left it under pressure and went clearing with it. Unfortunately I didn't bring anything to tighten it anymore. Will bring back a breaker bar and pipe tomorrow.
Yesterday when I was pushing it around with my excavator I noticed that the blade appears to be breaking free from the center pin structure, not sure how it ties into the blades inner framework, frick more repairs for later.
Jonas thanks for the tip on homebuilding the oxygen lance. Never saw before but looks pretty simple to make. Watched a couple youtube vids, man that is one metal eating angry tool. Have to see if my local welding supply has the hollow electrodes. Tough to buy a tool I haven't really needed yet, worse to pay somebody 1/2 of what it's worth to do the job.
Ronsii, the pin was case hardened, entertaining turning it down to size until I got through the hardening. Your right, probably only need to get down 2-3 inches to get past the step, could then drive it out the bottom. don't absolutely have to get it out now, but sure am missing my rake this time of year.

just a thought- when you angle the blade, does the pin move in the blade ears or the centre pin in the c frame. make a couple index marks- one on the head of the pin and one on the blade ear and then angle the blade. if the marks have changed in relation to each other, the pin( horsecock) is seized in the c frame centre pin and not in the ears

Got a chuckle out of that description, aptly named. It is definitely held by the ears from rotating when I swing the blade. I do suspect, though, that the c-frame is preventing it from pulling out.
When I first put the blade on, the c-frame portion was a bit "burred" from the piling rake, which didn't use a pin. Hindsight, I should have taken the time to improve all of the aspects of the bore. Think it may have cut a groove in the pin and effectively locked the pin in.
Good news though, after forgetting my socket, bar, and snipe all week, I brought them yesterday. The pin is giving in. Taking a fair pull I got a quarter turn on the puller setup. I had to quit there, the machine is a ways away from the rake and not worth swapping right now.
Anyways, as farming supports my hobby of working away from home, time for my land clearing project to give way to paying for it.
Thanks for all the great advice, and ideas, I will update this when I do get the pin out next time.