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247b blow by

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Rocky1315

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Apr 7, 2020
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Elk River, MN
Hi, this is my first time posting on here so please point me in the right direction if im doing this wrong.

I have a 2006 247b cat that has around 3100 hrs. Always been up to date on maintenance since i'v owned it (around 1800hrs). Iv noticed over the past couple hundred hours it feels like its loosing a little bit of power, start ups are tough and you have to run the glow plugs regardless of the temp outside and it will puff a cloud of smoke when started but goes away immediately. It does not appear to be burning oil(at least not enough to notice), i think it's burning a little bit of coolant but nothing crazy(maybe 1qt every couple hundred hours at the absolute most). I noticed it has a significant amount of blow by. Any ideas what could be going on? What could be creating so much blow by?

Attached is a pic of the last oil sample(50 or so hours ago)

Thanks!
 

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Vetech63

Vetech63

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Crankcase venting is what the combustion chambers in your engine lose during each cylinders compression stroke. All engines have it (though piston ring gaps, carbon build up on valve seats, etc....) turbocharged engine have even more than naturally aspirated. I have 2 questions.....
1. Are you seeing engine oil coming out of the crankcase venting tube/hose?
2. If you removed the engine oil dipstick while the engine is running, do you see venting out of the dipstick tube also?

Remove the air filters from the filter housing and use a flashlight to look inside the inlet to the intake manifold. It should be clean of any dirt. If you see dirt on the inside of the inlet tube (you can wipe the inside of it with a clean finger or rag) then dirt has infiltrated the intake system over time and has worn your piston rings thin.
 
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thepumpguysc

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I'd PULL THE GLOW PLUGS & test them.. u could have a couple that arent getting hot.. hence the smoke at start-up.. its injecting fuel into a cold cylinder or cylinders..
Next would be an air cleaner.. TAKE IT OUT before u start the engine to SEE if it helps.. u cant always tell when a filter is clogged..
Then, I would consider injectors.. the spray pattern might be off to the point they're not spraying correctly for a quick start, hence the smoke..
AND.. it depends on what fuel system is on your motor.. it might have a "cold start solenoid" that isnt working.??
 
92U 3406

92U 3406

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Wouldn't hurt to run a compression test either. CAT typically gives a compression spec somewhere in their manual. Low compression usually equals blowby.

We don't see many B's around these parts anymore but if they use the same engine as the newer C models I would look at the head gasket for your coolant consumption as its a common failure on the C series machines.
 
Ruka Mfg

Ruka Mfg

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Dec 24, 2018
Messages
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Sunburg, MN
I got a 05 it stated kinda hard viberated more than I thought it would, 435 hours had blown head gasket. Would puff little smoke out on start up. Check your inner air filter for spot, if it smells like smoke gaskets crapped out, hopefully your crankcase vent has been re routed out of fresh air tube from air box to turbo. Hope that helps.
 
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Rocky1315

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Location
Elk River, MN
Vetech63 said:
Crankcase venting is what the combustion chambers in your engine lose during each cylinders compression stroke. All engines have it (though piston ring gaps, carbon build up on valve seats, etc....) turbocharged engine have even more than naturally aspirated. I have 2 questions.....
1. Are you seeing engine oil coming out of the crankcase venting tube/hose?
2. If you removed the engine oil dipstick while the engine is running, do you see venting out of the dipstick tube also?

Remove the air filters from the filter housing and use a flashlight to look inside the inlet to the intake manifold. It should be clean of any dirt. If you see dirt on the inside of the inlet tube (you can wipe the inside of it with a clean finger or rag) then dirt has infiltrated the intake system over time and has worn your piston rings thin.
Click to expand...

Vetech63, answers to your questions: 1. Yes there is oil residue in the breather hose. 2. yes there is venting out of the dipstick tube. When I removed the filters and ran my finger into the inlet tube it came out with very little dirt/dust.
 
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Rocky1315

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Elk River, MN
92U 3406 said:
Wouldn't hurt to run a compression test either. CAT typically gives a compression spec somewhere in their manual. Low compression usually equals blowby.

We don't see many B's around these parts anymore but if they use the same engine as the newer C models I would look at the head gasket for your coolant consumption as its a common failure on the C series machines.
Click to expand...

92U 3406, I will try to find a compression tester and run a compression test. I do have a feeling it could be the head gasket after reading a few other forums online about the head gaskets being updated on these engines due to premature failure.
 
R

Rocky1315

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Ruka Mfg said:
I got a 05 it stated kinda hard viberated more than I thought it would, 435 hours had blown head gasket. Would puff little smoke out on start up. Check your inner air filter for spot, if it smells like smoke gaskets crapped out, hopefully your crankcase vent has been re routed out of fresh air tube from air box to turbo. Hope that helps.
Click to expand...

Ruka MFG, What do you mean by "spot"? The crankcase vent currently runs into the air tube just before the turbo.
 
Ruka Mfg

Ruka Mfg

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I ment soot , spot was a wonderful auto spell correct error. Have you ran the machine with oil fill cap off? As you can see it blows gasket into push rod hole and dumps exaughst into block. Too much time and will stick rings and tear up pistons, atlest it did on mine. It will also goo up the turbo and take the bearings out of it.
 

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Ruka Mfg

Ruka Mfg

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Have you pulled the short hose from turbo to intake port in valve cover to see if that's dry, that's how I figured out the turbo was pushing oil out fresh air side.
 
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Rocky1315

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Ruka Mfg said:
Have you pulled the short hose from turbo to intake port in valve cover to see if that's dry, that's how I figured out the turbo was pushing oil out fresh air side.
Click to expand...

I had the machine running and pulled the oil fill cap off which is how I realized it had tons of blow by. I will go pull the short hose from the turbo and see if it’s dry.
 
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Rocky1315

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Rocky1315 said:
I had the machine running and pulled the oil fill cap off which is how I realized it had tons of blow by. I will go pull the short hose from the turbo and see if it’s dry.
Click to expand...

Just pulled the short hose off and it was sooty, wasn’t wet oil but my finger would have some soot on it when ran across the hose.
 
Ruka Mfg

Ruka Mfg

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I bet your head gasket is blown then. A compression test will definitely be in order. Like I said look inside your air filter to see if it is black and smells like diesel smoke. I hope you cought it before it did any extra damage. I pulled the head in the machine was a easy job. No special tools required.
 
R

Rocky1315

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Ruka Mfg said:
I bet your head gasket is blown then. A compression test will definitely be in order. Like I said look inside your air filter to see if it is black and smells like diesel smoke. I hope you cought it before it did any extra damage. I pulled the head in the machine was a easy job. No special tools required.[/QUOTE

Thank you for your advice! I will get a compression tester ordered and see if I can’t narrow it down to the head gasket. Do you happen to know what the pressure should be at in each cylinder?
Click to expand...
 
Ruka Mfg

Ruka Mfg

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That's good. Maybe you will get lucky and it will be something simple. Either way blowby isn't fun to see. I'd look into plugging that crankcase vent tube into fresh air supply and run the vent hose down the side the way they were prior to emissions. Best of luck
 
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