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Torque Converter and...

Michael Caravaglia

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Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
121
Location
Warwick, New York
The flywheel holes I don't think are too bad. I'm actually heading out in a few minutes to a machine shop with the flywheel to have it checked out.

I'm definitely beginning to think I'm looking at pulling the crankshaft and replacing it. At this point I have so much of the front of the tractor in pieces, I may take it all the way. These bolts are fused into the crankshaft holes for some reason. I'm going to finish drilling as clean as I can and try to run a tap through them and see if the threads come back to life. If not, I'm looking at going the distance.
 

kshansen

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Joined
Mar 11, 2012
Messages
11,128
Location
Central New York, USA
Occupation
Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
As for "loctite evidence" I'm not sure what I would be looking for. The bolt I'm currently working on just appears to be melted into the threads. It won't break loose no how. I've never seen anything like it. Of course, the machine is 37 years old!

As for loctite evidence anyone familiar with it could spot it blindfolded. When heated it will hit you in the nose like a brick wall.

Wish I could see that crank in person, I am having a hard time understanding how those bolts would appear to be melted into the crank. I have taken apart many things that were over 37 years old, just for example look at that truck over to the left, and sure some things do rust up but with care most will come out. Not saying I never had a bolt rust in but hard to imaging a flywheel bolt that bad. The worst ones are those that break off on a 45º angle making drilling for easy-out a pain.
 

Michael Caravaglia

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Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
121
Location
Warwick, New York
I have a couple of these drilled all of the way through and the walls of the bolt remaining so thin, less than a 32nd of an inch. Even at this, they won't come loose with a cold chisel tapping away. I'm not saying they're melted in, but they're hanging on for dear life.
 

Tinkerer

Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Messages
9,342
Location
The shore of the illinois river USA
Have you probed the drilled bolt with a small pick to see if the bolts are bottomed out in the blind hole ?
Bottomed out bolts would never allow the flywheel to be tight against the flange.
Were there washers under the bolt heads ?
Stranger things have happened when dummies work on equipment.

The plus side of a replacement crankshaft is all new bearing inserts and new seals front and rear !
You may be surprised what your old ones are like.
 
Last edited:

Michael Caravaglia

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Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
121
Location
Warwick, New York
I have indeed probed the holes. Bolts were not bottomed out. There were no washers under the bolt heads. I was wondering about whether there should have been lock washers.

I have a machinist coming next week. He claims to be able to determine if they are removable or not; and if they are he says he'll get them out. We'll see!
 

Bill Edwards

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Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
58
Location
UK
Loctite shows up as a light/white powder/flakes on the bolt threads and it can be remarkably strong, which is why heat is likely to be necessary as it frees Loctite.
Or it could be that they're badly rusted in place, but it's not something I'd really expect on flywheel bolts but that's not to say it couldn't happen.
 

Michael Caravaglia

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Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
121
Location
Warwick, New York
I have the top half of all 6 bolts and there's certainly no evidence of any material. Perhaps it was added only to the bottom part of each bolt, but not really sure. Also, the bolts are really not rusty at all.

Once the machinest comes next week, I'll report back on his findings. He is also a metal fabricator and he welds on location, so he can weld on a nut, or bolt, if he decides that is the best approach.
 

Delmer

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Messages
8,864
Location
WI
I think you found the right guy this time. This job is not difficult for any number of shade tree mechanics on this site who have done hundreds of bolts like this, but it's not the job you want to learn how to get out a broken bolt on. Do not try to drill them out all the way, and do not try to re tap the threads.

How about a picture of the bolt you got out? And the hole it came out of. couldn't hurt, and might get some useful suggestions.
 

Michael Caravaglia

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Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
121
Location
Warwick, New York
I thought I would provide an update. The weather in the Northeast hasn't been so good, so I haven't been able to work consistently on this project.

So far, I've been able to remove three bolts by drilling them until the walls are thin and then using a cold chisel to break up and remove the remaining metal. It has not been easy!

The machinest that said he'd come by and help me with this never came by and now he tells me he's too busy. Can't rely on anyone here it seems.

I had an idea today, so I drilled into one of the three remaining bolts and tapped it with a left-handed, reverse thread tap. I then screwed a bolt (also reverse thread) into the hole until it bottomed out. I thought I'd be able to back out the flywheel bolt this way, but it didn't budge; and as fate would have it, the bolt snapped, filling the hole. I then had to drill out the bolt inside the bolt (sigh).

I don't know what happened, but these bolts are just fused into these holes and nothing seems to be able to loosen and back them out. Since I've been able to drill three of them out successfully (no damage to the threads) it looks like that's the only way to go, so I'll continue to go this way. It's painfully slow and extreme care needs to be taken to do it, but I'm out of options.
 

Tinkerer

Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Messages
9,342
Location
The shore of the illinois river USA
Thanks for the update Michael. I wondered if the machinist took care of you.
Sadly he probably didn't want to do a difficult and slow job like this one.
Really good drill bits are hard to find these days.
Have you considered a magnetic base drill ? Having enough room to use it may be a problem. They can be rented in some areas.
 

skata

Senior Member
Joined
May 10, 2007
Messages
1,541
Location
midwest
Or try drilling out with reverse cut drill bits. Get a size slightly smaller than threads. Sometimes the reverse drilling action will grab the threads and reverse them out.
 

Tinkerer

Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Messages
9,342
Location
The shore of the illinois river USA
In post #28, he said he was using a reverse cobalt.
Micheal ; maybe consider removing the crankshaft and take to a machine shop for an evaluation.
It would be a shame to put a lot of time and money in it only to have the last bolt hole ruined beyond repair.
That would be my typical luck. :(
 

56wrench

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2016
Messages
2,074
Location
alberta
just one note about welding a nut on a broken stud- the ground should be attached to the nut to be welded onto the broken stud. in this application you do not want the ground current to go anywhere besides the nut you are welding. god forbid, the current goes through the crank bearings to the block or anywhere else. on machinery i've seen guys just clamp the ground to anything handy and thereby cause arcing through bearings and then after a few hours use, the bearing fails.
 
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