grading and sloping

Thanks for any help, new to all of this.

This is a 5 acre parcel of land that Ive been working on clearing for some time.

B indicates the area where I will be removing dirt ( pure sand ) because it is a much higher elevation than the proposed slab and I dont want to look at a hill behind my shop/home. I have been moving this material ( D is at least 6 ft higher in elevation to the slab ) down to the area marked C.

The difference at X is approx 6 ft in other words the proposed slab is 6 feet higher at this point than C. As you work your way across and around the slab the slope becomes less pronounced.

R front corner of proposed slab the slope is nearly nonexistent as in I need to create something there for water to run off and away.

I am having a 3 yard loader dropped off to move this material, Ive been moving it with a JD 544 which has done a great job but just isnt quite heavy/big enough. The bigger loader is not cheap, Ive got it for a week and as far as I know I shouldnt need anywhere near that amount of time but considering I have zero experience with grading Im in for a crash course and Ill do the best I can.

My plan is to cut out a line the width of loader bucket 2 feet deeper than the slab area, I plan to cut this out right in the middle of dotted line on my diagram. I then plan to take more out of the B side so as to create a slope up to my driveway.

How much slope is too much in that it will need a retaining wall so that my driveway ( which is still nothing more than more sand at this point ) dosent start falling down the hill?

Also there is at some point gonna come a time where there is no more material going into the C area and there is prob. gonna be a very extreme slope which may or may not require some type of retention wall but dont know what I can get away with slope wise in reference to distance away from any building structure?

Im attaching a bunch of pictures, maybe they will help a little to explain better.





More pics
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This picture shows D at its best
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This picture shows X at its best
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I dont know why some pictures are not shown but if you click on X they do appear ( for me anyway )

Bottom line and point to this thread is how much of a slope can I have in pure white sand without the need for a retaining wall? I plan to at some point grow grass or whatever in these areas which I know will help with runoff but that is later down the road.

Also Im sure it differs depending on location but whats a general rule of thumb for building placement near a sloped area?

Thanks again

Id like to post some info I felt was relevant to my thread for later reference.

Quote : The minimum slope that I recommend is two percent, or 1/4 inch per foot. As an example, the grade at a spot four feet away from your house should be one inch lower than the grade next to your house. This will do for most houses with soil that will absorb water readily.

Quote :
You create surface drainage by grading an area so that water collects and flows to a lower elevation away from the site. Regardless of surface characteristics, when it comes to surface drainage, slope is the most important issue to consider. For efficient drainage, paved surfaces should have a minimum 1-percent slope. Turf or landscaped areas should have a minimum slope of 2 percent.

• "Shoot" the grade. Because slope is so important for drainage, a transit or level is good to have on hand to "shoot" grades. It is also the best way to find the absolute lowest spot in a potential drainage area. Exceeding the 2-percent standard by too much can cause erosion problems. Slopes of more than 4 or 5 percent will seem very steep in most landscape situations.
• Calculate the slope. Each foot of elevation drop over a 100-foot length is 1 percent. Therefore, it takes 2 feet of elevation change over each 100-foot length of a swale to create a 2-percent slope. If the distance is 10 feet, you'll need a fall of 0.2 feet (roughly 2.5 inches) to create a 2-percent slope.
• Grade the area. Areas that will be paved, such as driveways or parking lots, are easy to surface drain by simply grading them so they slope away from structures and toward a lawn, storm sewer or street gutter. In open turf areas, you can create a swale by making a downward-sloping "crease" in the landscape where water will collect and flow to lower ground. If water flows to an area where it cannot completely exit the site, you can install a catch basin and pipe so the water will drain to its ultimate destination.
• Control erosion. Immediately after you create a swale, you should install stone or sod, sow seed or design other means of stabilizing the area. (See related article, "Temporary grasses stabilize soil".)

Quote :

The minimum slope that I recommend is two percent, or 1/4 inch per foot. As an example, the grade at a spot four feet away from your house should be one inch lower than the grade next to your house. This will do for most houses with soil that will absorb water readily.

For your 7 metre garden (~ 22.9 feet) this would be no more than a 6" drop.

Keep in mind that too much slope means difficulties with mowing equipment. 12.5 degree of slope or a 22.2 percent slope is as much as you want to have close to your house.

https://www.prettypurpledoor.com/yard-grading-how-to-grade-a-yard/

107 views and no comments? Surely someone has some experience with this?

You're essentially asking questions that would typically be answered by paid professionals. Around these parts, I wouldnt answer these questions for a client simply for liability reasons. This is what I pay my civil engineer for, and she does a great job of covering my hide, balancing cut fill, and maintaining proper drainage patterns.

There's a lot of variables with regards to soil type and stability. Essentially, the angle of repose is what you're looking for. Now what I can say from my experience, we never see specs for slopes greater than 3:1 without some form of retaining or engineering. Your soil type may vary, but 33% is steep for mowing or maintenance.

I'm a civil engineer, been at the local county highway dept for 47 1/2 years. I've looked at hundreds of site plans. Your drawing makes no sense to me. I'm guessing the xx" is change in elevation but there's no dimensions to the drawing. NepeanGC's comments about 3:1 are right on.

1930 said:

Bottom line and point to this thread is how much of a slope can I have in pure white sand without the need for a retaining wall?

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"Pure white sand" has a lot of variables. You say grass is sometime down the road. So do a test area. Grade a flat area 3-4 feet above grade with your pure white sand. See how it dries out and slopes itself. My guess based on pure white sand I'm familiar with in FL (the beach in Indian Shore Beach) is, it won't hold a 3:1 slope at all. The drier it gets the flatter it gets. Any change in grade will need a wall of some sort.
This group is a very knowledgeable group and readily share info. But you haven't given us much solid info to go by.

Raildudes dad said:

I'm a civil engineer, been at the local county highway dept for 47 1/2 years. I've looked at hundreds of site plans. Your drawing makes no sense to me. I'm guessing the xx" is change in elevation but there's no dimensions to the drawing. NepeanGC's comments about 3:1 are right on.

"Pure white sand" has a lot of variables. You say grass is sometime down the road. So do a test area. Grade a flat area 3-4 feet above grade with your pure white sand. See how it dries out and slopes itself. My guess based on pure white sand I'm familiar with in FL (the beach in Indian Shore Beach) is, it won't hold a 3:1 slope at all. The drier it gets the flatter it gets. Any change in grade will need a wall of some sort.
This group is a very knowledgeable group and readily share info. But you haven't given us much solid info to go by.

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Thanks, Im a guy that owns a small piece of property, Ive had professionals look at it and ill have gotten is a stick up my ass, Ive decided that this like everything else Ill do myself, dont know what I should be asking other than what Ive asked.

Seems like good advice has been given and its appreciated

Sometimes when looking for assistance you have to ask in stages and give people a chance to answer if they can. More info is generally good but getting too far ahead and going into the next 16 steps before the 1st one is sorted out will turn people off.

I understand. I can remember years ago when I first got internet Id make posts and people would grumble cause I didnt give enough info so Ive always tried to be more thorough but on the same token if someone asked me to read one of my posts Id lose interest quick cause time is short for everyone.

Some good responses above, its one of those things I think that Im just gonna have to do what I can and be happy with what Ive done.

I think the backdragging/grading/leveling thing is gonna be the toughest for me, Ive got a small tractor and its only now after quite a few months am I becoming proficient with using the loader to move material.

Long story short and maybe not worth posting but I did hire a guy to do all this work, money is tight for me like everyone else so I knew I couldnt go into the yellow pages for a guy, I went on Craigslist and had about 6 people come out to give me bids, I didnt pick the cheapest but close.

I found out quick that they were milking me for more time = money, I told them to get off my property, I did some investigating and it turned out the guy was a 2 time sex offender for a child under 16.

A real piece of **** it alot of past criminal activity.

Never would have considered that with just talking with the guy.

I learned a hard lesson and that is too be more careful about whom I hire, cant pull a background check on everyone but I could have at the least asked for his last name up front and googled him.

Ok another long post so Ill stop now. Thanks again

You can't go by a person's criminal history. I worked with a dozer operator that didn't need much in the way of plans to grade a site. I had a 20 acre site that had been mined for sand and needed to be restored. i did a plan with some contours to show the township. . Met him at the site, showed him the plan and described what I wanted. We never set a grade stake on the site. He shaped and contoured it so no one could tell it had ever been mined. The township was thrilled with how natural it looked. We found out later he was abusing a relatives daughter. Would I hire him again to run a grade dozer? Yes, he's one of the best. Would I trust him around my daughter or grand daughter?, No.

I personally would stay away from a business that advertises on craigslist I have never advertised my business anywhere except face to face and we are busy from word of mouth just my experience

As far as dealing with pure sand never have had the displeasure how do you get it to compact if it wont compact it wont hold a slope but I have virtually no experience with sand around here we have what we call blow sand witch is just dust basically off the desert add enough water it will compact and as long as you dont tear it up once its dry you would be ok I have never built a pad without a retaing wall that had slopes that were steeper than 3 to 1 and that was not with sand

As far as dealing with your

That's a confusing drawing. Dimensions are in inches. Yet you're showing a huge lot. And a driveway all the way around? And just a slab in the middle? You gong to build a house? Shop?

I for one didn't reply because in your post (#3) I thought you were answering your own questions.
I spent some time in Florida and I don't remember seeing sand sloped very steep for obvious reasons. I did see block retaining walls everywhere in subdivisions.
I spent over 30 years on dozers in illinois and our sand is totally different from the sand in Florida. We can slope it here, but it has to be capped with topsoil to prevent erosion.
Good luck with the person you hired to do the grading.

Raildudes dad said:

You can't go by a person's criminal history. I worked with a dozer operator that didn't need much in the way of plans to grade a site. I had a 20 acre site that had been mined for sand and needed to be restored. i did a plan with some contours to show the township. . Met him at the site, showed him the plan and described what I wanted. We never set a grade stake on the site. He shaped and contoured it so no one could tell it had ever been mined. The township was thrilled with how natural it looked. We found out later he was abusing a relatives daughter. Would I hire him again to run a grade dozer? Yes, he's one of the best. Would I trust him around my daughter or grand daughter?, No.

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I disagree. Robbing a bank, maybe killing your old lady I might not have an issue with.
Pulling out your weewee or fondling a child is enough reason to stop breathing.

He was 22 she was 15.

If he was 18, maybe 19 and in love than it would be different