CAT 305.5e2 Opinions

DGODGR · Dec 29, 2019

I have been in the market for a new 5tn mini. I recently decided that I didn't want to pay that kind of $ for a mini (+/- $80k with buckets) so I stopped checking them out. The last one I demoed was a Deere 50G, and I have also demoed a 305.5e2, and the Volvo ECR 58. I really wish that Takeuchi still made the TB153. I currently own a Bobcat 435ZHS with about 5,800 hrs on it. It has been over a year since I demoed the CAT but the salesman decided to through out a quote to me just before Christmas. Apparently my dealer really wants to move some of these units out as the price is pretty good and the financing is 0% for 60 months. It's been a while since I demoed it but this is what I recall. I liked the machine over-all. It felt smooth, tight, and gave me the impression of sturdy quality. It may not be quite as fast as my 435 but it feels like it has more mass to move. It definately has more lifting power than the 435. I did not like the position the knuckle on the swing frame (where the rod eye of the swing ram mounts to the swing frame). It is on the operators blind side (opposite of the 435) and will stick out past the track width if the boom is swung all the way to the operators left. I found this out (the hard way) as I was trying to dig adjacent to a foundation wall that was on my right. There is a zirk fitting guard on the rod eye and it is stout enough to put a decent gouge into the foundation wall! I am not very fond of the thumb as it looks a bit flimsy to me (especially when compared to me 435 thumb). At the time the price didn't excite me either. There are some other minor things I don't like (like the sideways mounted oil filter) but nothing that I recall would keep me from buying. I am a small excavation contractor who works primarily on high end custom homes in the Rocky Mountains (so we will be working in tough ground and/or rock). The 435 is currently my smallest hoe and I also have an '03 CAT 315C CL, a '17 Deere 245G. I also have (2) Bobcat A series skid steers, a CAT 416C, a couple 10 whl dump trucks, and a 66" ride-on single drum roller. Suffice it to say we have enough iron to perform a diverse array of tasks. As a general rule I prefer to use the largest piece of iron that will work in the intended space.
With all that being said I am looking for first-hand opinions and experiences with the subject machine. From the research that I have done (Google search) there is not much recent information on the 5 ton class. I'm not sure if I want to open the floor (or flood gates) to suggestions with alternative brands. I will say that I WILL NOT consider Bobcat at this time.
Thanks in advance.

diga · Dec 30, 2019

Hi DGODGR, I am in Australia but went through the same exercise as you about 2 years ago, I had previously owned a Takeuchi-TB-138fr (3.8t), then a Hitachi ZX-35 (3.8t), then a Bobcat E-35 (3.8t) and my last purchase and current machine is a Kubota U55-4 (5.5t), you have clearly done some good hours on the Bobcat, unfortunately the E35 I owned has some disturbing issues (2 rotary joints under 1000hrs) and other problems, these were repaired under warranty I must admit but not a great thought to be paying for those repairs outside of warranty, but it clearly out dug my previous 2 machines with the extra horsepower that they had with the bigger motor that was available here when they were Kubota powered not Doosan. The Hitachi was a disaster, at 860hrs the slew ring bearing had excessive wear in it and it was only 13months old, and unfortunately they would not warranty it as it was over 12mts old, that put an end to my relationship with Hitachi. The Takeuchi was my first machine, never had any major issues but the complex (swing /offset ) system can be prone to wear if not kept lubed religiously, but in saying that is a great machine and the best to operate as you are not looking around cab or canopy pillars when offset either way.

The two most popular 5t diggers here in OZ are Kubota and Yanmar, they sell like hotcakes, you very rarely see a 5t Cat, and we have a massive Cat dealership here in Brisbane (Hastings Deering), bigger machine yes but not in minis.
I prefer the Kubota powered machines, had a few issues with Yanmar engines, did a water pump in my Takeuchi under 500hrs from memory,and some other minor things.
Finding minis that run the swing ram on the inside of the king post/tower is hard, I thought it was a great idea and obviously my Bobcat had that and as you mentioned in your post, no issues with rubbing it on fences, walls and other things, sought of shows you how engineers are out of touch with how things work in the field really.
When I have been to the Cat open/field days they seem very slow to operate, I even asked the salesmen that was standing there watching me dig, do I have it in some sought of "economy mode" that could have been giving me the sensation of slow operation but he checked and it was all good, it looked well put together I must admit, BUT it had some very dubious delivery details written on some paperwork attached the rear glass about where it was made and it was not America as I was led to believe, and after checking the vin plates on several others confirmed my suspicions, that may not be the case for you guys living in the USA but, if I were buying another new one tomorrow it would still be Yanmar or Kubota.

Cheers, Peter.

f311fr1 · Dec 30, 2019

The 305.5 is due to be redone as a next gen version which I do perfer. Have you looked into the 306 Cat.

DGODGR · Dec 30, 2019

diga said:
Hi DGODGR, I am in Australia but went through the same exercise as you about 2 years ago, I had previously owned a Takeuchi-TB-138fr (3.8t), then a Hitachi ZX-35 (3.8t), then a Bobcat E-35 (3.8t) and my last purchase and current machine is a Kubota U55-4 (5.5t), you have clearly done some good hours on the Bobcat, unfortunately the E35 I owned has some disturbing issues (2 rotary joints under 1000hrs) and other problems, these were repaired under warranty I must admit but not a great thought to be paying for those repairs outside of warranty, but it clearly out dug my previous 2 machines with the extra horsepower that they had with the bigger motor that was available here when they were Kubota powered not Doosan. The Hitachi was a disaster, at 860hrs the slew ring bearing had excessive wear in it and it was only 13months old, and unfortunately they would not warranty it as it was over 12mts old, that put an end to my relationship with Hitachi. The Takeuchi was my first machine, never had any major issues but the complex (swing /offset ) system can be prone to wear if not kept lubed religiously, but in saying that is a great machine and the best to operate as you are not looking around cab or canopy pillars when offset either way.

The two most popular 5t diggers here in OZ are Kubota and Yanmar, they sell like hotcakes, you very rarely see a 5t Cat, and we have a massive Cat dealership here in Brisbane (Hastings Deering), bigger machine yes but not in minis.
I prefer the Kubota powered machines, had a few issues with Yanmar engines, did a water pump in my Takeuchi under 500hrs from memory,and some other minor things.
Finding minis that run the swing ram on the inside of the king post/tower is hard, I thought it was a great idea and obviously my Bobcat had that and as you mentioned in your post, no issues with rubbing it on fences, walls and other things, sought of shows you how engineers are out of touch with how things work in the field really.
When I have been to the Cat open/field days they seem very slow to operate, I even asked the salesmen that was standing there watching me dig, do I have it in some sought of "economy mode" that could have been giving me the sensation of slow operation but he checked and it was all good, it looked well put together I must admit, BUT it had some very dubious delivery details written on some paperwork attached the rear glass about where it was made and it was not America as I was led to believe, and after checking the vin plates on several others confirmed my suspicions, that may not be the case for you guys living in the USA but, if I were buying another new one tomorrow it would still be Yanmar or Kubota.

Cheers, Peter.

Thanks for your input. I like many things about the Kubota (no experience with Yanmar) but I have found the pins and bushings to wear out prematurely and I have seen many of their thumbs break in the same place. In my opinion the ergonomics have also been lacking.

DGODGR · Dec 30, 2019

f311fr1 said:
The 305.5 is due to be redone as a next gen version which I do perfer. Have you looked into the 306 Cat.

I have seen some media regarding the 306 but nothing first-hand. Of the items I recall associated with "Next Gen" upgrades the tilting cab is the only one that really gets me excited. I'm not sure if that's worth the extra price of admission for me.

Akmc5 · Dec 31, 2019

I've got one.....use it for septic installs mostly....tearing out sidewalks......stuff like that. I'm not really brand loyal. We had been renting jd's, bobcats, kubotas.....whatever was available. I went with Cat because their financing is so easy that it's not even funny. And the dealer is about two blocks from my yard. I'm not brand loyal though. I think these days all of the brand name machines are going to get the job done just fine. I've got nothing bad to say about the machine.......but nothing to rave about either. Well that's not true....they come with a hydraulic pin grabber as standard. On a machine that size you end up changing implements so often that the pin grabber is a must have. Most of the other machines I looked at didn't have the pin grabber as standard...it was an ad-on that cost extra. Or some stupid brand specific quick coupler....last thing I want is a pile of buckets laying around the yard that only fit one size of one brand of machine......

At the end of the day Cat is pretty damn convenient for me. I can't complain.

DGODGR · Jan 1, 2020

Akmc5 said:
I've got one.....use it for septic installs mostly....tearing out sidewalks......stuff like that. I'm not really brand loyal. We had been renting jd's, bobcats, kubotas.....whatever was available. I went with Cat because their financing is so easy that it's not even funny. And the dealer is about two blocks from my yard. I'm not brand loyal though. I think these days all of the brand name machines are going to get the job done just fine. I've got nothing bad to say about the machine.......but nothing to rave about either. Well that's not true....they come with a hydraulic pin grabber as standard. On a machine that size you end up changing implements so often that the pin grabber is a must have. Most of the other machines I looked at didn't have the pin grabber as standard...it was an ad-on that cost extra. Or some stupid brand specific quick coupler....last thing I want is a pile of buckets laying around the yard that only fit one size of one brand of machine......

At the end of the day Cat is pretty damn convenient for me. I can't complain.

That doesn't sound like a rousing recommendation....or a critical comment either. I gather that you are pretty ambiguous about yours.
I would have to agree about the financing. Zero down, 0% interest for 60 months makes it crazy easy! Those were the same terms I had when I bought my 315 back in '03.

The one that I was quoted comes standard with the manual pin grabber coupler. The hydraulic coupler is about $3k more. I fervently agree with you regarding the brand specific buckets. As it relates to performance loss when employing a coupler (break out forces, etc.) I would prefer a coupler that does not come with a leverage disadvantage (like those you had mentioned with the special attachment ears). The main reason that I accept the loss of breakout forces (that come with a pin grabber coupler) is because I can pin the bucket on directly in the event of a coupler failure. While I know that this may be a rare occurrence I have seen it first-hand and am not yet willing to let go of it.

The thought of how passionate (or not) I am about this purchase came up for me while reading your thread. While I love operating equipment, and having a machine that works the way that I want it to, I now have too many machines to be the primary operator on all of them anyway. In reality I may not be the one who puts most of the hours on this new machine (if I get one) anyway. If I think about it I'm really trying to make it so I'm not so tied up in the field anyway (although I prefer the field over the office any day of the week). Where I'm going with this is that it is becoming easier for me to make equipment purchasing decisions more from the position of what makes the most business sense rather than what I might prefer to operate. I may not have fully made the shift though because if I had I would likely be purchasing used over new.

KSSS · Jan 1, 2020

Taki will be releasing a new 153 this Spring. I want to replace my 153 and before I heard about Taki finally bringing the machine back, I demoed a 305E2 this Spring. There is no way I personally would buy one. I dug a 1500 sf crawlspace with one, and frankly was just fine bringing it back to Cat. The replacement 153 will be called like a 158 or something like that. There will be a run on new 153's when they finally release. There are a handful of guys here waiting to throw money at Taki to get a new one.

DGODGR · Jan 1, 2020

KSSS said:
Taki will be releasing a new 153 this Spring. I want to replace my 153 and before I heard about Taki finally bringing the machine back, I demoed a 305E2 this Spring. There is no way I personally would buy one. I dug a 1500 sf crawlspace with one, and frankly was just fine bringing it back to Cat. The replacement 153 will be called like a 158 or something like that. There will be a run on new 153's when they finally release. There are a handful of guys here waiting to throw money at Taki to get a new one.

Is this something that they have publicly stated? I'm asking to see if there is any information I can get about it.

KSSS · Jan 1, 2020

PM sent.

DGODGR · Jan 2, 2020

KSSS said:
The replacement 153 will be called like a 158 or something like that. There will be a run on new 153's when they finally release. There are a handful of guys here waiting to throw money at Taki to get a new one.

Tak doesn't have much market share down here. Century (Case dealer out of Salt Lake) used to sell them but they must have let the franchise go. Now Power Motive has brought about 6 to 8 of the Tak minis to a yard in my town. They also sell Komatsu but the only brand new machines are the Tak minis. So there are a few Taks here but I hardly ever see them around. I would imagine that there would not likely be a "run" on them like you expect in your neighborhood. We also have a Power Equipment Co (PECO) yard just over the border in NM and they have started selling the Taks as well. Funny, I could drive 10 miles north, or south, and hit a Tak dealer yet they hardly have any market share here.

DGODGR · Jan 2, 2020

This thread got a little bit derailed (my own fault) but I'd still like to hear from others with direct experience with the 305.5e2.

Morley · Jan 2, 2020

I’m on my second 305.5, this one being an 2018 E2 with just under 1000 hrs. Had the first one for just over 2300 hrs and no issues whatsoever. They have virtually identical fuel consumption and performance. A Helac tilt coupler is on 90% of the time, which pushes the effective bucket pin distance out quite a bit, but even so it does a good job of trenching, foundation digging, truck loading - whatever else I need. About the only time I take the tilt coupler off is when I need to use the thumb or dig out stumps.

The only real complaints I have had about either of them is when I lift heavy, such as building a retaining wall with concrete ecology blocks (3000-4000 lbs/block). They’ll do it with some coaxing, but just barely. It can be frustrating, but room to maneuver is hard to come by, so I suppose that is just a tradeoff of using a mini.

I would love it if Takeuchi were a more viable option in my area, not only for the excavators but the CTL’s as well. The specs grab my eye every time I’m in the market for a new machine, but unfortunately, I just don’t have confidence in the local dealer network when it comes to service after the sale.

DGODGR · Jan 2, 2020

Morley said:
The only real complaints I have had about either of them is when I lift heavy, such as building a retaining wall with concrete ecology blocks (3000-4000 lbs/block). They’ll do it with some coaxing, but just barely. It can be frustrating, but room to maneuver is hard to come by, so I suppose that is just a tradeoff of using a mini.

My 435 struggles when trying to load/unload our 3,000# compactors. I found the 305.5 to be stronger than what I'm used to in the lifting category. 4,000# is a lot for a 12,000# mini (1/3 the weight of the machine)! I would offer a suggestion here (if you're open to one). Try taking the bucket off and also using the cross brace of the thumb as your lifting point. I know that this will effectively shorten your reach but it will give the mini a much better leverage advantage. You won't lose much reach and I doubt your lifting that much weight very far from the machine anyway.

Morley said:
I would love it if Takeuchi were a more viable option in my area, not only for the excavators but the CTL’s as well. The specs grab my eye every time I’m in the market for a new machine, but unfortunately, I just don’t have confidence in the local dealer network when it comes to service after the sale.

I'm very interested in the Takeuchi as well but despite having (2) dealers nearby I fear that support may be lacking here as well.

Morley · Jan 2, 2020

Lifting from the thumb cross brace is a good idea (I assume you mean while the thumb is still folded up against the arm). 4000# is a lot, and like I say, I'm probably just expecting too much from a mini in that respect.

The dealer network seems (to me at least) to be the biggest obstacle Takeuchi has to winning over new customers.

KSSS · Jan 2, 2020

I think even Taki would admit that their dealer network and support has been their 'soft spot" since they came to the North American market. My local Taki dealer is the CASE dealer which I have a good relationship with. So dealer support to date has not been an issue for me. I will say that I wish that Taki wasn't using Kubota engines in their equipment. My excavators have all had Yanmar, which in my experience have been nearly bulletproof. The issues with Kubota engines and their SCR issues includes Taki as well. Doesn't affect excavators of course since they are under 75 hp, but does include the CTLs. What I like about Taki is their stuff is traditionally, overbuilt. Taki puts value in durability. They historically have not been as pampering in the area of operator comfort, but it appears that they have spent a lot of time fixing that in their recent machines. As far as the "run". Well I put that into the context that this is a rural area, but of the guys that currently run a TB153 (6 machines that I can offhand recall in this immediate area) they have verbal agreements on 4 new machines. Considering how many mini's are sold here in a typical year, that is a "run". I have no idea how many Taki sells of the FR machines in the States, I think they will sell a lot of these, especially initially. They stopped building the current 153 in like 2013 or so due to emission packaging issues. So the guys that have them and are in the market for a new one will be anxious to get their hands on a new one.

Morley, where in Washington are from? I spoke a month ago with FMI in Spokane. They appear to be a large Taki dealer. I drove to one of their customers who has a Taki TB2150 that I spent a couple hours on. Its a 140 sized machine, swing boom. I went to Butte, Mt to run it. I was impressed with it. I was also impressed with FMI, the guy I spoke with was the owner and the guy was pretty knowledgeable, way more than you tend to see at that level in an organization. I know nothing else about the company, but my first impression was positive.

Comparing the 305E2 to the Taki 153, the Cat had faster cycle times which I did like. The Taki loads trucks much easier and has a higher lift capacity. The benefit of the side to side boom system on the Taki is the weight is more centered in the middle of the machine and not out front like a typical swing boom mini excavator, so it can really lift. I am anxious to run this new version of the 153.

Morley · Jan 3, 2020

KSSS - I’m in western Washington, so a bit out range for Spokane on a long term basis. Dealer knowledge and responsiveness is a big sticking point for me. If I’m going to spend the kind of money these smaller machines command these days I expect to deal with someone who puts the same kind of effort into their job as I do mine. My local Cat rep is great to work with and that makes my job so much easier when I need him.

Takeuchi machines spec out great. I tend to use my machines towards the heavier end of mini/CTL work so overbuilt is a huge selling point to me. I don’t think I’d be worried about a structural failure with their equipment. However, although technology over the past couple of decades has been great for allowing more work out of small machines, it has also made dealer response to problems all that more important. These days a “failure” is likely to be nothing more dramatic than a flashing code followed by a machine that refuses to move. I want to have confidence that a phone call or text to the dealer can start the ball rolling towards a solution rather than a dead end of run arounds and down time.

To answer the original question – yes, I would recommend the Cat 305.5. They’ve held up very well under heavy use with a very minimal amount of issues, most of them just coming down to operator preference or expectations.

DGODGR · Jan 3, 2020

I don't have a current Kubota engine in my fleet but my 435 and A300 both come with them. I have had zero issues with those engines (pre SCR) in a combined +/-11,000 hours between the (2) machines. Both were bought in '06. I think that the Cat might be running a re-badged Kubota in the 305.5. I don't know that for sure but I know that many of the Cats were dropped the Mitsubishis and/or Perkins for Kubotas. The 305.5e2 has DPF but no SCR so if a Kubota lives within I would hope it does not have issues (if I purchase one or not). My A770 has a Doosan engine in it and it has had a lot of issues. I wish that they would have stuck with Kubota!!

DGODGR · Jan 3, 2020

Morley said:
KSSS - I’m in western Washington, so a bit out range for Spokane on a long term basis. Dealer knowledge and responsiveness is a big sticking point for me. If I’m going to spend the kind of money these smaller machines command these days I expect to deal with someone who puts the same kind of effort into their job as I do mine. My local Cat rep is great to work with and that makes my job so much easier when I need him.

That's the kind of support all these machines should come with!! I find that there are different levels of support with each different dealership in my area with Cat being at the top historically. That being said I have had quite a few serious issues with Cat lately.

Morley said:
Takeuchi machines spec out great. I tend to use my machines towards the heavier end of mini/CTL work so overbuilt is a huge selling point to me. I don’t think I’d be worried about a structural failure with their equipment. However, although technology over the past couple of decades has been great for allowing more work out of small machines, it has also made dealer response to problems all that more important. These days a “failure” is likely to be nothing more dramatic than a flashing code followed by a machine that refuses to move. I want to have confidence that a phone call or text to the dealer can start the ball rolling towards a solution rather than a dead end of run arounds and down time.

Even though you are portraying the "failure" as not very dramatic, those little issues are like David and Goliath and will keep that machine from running. In fact I might prefer a bigger "failure" if it doesn't take special computer interface and proprietary software. Most times I can fix the "good ol' type of failure" myself.

Morley said:
To answer the original question – yes, I would recommend the Cat 305.5. They’ve held up very well under heavy use with a very minimal amount of issues, most of them just coming down to operator preference or expectations.

Thanks for your feedback.

DoyleX · Jan 3, 2020

I only saw the word komatsu mentioned briefly. Demoed a 305.5 thinking of replacing my 55 and no way did I want to own the cat after seeing and feeling the difference between the two.

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