Where do you draw a line on forum member responcibility?

This is something that has not only crossed my mind, but others as well. It seems that most people that post here with equipment issues know very little about their machines and how they work. Naturally, those of us that are here to help with troubleshooting their issues and repair advise do so freely and it is usually greatly appreciated.

What I am getting at is...……. when someone lacks the understanding of what is going on during the troubleshooting process and the accidents that can happen with heavy equipment...……..do you continue to attempt to GET them to understand it? …..or do you side with safety concerns and tell them to find qualified help near them?

I'm positive no one here wants to see anyone get hurt, or killed, by advise they have given. I recently did this myself in a skid loader thread...…….a sticky boom control spool. What I was explaining made perfect since and I have experience in doing what I was trying to explain ( raise the boom, boom stop it, take the linkage off and push/pull the control spool to see if that is the problem, or the linkage itself.) That night after really thinking about it I felt pretty stupid telling someone things I assumed were easy, but yet dangerous. That is a situation that could be deadly if not done correctly......and I second guessed my advise by wondering if I had explained it well enough...….while not going into the details of the dangers.

I believe it is a good thing for people to learn how to take care of their equipment, but in this day and age of costs being so high in this industry, more people with NO experience are attempting to do major repairs and troubleshooting on their own.

So, what about you? Is there a balance of knowledge and safety to be achieved here? I would like to here from the new posters as well, to gain knowledge of what they may expect when posting equipment issues.

Very interesting comments Vetech.
I myself have wondered about those same scenarios. Especially when some inexperienced person is starting a machine by jumping a starter and we are trying to help them.
Could a forum member be sued if something went terribly wrong in those situations ???

That's a horrible 4 letter word Tinkerer.. 1 that shouldn't be spoken OUTloud..
Its getting worse & worse fellas.. I hate it when the thread starts> I'm a total Newb..
I have a tendency to skip over those threads..
& 99% of the people writing in, don't have a shop manual.. so your stuck writing step by step by step..
when all they have to do is open the friggin BOOK.. {VE pump thread}
BUT WHY spend 75.00 on a manual when theres abunch of bored retired mechanics that'll tell u for free.??
Its gotten to the point where I somehow turned into peoples "personal mechanic" on call 24/7..
I get calls on the weekends & after 6pm.. hey what abut this, what about that, can u look this up for me.. how about giving me the part #.?? How do I do this.. what if that doesnt work.??
THEN the REAL kicker is> all that stuff u told me didn't work..
HOW MANY TIMES do u have o be told, U HAVE A PUMP PROBLEM.. There IS NO magic switch u can flip to make it run..
There is no information available for diesel fuel injection, for a reason..
U either "try it" yourself.. pay someone to do it.. or take the risk of blowing up your engine. That's pretty cut & dry..
I know what u mean about the starter thing.. its the same w/ hanging an injector outside the engine..
I do put a CAUTION in my threads tho.. probably wouldn't hold up in court.. {sad}

Yeah, some people need to stay away from attempting even the simplest of tasks on a machine. I'll usually tell people to get someone with experience if they don't know what they are doing. There are also times when you just have to say NO because it is very dangerous and shouldn't be attempted by anyone.

I remember a post on another forum from several years ago. Not a repair question but similar. A guy and his friend "apparently" found an IH 175B track loader "abandoned" in a building on an old farm. Took some pictures that clearly showed a no trespassing sign on the wall. Hopped on the machine, turned the key and it started right up. He said he couldn't get it to move and was asking for help in that regard. I COULD NOT believe that about half a dozen people freely offered advice on what could be the problem before someone else made note of the no trespassing sign on the wall. I mentioned the picture of the guy on the machine would be good evidence to take to the police. Don't you wish you could find an old abandoned machine that you could just turn the key and it starts right up.

I have done that as noted when get the I am not sure or I don't Understand comments from a recommendation post. Just refer them to find a close wrench and call it a day.

We all take it for granted that others have common sense. Or at least the sense God gave a flea. All to often we see or hear about someone who thought that they could get by , "just doing this or that." And then ending in tragedy. Until someone shows competency or at least talks the talk, we're all taking a risk. Really a bummer when you think about it.

having grown up on a farm around all kinds of potentially dangerous equipment, I sometimes forget that people without the same kind of background may not have the same kind of evolved common sense. that is to say, people make mistakes and learn from them. with old age comes wisdom(to a point) lol. every job has to begin by assessing the risk and safety factors, no matter what you do. most people automatically do this without thinking-its called experience. i'm often guilty of assuming someone has common sense and finding out otherwise. the best advice I can give inexperienced equipment operators and owners is-PERSONAL SAFETY FIRST!!!! whether operating or repairing as well as any helpers and bystanders

I have had the same thought running through my mind for years. I even asked the same sort of question several years ago.

I learned a long time ago that you have to be careful what you say, people take your word as gospel sometimes. Others will ignore everything that you tell them.

I had an apprentice weld a guard onto a hydraulic cylinder once because I jokingly said that we would weld it on. In jest, it was a joke. Nobody in their right mind would weld onto the barrel of a hyd cylinder. He did. I was the mechanic, he was the apprentice, he did what I told him. And he was no dummy, not by a long shot. Pretty smart kid.

I don't say much anymore. Watch the thread and see how it is going. After watching some of the train wrecks that have shown up, its the easiest way.

That said, there are certain people on here that if they asked a question and I had some knowledge, I would not hesitate for a second to throw in my 2 cents worth knowing that when you say to do "X", they have the skill and knowledge to get themselves there in the proper way.

Somebody (not sure if on a forum or not) said to flush his engine with water.

https://mustangforums.com/forum/5-0l-general-discussion/368307-i-m-done-with-this-car.html

heymccall said:

Somebody (not sure if on a forum or not) said to flush his engine with water.

https://mustangforums.com/forum/5-0l-general-discussion/368307-i-m-done-with-this-car.html

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OMG

That can't be real.
I mean......lost for words, it just can't be real.

So funny

I cannot feel sorry for him!! Have two neighbors change oil when consider it due, not to miles hours or just time but opinion. One lost a perfectly good 7.3 dsl as did NOT change for three YEARS, did not put many miles on so took for granted was good to go, the other has changed the engine in his Gleaner F series FOUR times as "only runs it around ten hours so Oil is good for YEARS" until is not, only oil changes are when drops a replacement in. Both end up rotating cars and keeping dealers happy every three years.

And NO, I will NOT work on their machines and only offered recommends to each ONCE got the blow off so not ever again.

thepumpguysc said:

That's a horrible 4 letter word Tinkerer.. 1 that shouldn't be spoken OUTloud..
Its getting worse & worse fellas.. I hate it when the thread starts> I'm a total Newb..
I have a tendency to skip over those threads..
& 99% of the people writing in, don't have a shop manual.. so your stuck writing step by step by step..
when all they have to do is open the friggin BOOK.. {VE pump thread}
BUT WHY spend 75.00 on a manual when theres abunch of bored retired mechanics that'll tell u for free.??

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Yeah ... they have a $20-30,000 machine but won't buy a manual or heaven forbid pay someone!

Even worse are the ones who throw parts at something .. not talking filters.... but pumps, valves, etc... And then they have the audacity to critisize or question you when you tell them what IS wrong

mikebramel said:

Yeah ... they have a $20-30,000 machine but won't buy a manual or heaven forbid pay someone!

Even worse are the ones who throw parts at something .. not talking filters.... but pumps, valves, etc... And then they have the audacity to critisize or question you when you tell them what IS wrong

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I used to contribute to a couple of RV forums, motor home specific. Tried helping people out with some of their problems, the air systems being a big one.

I pretty much had to quit because I got sick of being called out for not knowing anything about their motor home because I didn't own one.

So I poke my nose in now and then just to get a laugh.

Was reading one the other day. Guy lost air. Shut the unit off and the next time he started he could not build air. He could hear it but it would not show on gauge. So off he went swapping parts. Started with a new D2, that didn't fix so he swapped the compressor out. That didn't fix so now he was stumped.
Meanwhile, people are giving him good advice on what to look for but he just ignored it all.

I just wish I had the money to start throwing it away on useless part like that.

56wrench said:

the best advice I can give inexperienced equipment operators and owners is-PERSONAL SAFETY FIRST!!!! whether operating or repairing as well as any helpers and bystanders

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How many times have you seen people walk under something very heavy that is being suspended by a hydraulic machine of some sort?

I have had to tell every single person that has helped me at some time: DON'T EVER GET UNDERNEATH SOMETHING LIFTED. And, when you get close, pay careful attention at all times.

Another good one is people pushing around trees/logs with equipment. I ask: Do you know what may happen when you build tension on that and then it releases STRAIGHT AT YOU?

I glance at most posts if its already been answered appropriatly i move on especially after coming back to the forum after after a to busy at work to bother breack. And seeing a particular post about a engine that went stupid and caused people to leave .If a new poster asks for help with something very very basic i move on as its obvious they shouldnt be touching it . Mack and some Ih trucks and engines are my thing mostly, i would personally never help with hydrualics unless it was one of yall senior mechanics that are already very aware of the hidden dangers of stored energy. I was changing a hydrualic hose on a cat excavator the other day i suspected had some pressure on it had to shoo people away from me , had a rag wrapped around it but when i wiggled it and it popped free it blew said rag and oil into the air . So i tend to watch what i answer to on here if they dont listen ,once again i move on.

Free information is worth what was paid for it. If it helps, fine. If it doesn't help, you have to take that in context with what you spent for it. I think all of us would like to help someone not have to jump into an expensive to fix problem without missing something real easy first. On the other hand look at how many times people looking for something simple haven't bothered to even check things like fuel level in the tank, engine oil and coolant levels, screens and water separators in the fuel systems or even the basics of knowing how the machine is supposed to operate in the first place. How many times does an answer contain "give us the make, model, serial number and how many hours are on the clock?" Having to be told to provide that kind of information for the most part tells me where they are coming from and their level of expertise.
As far as someone getting hurt goes, I try to explain how something is supposed to work and list the possible problems and leave it to the questioner what and how it should be taken care of. There are problems that I know what is wrong but because of what I see in their questions I don't answer or I just flat out say to find a knowledgeable wrench to work with you. There are also those that want to argue and I just drop off the thread at that point.
As far as liability goes, this is a national and international forum. An ambulance chaser would have to find you, find out if their state, federal or international laws apply, establish that you were an expert that recommended something that intended to hurt someone or was out of the realm of normal procedures, and finally, got paid for your advise under a contract. If something stated on a social media platform constituted a criminal offense or a civil liability, then we would have a million years of criminal and civil court cases to work through.

What's the absolute worst is someone who doesn't really know offering advice on how to do something that experienced mechanics either know is very dangerous or won't work. Person asking follows the bad advice without knowing any better or thinks it makes the job easier. Totally disregards what happens if something goes wrong.

Dumbest (for lack of a better word) thing I ever saw was when I worked at a tank shop as an apprentice. They asked a new guy to cut the temporary "D" rings off a 400 barrel tank they use for moving the tanks around the shop before they are completed with proper lifting hooks. He cut the D rings off alright but instead of cutting the D rings off so the welds could be ground flat he saved the complete D rings by cutting 4 holes in the tank! Guys in the shop were like... holy crap how could somebody be that inept.

I have a website with all kinds of motorhome upgrades I’ve done to ours over the years, some of which are rather technically complicated. I have disclaimers all over the place but the bottom line is anybody can be sued for anything. Businesses that post a sign “not responsible for accidents” have basically wasted money on a useless sign. If they are negligent, they will lose in court with or without a sign.

My pet peeve is when I give advice or answer questions in email I usually never get a thanks, people are so rude.

It's the Same way when it's someone posting I am not an operator but I spent a half years wage on so.e equipment that looked cool and the guy selling it said it was the perfect lawn mower to move a mountain with

People get hurt operating equipment because they dont have the depth to understand what's going on

On another note I like a lot of the post on simple things cause it usually re.inds me that most problems can be solved with a minute of thought