• Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!

TS14B’s vs 627’s

RZucker

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
4,077
Location
Wherever I end up
Occupation
Mechanic/welder
I'm a one man band so thats not my arena, but if you are short of man power, why haul trucks? Is this a long distance haul? One man can move dirt with a scraper, but with haul trucks you need several to make it worthwhile on the loading end.
I agree here, a scraper goes down, oh well, a loader goes down... it shuts the whole job down.
 

631G

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
336
Location
Georgia
Occupation
Civil Superintendent
I'm a one man band so thats not my arena, but if you are short of man power, why haul trucks? Is this a long distance haul? One man can move dirt with a scraper, but with haul trucks you need several to make it worthwhile on the loading end.
Agreed 200%. There really isn’t a cheaper way to move earth. What I have found is that the skill level required for operating haul trucks is less than that required of a scraper hand making locating the labor easier and broader. Additionally given the size of our company and the infrequency of our landing projects that are well suited to scrapers we cannot support owning them, at least not at this moment. The companies here locally that do run scrapers we just cannot touch on a cost per cubic yard. They’re setup with gps, modern fleets and most importantly they have the right people. The last being the most important.
 

ETMF 58 White

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2011
Messages
184
Location
SEC West
I’ll chime in here with a question, since I’m investigating trying to put together a couple of double barrel scrapers to finish a job. What started out as a dirt pan job ground to a halt with 50+ inches of rain last 4 months. Now I need to get back at it, but it’s going to be a while before the 200,000 lb tractor pans can stand up in the borrow area. So my old guy says let’s get some 627s, said they used them in Louisiana in swampy ground.(?). But I’m like you, I’ve found some old TS14Bs for cheap, and they’re lighter to boot. But will they do the job in gumbo clay?

Or, do I just need to haul a 350 excavator, three 25 and 30 ton artics, and a spreading dozer up there and try to topload and hope the 6x6 artics can wallow around enough to get out of the borrow area? Small job, really, need to move 50,000 yards of grass growing dirt to cover a large 4:1 slope in the next 45 days, if it quits raining.
 

fiat41b

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
352
Location
pawnee il.
I’ll chime in here with a question, since I’m investigating trying to put together a couple of double barrel scrapers to finish a job. What started out as a dirt pan job ground to a halt with 50+ inches of rain last 4 months. Now I need to get back at it, but it’s going to be a while before the 200,000 lb tractor pans can stand up in the borrow area. So my old guy says let’s get some 627s, said they used them in Louisiana in swampy ground.(?). But I’m like you, I’ve found some old TS14Bs for cheap, and they’re lighter to boot. But will they do the job in gumbo clay?

Or, do I just need to haul a 350 excavator, three 25 and 30 ton artics, and a spreading dozer up there and try to topload and hope the 6x6 artics can wallow around enough to get out of the borrow area? Small job, really, need to move 50,000 yards of grass growing dirt to cover a large 4:1 slope in the next 45 days, if it quits raining.
 

fiat41b

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
352
Location
pawnee il.
Plateau Excavation is going to be hard to beat in the south especially around Atlanta
Get you some 30 yd pull pans and put them behind D8'ks or D9'hs if you have a haul of 1300ft one way or less and they can work all year long in bad conditions the low drives seam to do better than the high drives
and the cost is pennys compared to high drives.
Travelling forward the tracks really don't wear that fast one d8 rail new can be had for around $4000. you can get 6000 hrs plus reverse is harder on all tracks and always wears quicker and the dozers can be used for many other applications with the push blades ect.
A quad track rubber track $10,000 per corner i had one go out at 1800 hrs and when they showed up to replace the rear right was going out also cogs were falling to pieces.
 

old-iron-habit

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
4,233
Location
Moose Lake, MN
Occupation
Retired Cons't. Supt./Hospitals
I’ll chime in here with a question, since I’m investigating trying to put together a couple of double barrel scrapers to finish a job. What started out as a dirt pan job ground to a halt with 50+ inches of rain last 4 months. Now I need to get back at it, but it’s going to be a while before the 200,000 lb tractor pans can stand up in the borrow area. So my old guy says let’s get some 627s, said they used them in Louisiana in swampy ground.(?). But I’m like you, I’ve found some old TS14Bs for cheap, and they’re lighter to boot. But will they do the job in gumbo clay?

Or, do I just need to haul a 350 excavator, three 25 and 30 ton artics, and a spreading dozer up there and try to topload and hope the 6x6 artics can wallow around enough to get out of the borrow area? Small job, really, need to move 50,000 yards of grass growing dirt to cover a large 4:1 slope in the next 45 days, if it quits raining.

Personally I have never seen and wheeled scrapers work effectively in very wet ground. Slippery ground, yes, soft ground, no. Did you put any numbers to renting a quad track or two and whip it out with your double pans? The speed compared to steel tracks would be much faster and may be more efficient even if you hauled lighter loads in the pans to stay on top.
 

fiat41b

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
352
Location
pawnee il.
2500 to 3000 bank cubic yds per day with 28 yard yard scraper and that's 21 yds struck on a 1000- ft run
d9h 230 gallon fuel tank and d8k 170 and about 80 percent of fuel used per day
6yd excavator and 8 terex ta40 gen 5 haul trucks - 40 ton haul trucks hauling 22 bank cubic yds per load plus a d6 or d8 knock down dozer on a 3/4 mile run I can remember load counts of 70 to 77 so average truck moved per day was around 1650 bank cubic yards
10 hrs those terex ta40's needed refueled they held 122 gallons my cat d400 ejectors would last a bit longer as they had bigger fuel tanks
 

ETMF 58 White

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2011
Messages
184
Location
SEC West
Good input, Fiat. That’s what I was looking for; something to study about which way to go. You’re saying it can be done with artics, I believe, but cost per yard will be a good percentage more. But hopefully we will get a flash drought starting next week and the tractor pans can run up there and knock it out in a week. I’ve never seen a real flash drought in April in the mid south, but I can hope for one anyway.
 

fiat41b

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
352
Location
pawnee il.
Good input, Fiat. That’s what I was looking for; something to study about which way to go. You’re saying it can be done with artics, I believe, but cost per yard will be a good percentage more. But hopefully we will get a flash drought starting next week and the tractor pans can run up there and knock it out in a week. I’ve never seen a real flash drought in April in the mid south, but I can hope for one anyway.
Yes that's right depending on job site with short hauls the crawler pans work great and they can take care of most of their own mess
The haul trucks will have to have additional support from the dozer's but the production will always be there with the haul trucks
I use to own a small fleet of good ts18's they did great job all around and were cheap on fuel I sold them off to someone in Ohio as I had no work for them they don't look good sitting around and the new paint faded fairly quickly lol. you tube terex and haul trucks
 

631G

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
336
Location
Georgia
Occupation
Civil Superintendent
Plateau Excavation is going to be hard to beat in the south especially around Atlanta
Get you some 30 yd pull pans and put them behind D8'ks or D9'hs if you have a haul of 1300ft one way or less and they can work all year long in bad conditions the low drives seam to do better than the high drives
and the cost is pennys compared to high drives.
Travelling forward the tracks really don't wear that fast one d8 rail new can be had for around $4000. you can get 6000 hrs plus reverse is harder on all tracks and always wears quicker and the dozers can be used for many other applications with the push blades ect.
A quad track rubber track $10,000 per corner i had one go out at 1800 hrs and when they showed up to replace the rear right was going out also cogs were falling to pieces.

Yes, Plateau is who I was thinking of regarding scrapers and low costs. They want a job, they get it. I’ve always liked the idea of dozer pulled scrapers. Out in the Midwest McAinach (spelling?) ran/runs D10s paired to pans and moves serious cy. Most of the projects we bid fall into the under 1500ft haul range so tractor pans could be an option. Definitely something to consider moving forward.
 

Shimmy1

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2014
Messages
4,258
Location
North Dakota
Even with top-notch operators, Quadtracs pulling scrapers are belt-eating ba$tards. My opinion? A few 28 yard pans behind wheeled 450's, and a Quad equipped with a pusher blade to get them full and through. If the tractors with tires have single floaters, all the better. If you're thinking wiggle wagons might get in and out, those tractors will run cirlcles around them, plus the scrapers can clean up their own mess. Also, I would be renting these rigs. CaseIH tractors will move dirt cheap, but whether it be on tires or tracks, transmissions are all the same, and are a trouble spot as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DB2
Top