tier 4 doosan engines in bobcat

We are on our third unit for repairs now. Fuel system requires injector replacement (all 4) that are brand new injectors (have replaced injectors on all three units now directly from the supplier and not through Bobcat for a $400 savings per injector). Each injector is around $800 Canadian. We also installed a 2 micron fuel filter before the fuel enters the high pressure pump.

Each unit had issues at the 3000 to 4000 hour mark and were extremely hard on fuel filters (sometimes 2-3 between 250 hours). Definitely not the Bobcat brand that we have owned for years. The first unit had issues at 2600 hours but was repaired under warranty from Bobcat but failed again at 3800 hours.

Just a little more info for the current owners with Doosan Tier 4 engines.

I have been reading on this forum about the Doosan tier 4 engines .Seems to me that everything points to fuel filters . Is it possible to install or find a fuel filter that has less microns to allow the fuel to flow better or is this going to screw up with the injectors . This is a concern to me because we rent these machines out . We just purchased a 2015 s450 Bobcat . Now reading all these posts the Doosan sounds like a better motor than a Perkins . Your thoughts

We run a small rental yard in Central Ohio. We had three bobcats S160, S175 & S185. NO Problems at all. One belt, regular oil changes, batteries (4 yrs), a few fuel filters and tires. These machines were tough and ran like tops. Last December I looked to replace them. I was real close to buying a T550 and an S550 open cabs with the Doosan engines. I started reading about these same type issues with the Doosan.
I spoke with another rental store owner and he told me they have had issues with the fuel filters. The cold starts and people not allowing the larger units to regen the DPF. He stated that he was leasing his bobcats for three years, this was the same length as the warranty on the engine. He would not buy them. He found out about a lease program that they really were not pushing locally. $350/month no money down on a S590 cab, heat & air.
I was set to buy a leftover 2015 T590 with a Kubota and lease a S590. I filled out the credit app and was ready to go. My wife suggested that I wait until the new year and business picked back up to start the lease. I will most likely not be leasing one of these units now. I did buy the T590 with the Kubota and so far am very happy with it.

According to my Bobcat Rep, the Doosan engines run a high pressure common rail. He claims that Doosan gets this technology from someone else that knows what they are doing. I also pressed him about the 2.4 liter engine being available in different machines with 49,61,66 & 74 horsepower. He basically said that they are all turbos and Bobcat gets them from Doosan with the horsepower set up. So basically they are computer tuned to the different horsepower. He said they don't feel anyone will come out with a programmer b/c they would have to crack their code. There is a $3000 difference in the S530 to S550 and the same difference in S570 to S590. The S150 to S160 was ten hp gain from turbocharger as well as the S175 to S185. Larger displacement in the S205 engine.
Last time we spoke about mini excavators, my rep told me Bobcat was still running Kubota engines in thoses. FYI

As far as new fuel filters with low microns allowing more fuel to flow, I would not think this is possible. Diesel fuel is a hydrocarbon chain. Not sure of the exact size of the hydrocarbon chains but they are larger than gasoline. Making a finer filter almost stops the flow completely. This problem is worse in cold weather due to the fact the chains cling to each other (gel).

I just heard that Cat's new smaller sized loaders are not running DPF's anymore... I am not sure what that means but many of you think the cold issues are related to not having a DPF. I don't think that's the case as so many are starting to go away from DPF's. No one would make the change to a worse technology unless it had benefits. I know Cat's run Kubota engines now, so it might just be a matter of time until everything is without a DPF.

On a side note, I have heard they have a new line that runs hot fuel to the front of the filter in the new Bobcat's, has anyone else heard if that's helping?

Military Grunt said:

On a side note, I have heard they have a new line that runs hot fuel to the front of the filter in the new Bobcat's, has anyone else heard if that's helping?

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How is the extra fuel (that circulates up to the filter) gonna get hot if they can't keep it running ?

just replaced another fuel filter. I have a 10 micron on my fuel tank. I wish i new away to make sure its clean coming from my tank but everything else runs fine. we had two days of 0 degree weather and I went too 2 bobcat dealers and both were sold out of filters so they overnighted me 2.[so its not just my bobcat] that's 4 filters in 2 months. I got around a month to go before a cat 262d shows up I hope its not the same thing, wonder what micron filter is on a cat? wish I new of a better filter for my fuel tank?

the neighbors have a dooshan and once they installed the elaborate fuel recirculation system on it i hear they didn't have any problems. still the wait time to get going though. we got the last of the classic old school loud vibrating kubotas so no problems there.

Does anyone know if Bobcat has started to use these fuel recirculation systems on the newer machines ? And at time was it done

Bill Smith said:

Does anyone know if Bobcat has started to use these fuel recirculation systems on the newer machines ? And at time was it done

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Not that I'm aware of. Former customer just traded his in for another brand 1 1/2 winters worth of trouble was too much hassle.

the fix

Nice! I demo'd one of those and an S630 (I wanted radial lift) and wanted the buy the 246D (same as the 262 only radial lift) becaise I liked the Cat better by my dealer was a douche and kept dropping the ball so I ended up with the Bobcat machine and haven't had any issue but I live in SC. Only has about 250 hours so far.

Hmm I need to edit that post but can't. Damn phone.

I cant begin to say how much better I like the cat, only used it one day. lol but I went ahead and bought 2 fuel filters, 2 water seperater filters [extra] for 67.00 were bobcat is 53.00 for one junk filter. the cat dealer was here for 3 hours apr. he went through everything with me, even lifted the cab and called me today to see how everything went. good service. I still cant do all the electronic things with it, but ill learn lol

Warbird just to update so far all has been great with the 262d we got last March. We made it through the winter without one problem at all. So far besides regular maintenance and services we have had to replace the heated seat switch, which was an updated part. We also experienced a leak in the air ride seat, it still worked but lost pressure faster than it should have. They replaced all parts involved and has been great since.

thanks for update reedo. like I said before really happy with it. the controls are a lot more responsive than bobcat also. they shouldn't be able to sale a skid steer without ride control

Experiencing similar fuel filter problems here in Massachusetts. But it doesn't seem to be the cold, we can't run our machine with the snowblower even as warm as 30 degrees. Fuel system can't keep up with the demand and constantly needs fuel filters to get through a storm. My problem is I need the all wheel steer during the construction season, otherwise I'd never buy a Bobcat again.

dbb.brisbros said:

Experiencing similar fuel filter problems here in Massachusetts. But it doesn't seem to be the cold, we can't run our machine with the snowblower even as warm as 30 degrees. Fuel system can't keep up with the demand and constantly needs fuel filters to get through a storm. My problem is I need the all wheel steer during the construction season, otherwise I'd never buy a Bobcat again.

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hope its not injector problem bobcat excuse was bad fuel. mine was like that at 30 degrees also just gets worse at colder temp, summer time didn't have no problems with fuel. it cost me a year worth of payments on bobcat with less than 300 hours on it and 11000.00 loss on trade in. right at 600.00 worth of fuel filters. I do have one fuel filter and oil filter [new] I would like to sale 45.00 shipped. like you ill never own a bobcat again. [ Doosan]

Warbird does Cat make a switch for the pattern changer on their machines or is it just left joystick operates machine and right joystick operates loader/bucket.
And as far as fuel useage what are you getting in hours on a tank of fuel?

DirtCrawler said:

Warbird does Cat make a switch for the pattern changer on their machines or is it just left joystick operates machine and right joystick operates loader/bucket.
And as far as fuel useage what are you getting in hours on a tank of fuel?

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I don't think they make a switch for the pattern changer, or mine dosent have it. dealer said they have them with foot controls, I don't know about switch. never checked fuel by hours, I know you can do it with the display but I don't know how yet lol. a tank will last longer than bobcat did and it holds less fuel. I do same work every day.

Cat offers a pattern changer for their controls, it's an additional option. If you don't want they switch, the dealer can set the controls to the pattern you prefer. You do have to hit the switch every time you start it, but it's not a big deal at all since it's right by the park and key. Our 262D and the 262C2 it replaced both had them and you just get used to it, but the initial idea of another switch is off-putting to some people. Nice to have though, I'd always get one with it if you have multiple people that will use it.

They do offer hand/foot controls now, but they are also electric and there is no pattern changer for them.

According to Visionlink our 262Ds average fuel use is 1.1gph and the average for the territory is 1.2gph.