Track Loader to clear trees? Pros/Cons?

Hey All -

I posted this as a reply to an existing thread in the dozer section, but no replies so I thought I'd try here.

I'd like to ask for input regarding using a track loader to clear trees, versus a dozer or excavator. I'm in central Texas and my property, about 25 acres, is completely overrun with Huisache (Wee-Satch) trees. They have zero value and are a major nuisance, full of thorns and nasty to clear by hand. The majority of my trees are in the 2 to 6 inch diameter range, but there are a handful that are 10 inches or more. The tallest is about 20 feet. The average is probably 10 to 15 feet. They have to be ripped out by the roots or they re-grow. If you just cut them, you have to spray the cut stump with Remedy to kill the plant. The soil is black clay with a lot of flint rock anywhere from golf ball to softball size.

I've cleared about 5 acres with a JD farm tractor and a 3-point Turbo Saw, but man is that slow going. I also have a 3 point tree puller and I can pull most anything that is about 5 inches or less, but again, very slow going.

I've been doing a lot of research all over the net & forums. Until I got onto the Heavy Equipment forum, I did not know that some guys were using tracked loaders to clear trees, but it makes sense. I'm weighing having a contractor come do the work versus making an equipment purchase. I'm leaning towards purchase because I'm sure that I can always find other stuff to do with the equipment, like cleaning out an existing pond, making new pond, lift heavy stuff on the farm, etc...

For you guys who have experience clearing property similar to mine, what's your experience and advice specifically as it relates to track loaders? Can you get under the roots of a 10 inch diameter, 20 foot tall tree and uproot it?

Thanks -

Christopher

In addition to the thread you posted to in the dozer forum, there is a good one to read in this forum about using track loaders in clearing land.

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/showthread.php?54550-Advice-on-first-equipment-purchase

And welcome to the forum, there's a wealth of experience and knowledge on the forum pages. I joined with a similar reason as you.

My personal experience would suggest a mini digger/excavator. I've owned dozers, tractors, excavators large and small, wheeled and tracked SS'es. I find the excavator to be my "go to" machine. You mentioned you already have a tractor does it have a FEL? I have used my excavators for digging, stump/tree removal, logging, clearing snow, installing septic systems, well digging, mowing lawn around ponds, and even engine removal and replacement(I'm sure there is more that I can't think of). Don't get me wrong tracked SS'es are good machines and whatever you decide needs to work out to your lifestyle. Just remember sometimes there may be something that could work out even better. You mentioned root/tree removal plus possibly dredging out a pond, that's why I think you'd be better of with an ex. I use a 6000lb machine now, not big by any means (not really even midi size). I've been taking down 25"+ diameter oak and other trees by the roots. I built a ripper attachment and IMO it does a good job in a decent about of time. There are a bunch of questions you'll need to ask yourself : budget, what work is needed, budget on maintenance, hauling, size, and so on.

I'm not sure about those Huisache trees you have down there in Texas but up here in Virginia I've "rooted" about 20 acres so far of a patch of land that had been timbered several years ago and regrew with a ton of poplars, oaks and pines. I bought a CAT 941B and equipped it with a root rake. The gent I bought it from down there in Texas (Cleveland) said he'd only heard of one or two others putting a root rake on a loader (primarily they are used on bulldozers) but once I gave him the measurements he built it and shipped it up here. So far it works pretty good. Takes up 4-6 inch trees/roots with no problem. For the bigger stumps that were left over from the cut I "cut" around the stump to dig up/break the outlying roots then use one of the edge teeth to pop it. Takes a little while and some are harder than others. The poplars are a pain in the a$$, since they seem to regrow from the stump and the roots stretch pretty far. I've come to calling them aliens because once they come out they look like something out of a science fiction movie.

maddog is on target, you have a number of decisions to make. Mine was primarily made considering my budget. I could have hired someone but I'm pretty sure it would have cost me more even considering the nearly $6k I just put into it for undercarriage repair/replacement. Here's a picture of the rig

That's a nice looking machine dmcschultz!

Several reasons we got a track loader. Even though we would've very much liked a dozer for some of the things we did. Had some land cleared by a contractor many years ago. The guy clearing had a D4 or D5 and a 951. He used the 951 for clearing and said he preferred it over the dozer for taking down trees. Figured he would've cleared and piled with the 951 and cut the ditches with the D4, but he never mobilized the dozer. Did it all with the 951. It was very impressive for its size. That's what planted the track loader seed in my mind.

Also more recent before we got our loader, saw a neighbor with a TD-15 or TD-20 try to take down a big hardwood. He spent and hour or more building a ramp and digging a hole to get it down. Granted it may have taken a while with the loader, but most of the time could have been spent on digging around the tree since the loader comes with built in leverage.

Pros
Leverage on trees. This is huge.
Many other uses we've experienced (hauling fill to specific areas, picking up rock, hauling demo'd material, man lift [i didn't say that], knock low limbs off, hoist for various things)
With good teeth you can use it as a rake
Digs very well and quickly
Breakout on bucket makes popping root balls out easier


Cons
Narrower vs dozer makes it not so good on steep hills.
Bucket is narrower vs dozer blade so rocks and limbs like to exit the push
Less traction than a dozer. Track pads are typically narrow with less aggressive grousers vs dozer wider and aggressive. There are exceptions if you can find one that's been modified or DIY.
Rigid frame - ride is rough and the bucket cut is on the angle of the machine.
Little harder to grade. This can be learned, but I haven't quite mastered it yet. Use your tractor and blade to cleanup, you'll be fine.

I'm sure others will think of more.

Track loaders seem to be priced a little cheaper since most contractors don't use the old ones. But you can count on paying 40% premium for the unexpected repairs. Consider it stupid tax as Nitelite calls it. Also, one other thing, go as big as you can afford.

I wouldn't argue that an excavator with thumb is hands down best. It just wasn't in our budget.

For what you're describing, fairly small trees and brush, a dozer would be the better bet. Keep the blade close to the ground and it will pluck most of it right out of the soil. A track loader tends to just push the small stuff over, and you end up pushing up a lot of dirt to try and get it all. A dozer would handle the 10 inch trees you're talking about, if it is just a handful, and if you're careful. But you still have to pile it all up and burn it, which is where the excavator or the track loader shine. A track loader with a 4 in 1 bucket is a great option as well, and gives you the option of a dozer blade or the bucket, and allows you to clamp on to the trees for stacking or to shake the dirt loose.

I've cleaned up a lot of land, and the truth is, there is no one machine that is "best for the job". Dozers are great on the small stuff, track loaders and excavators on the bigger stuff. Excavators are extremely versatile, but again, not great on the small stuff. It all depends on the situation.

I own a 955 and the track loader has always been my favorite. But I'm getting ready to start on a 50 to 60 acre job that is very similar to what you are describing, mostly 2 to 4" stuff, and I'm looking around for a D4 or maybe even a D3 to buy.

You would probably be money ahead to pay someone to do it for you. They can probably make quick work of it. But I agree with everyone else.....that's definitely not as much fun! Good luck.

Thanks everybody for your replies. I dug up a pic of the trees. This is pretty representative of the size and growth density of the majority of the property. There are few areas where the trees are larger, but not by too much. For perspective, the top of the JD 6403 tractor is right at 11 feet. I thought maybe showing the actual property to be cleared by fine tune some of the recommendations.

They seem to be about the same as some of the holly's and poplars I have on my place. How are the roots, relatively straight down or spreading. Here's a picture of one of the poplar roots, the section protruding to the left in the picture is actually a root, the stump is in the center.

Welcome to the Forums christophercale!:drinkup

First of all I'm a track loader guy and if I had only one piece of equipment to make a living with it would be my 953C. Jack of all trades and master of most, if one knows it's full ability.

I'm not familiar with your tree species but if that property and those size trees were in my area I would use the loader to clear it and leave the dozer and excavator at the yard, the excavator would be useful but we're talking about only one piece of iron. The right loader could clear and grub it much faster than a similar sized dozer. A loader can push the trees over, grub the stumps and stack the brush with minimal dirt if you know what you are doing.

The benefit the loader has over a dozer is the teeth and the lift height. A dozer can be fitted with a root rake but a dozer with a rake can't roll brush then back drag it, roll it again in order to sift the dirt out and stack it in a tight pile.

An excavator can do all the above but it will be slower due to it's mobility compared to a loader. Now I'm basing my opinion on a 953C which is faster than older power shift loaders.

dmcschultz said:

They seem to be about the same as some of the holly's and poplars I have on my place. How are the roots, relatively straight down or spreading. Here's a picture of one of the poplar roots, the section protruding to the left in the picture is actually a root, the stump is in the center.View attachment 142328

Click to expand...

DMC -

There's a tap root, but they also spread out quite a bit. Here's a few pics of one that I pulled out with my tree puller. The largest one in these is pics is maybe 5 to 6 inches in diameter.

Christopher

CM1995 said:

Welcome to the Forums christophercale!:drinkup

First of all I'm a track loader guy and if I had only one piece of equipment to make a living with it would be my 953C. Jack of all trades and master of most, if one knows it's full ability.

I'm not familiar with your tree species but if that property and those size trees were in my area I would use the loader to clear it and leave the dozer and excavator at the yard, the excavator would be useful but we're talking about only one piece of iron. The right loader could clear and grub it much faster than a similar sized dozer. A loader can push the trees over, grub the stumps and stack the brush with minimal dirt if you know what you are doing.

The benefit the loader has over a dozer is the teeth and the lift height. A dozer can be fitted with a root rake but a dozer with a rake can't roll brush then back drag it, roll it again in order to sift the dirt out and stack it in a tight pile.

An excavator can do all the above but it will be slower due to it's mobility compared to a loader. Now I'm basing my opinion on a 953C which is faster than older power shift loaders.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the welcome and the great info. I'm blown away by the wealth of info and insight on this forum. I'll be here quite a bit before I make any final decision.

Christopher

christophercale said:

Thanks for the welcome and the great info. I'm blown away by the wealth of info and insight on this forum. I'll be here quite a bit before I make any final decision.

Christopher

Click to expand...

Your welcome, that's what we're here for.

I might have missed it but what is your budget?

I would consider a Caterpillar 977L, see attached link,
http://www.machinerytrader.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=10793461
The machine was owned by J. H. Reid from South Plainfield, NJ, is in very good condition, comes with the clearing rake and a standard bucket.
The price is a little high, the dealer paid $10,000 for it on Iron Planet.

I have a 977L and it is great for clearing trees and brush up to 36" diameter, push them over and cut the stumps off.

CM1995 said:

Your welcome, that's what we're here for.

I might have missed it but what is your budget?

Click to expand...

CM1995 - I need to keep the budget at $35K or less..... I'm sure that will limit my options.

I am a crawler loader fan. I have a JD450C and with the bucket and it is good. I have an attachment Schutt Marvel Digger that replaces the bucket
and is great for digging out trees by the roots. It is similar to a stump bucket for a skid steer but is a little wider, more round and open in back where
dirt can pass through. I am not sure if the company is still in business or not but I have 3 different sizes and purchased them in the '70s. A lot of nurseries
purchased the smaller size diggers to harvest trees and shrubs before the hydraulic tree spades were popular. If the ground is not too dry I can "scoop"
under a tree, rip it out and dump it on the ground and most of the dirt will break off. I'll try to get a picture of it in a few days.

Here is a pic off the internet of the Schutt Marvel Digger
I have one just like this for my skid steer and 2 larger that fit my JD450

Track loaders are the single most underrated piece of heavy equipment out there. If track loaders were designed for anything, its land clearing. The problem is that you need an operator to really see their effectiveness. Their ability to lift 8 ton and apply hp to the ground like a dozer makes them trees worst enemy.

If it were my job to do I would use a 953 w/ a 4n1, or I'd use a d6 and up, preferable a hydraulic tilt, angle blade machine.

RBMcCloskey said:

I would consider a Caterpillar 977L, see attached link,
http://www.machinerytrader.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=10793461
The machine was owned by J. H. Reid from South Plainfield, NJ, is in very good condition, comes with the clearing rake and a standard bucket.
The price is a little high, the dealer paid $10,000 for it on Iron Planet.

I have a 977L and it is great for clearing trees and brush up to 36" diameter, push them over and cut the stumps off.

Click to expand...

Yea, a machine like that seems like it may really fit the bill. I suspect I'll have to shop local however, due to trucking costs. I'm guessing $4K to $5K to ship that distance.

christophercale said:

CM1995 - I need to keep the budget at $35K or less..... I'm sure that will limit my options.

Click to expand...

You can probably find a decent 953B in that price range. The B's are tough old machines with minimal electronics which is a plus. The single lever bucket control is easier to operate than a 2 lever. $35K will give you some room if you find a good machine that might need an undercarriage or other items.

A friend of mine has a mid '90's 953B and it's stronger than my C model.

Here's a few - http://www.machinerytrader.com/list...b&manu=caterpillar&mdlx=exact&bcatid=4&pref=0

If you have a Cat or a John Deere dealer, or an equipment rental company (United Rentals, Sunbelt, etc) in your area, you might take a little bit of that budget and rent a small track loader for a day or so, and try it out. If it's not what you like, swap it out for a small dozer. For $1000 to $1500 you can figure out what you want and get some work done in the process. That's a reasonable investment to be able make up your own mind rather than spending $20,000 to $30,000 based on everyone else's opinion.