Hydraulic oil vs 10-30 vs tractor hyd fluid

So my case 40xt calls for 10-30 motor oil in the hydraulic tank...wondering if it is ok to run regular 46 hydraulic oil in there? I've heard mixed reviews and some say it screws up your system...
Also, what if you mix the two or mixed 46hyd oil with tractor hydraulic fluid? I've heard lots of guys liking that as well???

I have seen many times where you could run engine oil and hydraulic oil in the same system (except for the engine of course). My personal preference is to run what the operators manual recommends.

I would recommend using the 10w30 engine oil as recommended by case. It also calls for HTO additive. Engine oil has a higher sheer rating than hydraulic oil. You will not see a immediate failure if you mix the oils, but it will cause premature wear.

GaryHoff said:

I would recommend using the 10w30 engine oil as recommended by case. It also calls for HTO additive. Engine oil has a higher sheer rating than hydraulic oil. You will not see a immediate failure if you mix the oils, but it will cause premature wear.

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What do you mean by sheer rating and wear? Is that regarding seals and o-rings?
Thanks for your inputs guys, I really appreciate it!!

In a round about way, 'shear rating' is the ability of the oil to do its intended job and not break down from the abuse it gets between mating surfaces, causing the Viscosity to change, so your '30W would become more 10W' over time.. I believe..

I would stand to be corrected by one of our forum Case experts but a number of years ago when the word of the day was "standardization" a lot of manufacturers approved the use of engine oil in hydraulic systems, the largest of those being Caterpillar. The theory was you only had to keep one oil on site for two systems. Today although the approval for use of engine oil in hydraulics is still exists (for Cat hydraulic systems at least) less and less people seem to be using it for that purpose and are instead using purpose-blended hydraulic oils

To me you could run anything from ISO AW32 (equivalent to SAE10W) thru 46 as far up as 68 (equivalent of SAE30) and still meet the oil specification required by the OEM. The caveat is if one of our Case experts says that engine oil must be used and explains the reason why that is so.

So it sounds like aw46 would be the equivalent of 10-30 or is it not quite? I just talked to a local guy today who said don't do it because according to oil guys the 10-30 actually helps lubricate things better and withstands heat better...?

Personally that sounds like a load of bull unless as I mentioned before there is a specific reason why the one or more of the system components specifically require a high-viscosity oil........and none of our Case experts has chimed in yet on the subject.

10W-30 is a multigrade, therefore it will be approximately the equivalent of AW32 when it's cold and approximately the equivalent of AW68 when it's hot and somewhere around AW46 at temperatures in between.

To be honest though you don't need the SAE30/ISO68 capability unless you are in a really hot climate, as in ambient temperatures pretty much 80F+ all the time. Most hydraulic systems run either AW32/10W in cold climates or SAE30/ISO68 in hot ones. For example my last job was in the Caribbean and in certain hydraulic systems we used a mongrade SAE30 oil because of the temperature, however in everything else we used an SAE10W.

That is kind of what I am thinking. A buddy of mine has been running 46 in his case skid steer for about 7 years he said and hasn't had any problems with the motor or anything.
New question...my radiator coolant is not staying full but I can't find the leak anywhere, any ideas? I'm thinking the little rubber return hose going from the reservoir back to the radiator might be kinked to much so I was thinking of cutting it down a little so it doesn't make so much of an L shape...

Head gasket?

lantraxco said:

Head gasket?

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I don't think so because the machine runs just fine but I've been noticing it gets hot during the day and sometimes spits antifreeze but haven't been able to find out where. Keep in mind it has been 90+ degrees out for well over a month so that might contribute to it getting hot.

My problem with using engine oil for hydraulics, is hydraulic oil
IIRC is made to allow the dirt to settle out in the sump (where there
should be a drain).

Engine oil is loaded with detergents, that keep the dirt in suspension.
(And removed by the filter only)

Just a thought. In a hydraulic system that's in good condition there shouldn't be any dirt in it anyway but even if there is and it was filled with engine oil the dirt particles would be suspended only until they got to the filter ........

I use rotella 15w40 in my bobcat t200 CTL It has a Deutz 1011F oil cooled engine. What type / Viscosity can I use to allow it to run cooler. Is their an additive I can add as a coolant for the engine that is OIL COOLED.

Bubba said:

I use rotella 15w40 in my bobcat t200 CTL It has a Deutz 1011F oil cooled engine. What type / Viscosity can I use to allow it to run cooler. Is their an additive I can add as a coolant for the engine that is OIL COOLED.

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My experiences with air-cooled Deutz engines was a while ago but one question. Do you have any external oil leaks whatsoever on the engine..?

Nige said:

My experiences with air-cooled Deutz engines was a while ago but one question. Do you have any external oil leaks whatsoever on the engine..?

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The only Deutz engines I have worked on were the air cooled type but it looks like this one still uses the same kind of fan system to blow air through a cooler. Dumb question, but are you sure everything is clean in the air side of the cooler, belt in good condition and so on? Our little engine was over heating when put in service to stand in for a stationary compressor that failed on a Bag House of a BC Plant. At first they thought it was just working too hard. When I was asked to look at it I removed the shrouds from the side of engine to find a large mouse nest about the size of a basket ball. Once that was cleaned out the engine never over heated even on very hot days while sitting close to the Black Top Dryer.

Nige said:

Just a thought. In a hydraulic system that's in good condition there shouldn't be any dirt in it anyway but even if there is and it was filled with engine oil the dirt particles would be suspended only until they got to the filter ........

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In theory yes...but in my world, the machines are old, and abused.
if they ran plain hydraulic oil (per the book), and there's dirt settled in the tank (like from the filler port)
Changing to detergent oil is gonna bring that all up (and aren't most filters on the return side ?)

digger doug said:

In theory yes...but in my world, the machines are old, and abused.
if they ran plain hydraulic oil (per the book), and there's dirt settled in the tank (like from the filler port)
Changing to detergent oil is gonna bring that all up (and aren't most filters on the return side ?)

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Most machines have a return filter, many also have a charge filter which is after the gear pump but before the piston pumps. Gear pumps are pretty tough, piston pumps are sensitive, getting the dirt out before them is most important.

Some hydraulic fluids are designed to allow contaminants to settle in the reservoir. In something like an SSL though it's not as practical because the reservoir is small and the oil doesn't spend much time there. Some hydraulic fluids have detergent additives. The downside to them is that they tend to emulsify water.

Foaming is one potential issue with engine oil, can cause cavitation and such. Switching to a detergent oil after years of non can really clean things up and cause some issues too. That said though, our NH machines always called for 10w30 in everything and that what they got. Have one with over 10,000hrs and never touched the hydro system. Others were ran to over 5k without issues as well.

The Cats want 10w Hydo so that's what I put in them especially since they're under warranty. We really don't go through that much and it's not that expensive. Cheaper than the smurf juice NH wanted for the newer machine we had. (they did state you could flush it for 10w30 though).

Then there's THF/UTF tractor fluid. It's a hydraulic fluid but designed to be compatible with wet brakes, ptos, etc. It usually works in place of an anti wear oil, but is more expensive. Regular AW shouldn't be used in place of UTF on something that needs UTF though. AW oils are designed for straight hydraulic system use. UTF is designed for both hydraulic and transmission/brake/clutch/etc.

Nige said:

Personally that sounds like a load of bull unless as I mentioned before there is a specific reason why the one or more of the system components specifically require a high-viscosity oil........and none of our Case experts has chimed in yet on the subject.

10W-30 is a multigrade, therefore it will be approximately the equivalent of AW32 when it's cold and approximately the equivalent of AW68 when it's hot and somewhere around AW46 at temperatures in between.

To be honest though you don't need the SAE30/ISO68 capability unless you are in a really hot climate, as in ambient temperatures pretty much 80F+ all the time. Most hydraulic systems run either AW32/10W in cold climates or SAE30/ISO68 in hot ones. For example my last job was in the Caribbean and in certain hydraulic systems we used a mongrade SAE30 oil because of the temperature, however in everything else we used an SAE10W.

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Know this is a very old post … but with running 46 should you still add the case additive ?

You can't get that anymore from Case, you can use STP if you want. There is a newer post on here about this and others talked about using diesel engine oil.