Trenching pond dike to drain pond

2grit · Aug 16, 2015

It has been suggested to me to cut a trench in the dike of a pond I am cleaning in order to drain all the water. I like the idea of doing this versus pumping the pond down. I'm just concerned that the cut won't heal and keep the water back once it refills.First of all, the facts: The pond is about a half acre in area. It's about 70 years old and never been cleaned. It is loaded with cattails and muck. The soil is hard clay. There is plenty of fall to facilitate this trench and drain the pond completely. The pond is always full except in the driest of years due to springs. Even when at it's driest it doesn't go down much. I would appreciate any input.

Scrub Puller · Aug 16, 2015

Yair . . .

2grit.

Over the years there have been posts on this board where folds do exactly that and it seems to work okay for them.

If you do cut a slot I would suggest setting aside some good clay that can be used for backfill and you would need a "jumping jack" or similar compactor to reinstate the plug.

Under our conditions I would only do it as a last resort. If ponds have to be drained it is very simple to rig up a syphon with (say) two inch black poly pipe or a few lengths of four inch glue together what is called here SWV.

Cheers.

CatToy · Aug 16, 2015

My ponds overflow drain collapsed and I ended up draining it by cutting along the drain path. So, I will get to see if that was a mistake, I have an excavator and track loader I am using to "rebuild" my pond.

Had two well thought of pond re-builders come look at my pond, one wanted $22K and the other did not want the job (too small). They had different ways to drain, one used siphons and pumps to keep the dam intact unless it was a problem. They also did not want to get in the pond but use long reach excavators to clean it out. The others want to cut the pond dam the width of their dozer and track loader, drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over to the excavator or use the loader to carry the silt out the cut depending on where I wanted the muck. These guys said they used to pump the pond down and just drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over the dam but thought the way they do it now put less hours and was easier on equipment.

2grit · Aug 16, 2015

CatToy said:
My ponds overflow drain collapsed and I ended up draining it by cutting along the drain path. So, I will get to see if that was a mistake, I have an excavator and track loader I am using to "rebuild" my pond.

Had two well thought of pond re-builders come look at my pond, one wanted $22K and the other did not want the job (too small). They had different ways to drain, one used siphons and pumps to keep the dam intact unless it was a problem. They also did not want to get in the pond but use long reach excavators to clean it out. The others want to cut the pond dam the width of their dozer and track loader, drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over to the excavator or use the loader to carry the silt out the cut depending on where I wanted the muck. These guys said they used to pump the pond down and just drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over the dam but thought the way they do it now put less hours and was easier on equipment.

All advice appreciated very much. Any more?

2grit · Aug 16, 2015

CatToy said:
My ponds overflow drain collapsed and I ended up draining it by cutting along the drain path. So, I will get to see if that was a mistake, I have an excavator and track loader I am using to "rebuild" my pond.

Had two well thought of pond re-builders come look at my pond, one wanted $22K and the other did not want the job (too small). They had different ways to drain, one used siphons and pumps to keep the dam intact unless it was a problem. They also did not want to get in the pond but use long reach excavators to clean it out. The others want to cut the pond dam the width of their dozer and track loader, drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over to the excavator or use the loader to carry the silt out the cut depending on where I wanted the muck. These guys said they used to pump the pond down and just drive the dozer in the pond and push the silt over the dam but thought the way they do it now put less hours and was easier on equipment.

Appreciate the advice very much

JNB · Aug 16, 2015

I wouldn't touch a non-leaking dam wall unless there was no other way to do the job. You're asking for problems down the line. Siphon it out and do the work.

CatToy · Aug 16, 2015

JNB said:
I wouldn't touch a non-leaking dam wall unless there was no other way to do the job.

Normally I agree, but I in my case the steepness of my banks would not let me easily get in the pond (well, getting in would be easy, the getting out hard) and it is land locked with no access for large equipment on three sides (I only have 10 feet from the pond to the property line). So, in my case it was cut the dam or try to get a long reach excavator (high dollar rental) and the fact that my overflow washed out helped make it an easier decision. I asked the pond guys about leaks, they said in past 20 years they never had a call back on a cut dam. Who knows what what will work, and you know how advice is. You only want it if it agrees with what you wanted to do anyway.

Please do not take anything I am doing as advice on how to do it. Proverbs 12:15 comes to mind, the way of a fool is right in his own eyes...

td25c · Aug 16, 2015

Yeah 2grit , that method will work .

It's probably the most expensive but best in the long run . We would use an excavator & dozer for something like that . Cut the center of the dam open & push the slop out and spread it about 6 inches to a foot thick . Takes some area to do this . In about 3 or 4 days in the hot sun the material will get back in shape where you can work with it & spread it on the dam .

We just keep" knifing" in to the old dam kind of like stair steps when building it back . It's a long process dealing with the mud & muck but end up with a good job in the end . I tell customers cost wise I can build a dam on a new site for about the same money cleaning an old pond out .

Other option . Roll in old school drag line & dip it out without draining the water . Toss mud out thin as possible & come back later with dozer to use the material to shape up the dam after it dries out .

CatToy · Aug 17, 2015

td25c said:
I tell customers cost wise I can build a dam on a new site for about the same money cleaning an old pond out.

That is what my pond guys said also, I thought already having a hole in the ground counted for something but they said for a pond my size it takes about the same amount of time to dig a new as to clean an old one.

SE-Ia Cowman · Aug 17, 2015

If you cut the dam and push the slop out then work your trench banks back to a 3:1 slope you should be able to walk good material back in with no leaks. That being said it takes a lot of room to pile the good dirt from your dam were it won't get contaminated with mud and you won't believe how big of area that slop will take up. You should be able to get some extra usable clay from under the muck to replace the clay you will waste when the dam is cut. If the pond is very large a long reach won't get all the way around and to the bottom, I have also seen some poor operators damage the dam by over digging.

CatToy · Aug 17, 2015

When I cut my dam, I loaded fill in a dump truck and hauled it to another location since I do not have room to set it aside at my dam. I also plan to haul the silt to another part of my property and spread it out. Should be fun.

td25c · Aug 17, 2015

CatToy said:
That is what my pond guys said also, I thought already having a hole in the ground counted for something but they said for a pond my size it takes about the same amount of time to dig a new as to clean an old one.

That's been my experience over the years on a total pond rebuild / clean out . A lot of time dealing / drying out the mud so you can spread it on the dam and end up with a finished product the customer can spread grass seed on when completed .

All depends on the pond & location and if they are willing to spend the money on it .

Have one customer that is not to concerned about what the pond looks like and he will deal with the mud & slop after it dries out with a farm tractor & loader .

He also waters his cattle out of the pond so draining it is out of the question . Dragline time !:yup

Trenching pond dike to drain pond

2grit

Member

Scrub Puller

Senior Member

CatToy

Well-Known Member

2grit

Member

2grit

Member

JNB

Senior Member

CatToy

Well-Known Member

td25c

Senior Member

Attachments

CatToy

Well-Known Member

SE-Ia Cowman

Well-Known Member

CatToy

Well-Known Member

td25c

Senior Member