Driving over fiber optic conduits

I'm looking at a thinning timber job in 3 weeks and trying to plan out the access road.

The access road goes over a high presser gas line and 3 fiber optic conduits according to 811. There right away are a few feet from each other. Had 2 surveyors come out to mark the right away and had 811 came out to mark mark everything. The gas line is right where it should be, but they could only find one of the conduits and it was 2 feet out side there right away. 811 is trying to get the owners of the conduits out to find there lines, but they are dragging there feet for weeks.

I had my lawyer send the company a certified letter. Part one of the letter was about how they wanted us to cross there lines. The second part of the letter was about how they wanted us to build the support for the bridge over the gas line with out knowing where all there lines are and knowing that not all there lines are inside of there right away.

There only response is that there 4 conduits are with in there 12' right away and can stand up to normal traffic. I know my lawyer is still trying to contact them for more information, but they do not what to work with us.

Has anyone else ran into similar issues or have any suggestions on how to work with them?

Sounds like your doing your part. I'd comply with what the gas co wants, and go to work. Keep all your paperwork, one call ticket numbers and especially your lawyers corespondance, should things not go well. I'm not a judge but you have shown reasonable effort to protect their lines, more than they have.

That is what I kinda want to do stumpjumper, but at the same time my research tells me that it cost thousands for every minute a fiber bundle is down. I talked to my lawyer about taking this approach, but he still thinks there is a better way. Tomorrow I’m drawing up a set of plans showing the bridge over the gas line, the right away's, and the location of the conduit we found to give them a chance to respond.

I truly don't want to take out a fiber bundle and have there repair trucks on my access road causing more safety issues. I also don't want to spend a few days in court if something dose happen.

There only response is that there 4 conduits are with in there 12' right away and can stand up to normal traffic.

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I'd be worried that when something breaks, they're going to claim that a truck loaded with logs is not "normal traffic", and try to hang the repairs on you.

And, welcome to Heavy Equipment Forums.

Agree with Digger (dang it!) 1) everything today is legal. After all, if McDonalds can successfully be sued because coffee is actually served hot [duh], then there's no limit to litigation, and 2) Welcome to HEF. :drinkup

Have your lawyer send them a friendly letter stating you will be billing them for however many thousand dollars per day of lost production and income due to their refusal to properly locate and identify the conduits. Tell them your insurance won't allow you to proceed until you have a certified and notarized letter from their lawyer indemnifying you from all liability for any damages to their lines. Send it to the CEO, President, Chairman of the board and cc a copy to any state or federal agency you think might take an interest. If you can't get to work, you might just as well sit back and watch a circus anyway.

:cussing

Lonelylogger said:

That is what I kinda want to do stumpjumper, but at the same time my research tells me that it cost thousands for every minute a fiber bundle is down. I talked to my lawyer about taking this approach, but he still thinks there is a better way. Tomorrow I’m drawing up a set of plans showing the bridge over the gas line, the right away's, and the location of the conduit we found to give them a chance to respond.

I truly don't want to take out a fiber bundle and have there repair trucks on my access road causing more safety issues. I also don't want to spend a few days in court if something dose happen.

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as far as I know if a fibre optic cable is damaged, the whole line between junction boxes has to be replaced unlike a local repair used to be done.Progress is what it is called,,,,,,,,,,,,,:beatsme

The locate call is only good for 14 days here, if you don't do any work in that time period you are supposed to have it relocated. There is only one fiber optic going through past my house and through town. The fiber company tells me it is just over 100K a minute for down time, plus repairs. I have a few sleepless nights before I have to dig around that one. Good luck it sounds like you are trying to do the best you can to prevent a problem.

I can see a log truck not being “normal traffic”. The access road has been used for years with farm stuff, but I know we are going to be much heaver.

That's a good idea lantraxco. I just called my lawyer and read him your post and he could not stop laughing. Were going to do a conference call with my insurance company in a few hours to see if they will also send them a nice letter.

Robin yates. My understanding could be way off fiber optics, so what I’m about to post could be way off. They can repair broken cables if they can find some cable that the fiber filaments were made to the same specifications and test the same. Even if they have to replace from junction box to junction box the fiber filaments have to be very similar.

Dirty4fun our locates are good for 14 days also. In the early stages of planning for jobs I get a surveyor to locate all the right aways and get everything located so we can plan ahead for it. We get everything relocated a week before we start the work. We are able to do a 30 or 60 day locate for a extra fee and is worth it for longer jobs.
I was told it was $75k to $100k+ a minute for a 24 strand run.

Yes I've had problems in the past. If your state has the requirement of the locate is good for only 14 days, do another locate and if no action is taken in the two or three days, whatever the law states in your state, contact the attorney general in your state, with a phone call to register a complaint, ask him or her what to do, make your complaint known and start your job, let the attorney general handle the problem, its not your problem, but the companies are not in compliance with the law, somewhat out of your jurisdiction and worry.

Before I'd ever hire an attorney to do the letter writing to the companies, have him write the letter to the attorney general in your state and register your complaint for you, then demand your insurance company to take a stand on the issue, grow a pair of balls and tell you to proceed or your going to find another insurance company who can do their job of helping their client [you], and you'd like it in the next few hours, its cost you enough in delays already.

If you chat with the states attorney general in your state, I'm pretty sure that's who you need to register your complaint with, tell him what your planning on doing and its supposed to be the company's responsibility to have their utilities protected by anything your going to drive over it, not the other way around, that's the reason for the locate and stating your intentions of what your going to do in the first place. Forward your letter you received to the attorney general and let him or her hash it over.

Yesterday was the first time I had called my insurance company about the issue.
My insurance company sent them a release of liability letter this morning. My understanding is that they have 10 days to respond and make reasonable accommodations and or arrangements or they will take full responsibility for any damage that is caused. They did send them a drawing showing how we plan to bridge over there easement and the one located conduit.

Yesterday after noon my lawyer sent all the information to the states public utility commission. They contacted me this morning and have set up a meeting for the beginning of the week.

I will call my lawyer and have him forward everything to the attorney general also.

I know that with high presser gas lines it is the responsibility of the contractor to bridge over there main lines unless there is an engineered road that will support the load. Any time I have ever had any issues or questions about there lines they have had someone on location with in 24 hours. I have not had to deal with any other utilities.

I know my lawyer also sent them a letter yesterday, but I’m not sure what it said.

the problem with damaging a fibre is in order to repair it ,there needs to be a fair amount of slack cable in order to get both ends into the machine usually mounted in a van /truck
hence the reason it is from joint to joint usually

Have you hand dug to look for missing conduits?

No we have not hand dug for the conduits. I'm not sure how many there are any more, because 811 says there are 3 and the conduits owner says there are 4. I feel that if we hand dig to find them it would change the liability with the company refusing to locate.

A representative from Public Utilities Commission was on the site today for there investigation. He did tell me that repetitively driving over the conduits when the ground is deeply saturated could lead to issues depending on the soil structure.

He told me that the lines should be located by Wednesday of next week at the latest.

I don't know about liability but if you can say ok Ijiots heres 3 or 4 conduit are they yours or not? You only have 2 foot of cover are you going to lower to where they are supposed to be or pay me to place fill over them? It's almost time to be a jerk.