Hi I just tried out a loader we bought last week and after loading 2 trucks the hydraulics died, my son was leveling out some gravel not working it hard and it was like some one shut the hydraulics off.We lost everything bucket movement ,no drive and no steering.He said it did not make any nioses it just stopped, the main shaft spins fine.Any good ideas and thank you for any help.
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hough cm 60 hydraulic problem
- Thread starter adigger
- Start date
mikebramel
Senior Member
Did you check the coupling from the pump to engine
The shaft going to the tranny turns fine but I have no idea what is in the tranny for a coupler, that is someting I was hoping to get some idea here about.It ran fine and we don't want to scrap it over something little but would like to get an idea what we might be getting into.
willie59
Administrator
Sorry you're not getting much help thus far adigger, could be because few folks around that know the innards of a machine of that vintage. I must admit, I know nothing about them as well. But seeing you "purchased" the machine, then it's either fix it, or it's a glorious piece of scrap iron. Maybe we can come up with some ideas of what to check.
You stated that all functions stopped working, drive, steer, and loader functions, yet the shaft going from engine to tranny still turns. The first thing that comes to my mind, again, I don't know these machines, where is the torque convertor? Is is mounted to rear of engine/flywheel housing? If so, where is the main hydraulic pump? Rarely will you find a hyd work equipment pump being driven by the torque convertor as the slipping of the convertor messes with hyd operations. On the contrary, if the main hyd pump happens to be driven by opposite end of engine, front of crankshaft, perhaps that pump also supplies pressure for steering and tranny, or there may be a charge pump for tranny on that end as well. I think I would try to locate my pumps and start looking there. Good luck.
You stated that all functions stopped working, drive, steer, and loader functions, yet the shaft going from engine to tranny still turns. The first thing that comes to my mind, again, I don't know these machines, where is the torque convertor? Is is mounted to rear of engine/flywheel housing? If so, where is the main hydraulic pump? Rarely will you find a hyd work equipment pump being driven by the torque convertor as the slipping of the convertor messes with hyd operations. On the contrary, if the main hyd pump happens to be driven by opposite end of engine, front of crankshaft, perhaps that pump also supplies pressure for steering and tranny, or there may be a charge pump for tranny on that end as well. I think I would try to locate my pumps and start looking there. Good luck.
kshansen
Senior Member
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Thought I had replied to this one last night. You now say it's a H90? Not sure what the cm means.
Unless this is something other than the H90's, H100's and H120's I worked on over the years the hydraulic pumps are mounted to the back of the converter. They are driven by gears inside that are in turn powered by the part of the converter that is coupled to the flywheel so any time engine turns pumps turn, no slippage( willie). One note needed here, when I say front of engine or rear of converter I'm thinking of the fan end of engine as the front and the output end of the converter as the rear. I know that is not how they are in a loader but have a hard time thinking about the fan being on the back of an engine.
You say main shaft spins. Are you referring to the drive shaft that goes between the converter and the transmission? Does this shaft stop if machine is shifted into gear? Will machine try to move? One thing I just thought of how much dirt is in the cab? Do the brake peddles work free? make sure the left peddle is all the way up. If it is only a fraction down it will put air to the neutralizer valve on the transmission and not allow machine to move. Seen it many times.
This would not explain the hyd./steering problems. I'd take the cap off the hyd. tank and see if there is any movement in the oil when engine is running. This will give you an idea if the pumps are even turning. Right now I'm having a problem seeing why even if the hyd. quit the steering would also stop. Are there two pump on the back of this converter on either side of the drive shaft? With inlets coming off the bottom of the tank?
Unless this is something other than the H90's, H100's and H120's I worked on over the years the hydraulic pumps are mounted to the back of the converter. They are driven by gears inside that are in turn powered by the part of the converter that is coupled to the flywheel so any time engine turns pumps turn, no slippage( willie). One note needed here, when I say front of engine or rear of converter I'm thinking of the fan end of engine as the front and the output end of the converter as the rear. I know that is not how they are in a loader but have a hard time thinking about the fan being on the back of an engine.
You say main shaft spins. Are you referring to the drive shaft that goes between the converter and the transmission? Does this shaft stop if machine is shifted into gear? Will machine try to move? One thing I just thought of how much dirt is in the cab? Do the brake peddles work free? make sure the left peddle is all the way up. If it is only a fraction down it will put air to the neutralizer valve on the transmission and not allow machine to move. Seen it many times.
This would not explain the hyd./steering problems. I'd take the cap off the hyd. tank and see if there is any movement in the oil when engine is running. This will give you an idea if the pumps are even turning. Right now I'm having a problem seeing why even if the hyd. quit the steering would also stop. Are there two pump on the back of this converter on either side of the drive shaft? With inlets coming off the bottom of the tank?
found problem
We pulled the drive shaft to see it the yoke was stripped and no such luck,got it on a trailer and back to shhop and took off torque converter cover and found flange that is suppose to have 6 bolts in 4 were broke and 2 came out.We found the ones that came out and broken half of 2 of 4 so we still have a little searching to do before we can go back together.Thank you to all that reply and good luck to you.
We pulled the drive shaft to see it the yoke was stripped and no such luck,got it on a trailer and back to shhop and took off torque converter cover and found flange that is suppose to have 6 bolts in 4 were broke and 2 came out.We found the ones that came out and broken half of 2 of 4 so we still have a little searching to do before we can go back together.Thank you to all that reply and good luck to you.
Wallabydam
New Member
I have this machine. H90cm which was a hough loader for the military. Has a Cummins engine. 10k lift cap. The problem you experience is the hydraulic pump gears that have stripped spline on one or both gears. Or stripped pump teeth. The pump is located on the trans. It's pretty big. It's not uncommon to see them gears strip or break. If your lucky u will be able to find those gears on ebay. I've seen them before. But are hard to find. I know its been a long time since this post. Please let us know what you found problem wise.
oldseabee
Senior Member
Typical machines of that age had a gear bolted to the flywheel that meshed with a gear on the convertor, way back both gears were steel and were noisy as they got some wear so the fiber gear came into use on the flywheel. The other coupling was a drive plate on the flywheel that bolted to the convertor, not sure what the Hough used, but failure of each type would cause loss of trans and hydraulics. If you only lost hydraulics but still had trans drive, then pump drive failure would be most likely.