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Deere graders
- Thread starter firetrack
- Start date
Abscraperguy
Senior Member
Not arguing just wondering if you have the numbers to back this up?
farm_boy
Senior Member
Not according to Yengst and associates 2010 report. Here is their quote:
"Caterpillar has long been the motor grader market leader, however in 2010, Deere was the top seller in North America. The company sold an estimated 1,200 units, up 50 percent from the previous year. Deere’s market share has been consistently on the rise since 2007, when it moved into the number two position over Volvo. Deere outsold Caterpillar for the first time in 2010, by a margin of about 75 units."
Do you have the actual sales figures. I know that Deere is considerably in front of Cat in Australia - I believe in excess of double the sales of Cat.
Cat only has the lead in the mining areas as Deere doesn't have anything to compete with the 24 and the 16 has(had) a very good reputationplus some mine sites in Aust are Cat only sites.
Deere has the municipality market. I think this has come about since Cat released the M series and Deere have the GP machines. I am not a Deere or Cat promotor as I have a Cat D5N dozer, Hitachi Zaxis 35U -3 mini excavator, JCB 3CX backhoe and have a new Deere 328D skid steer being delivered next week(hopefully) and a Deere 5320 utility tractor and front end loader plus a couple of Deere ride on lawnmowers. I have had a good run with all except a spare part issue with Cat over an axel for the D5N(see my thread in the Dozer section).
I think it is good that market leaders get 'knocked off their perch' on a regular basis as it should mean we get better machines in the long run.
Firetrack
Cat only has the lead in the mining areas as Deere doesn't have anything to compete with the 24 and the 16 has(had) a very good reputationplus some mine sites in Aust are Cat only sites.
Deere has the municipality market. I think this has come about since Cat released the M series and Deere have the GP machines. I am not a Deere or Cat promotor as I have a Cat D5N dozer, Hitachi Zaxis 35U -3 mini excavator, JCB 3CX backhoe and have a new Deere 328D skid steer being delivered next week(hopefully) and a Deere 5320 utility tractor and front end loader plus a couple of Deere ride on lawnmowers. I have had a good run with all except a spare part issue with Cat over an axel for the D5N(see my thread in the Dozer section).
I think it is good that market leaders get 'knocked off their perch' on a regular basis as it should mean we get better machines in the long run.
Firetrack
That's what I'm talking about right there!!!!
Competition has brought CAT out of the dark ages. Not been too many years ago that if you wanted to check on oil pressure or engine heat on a CAT grader you had to look out the back window, that's where the gauges were!!!!!
The age old argument about who builds the "best" grader will never be resolved. But I'm with Firetrack,, the ferocious competition in the market right now is great for us consumers!!!
Alberta
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately for us, Deere will never be an option : They can't come close to the kind of deal we have with CAT, they don't have a machine size for our needs (we run all 14M), and in our area, their service is not that good (not that Finning has been too impressive lately). I know our operators wouldn't mind trying them out for a while and it would be nice to see how they stand up compared to the CATs.
Nige
Senior Member
I would never knock any other manufacturer's equipment but to me what has always made the difference between Cat & "The Rest" is the level of Product Support they give. Jokingly some would say Cat need good support because the machines are so sh1te ....!!
Admittedly at times it's still given us grey hairs but at the end of the day no-one backs their equipment across such a huge product line like Cat does, at least in my experience anyway. Obviously support varies by dealer. Some are excellent, some average, and some lower than average, but if you know how to work "the system" the support is always forthcoming from somewhere.
Admittedly at times it's still given us grey hairs but at the end of the day no-one backs their equipment across such a huge product line like Cat does, at least in my experience anyway. Obviously support varies by dealer. Some are excellent, some average, and some lower than average, but if you know how to work "the system" the support is always forthcoming from somewhere.
OldandWorn
Senior Member
Passing construction sites lately I've noticed an increasing number of Deere equipment, about 2:1 to CAT.
The funny thing is, the support that Cat's dealer here is giving is one of the things that's driving customers to other brands.
Nige
Senior Member
Earl B Finning would be turning in his grave if he could see the company he founded losing its sense of direction so badly ..........
mitch504
Senior Member
I have Cat, Case, New Holland, Komatsu,and some minor brands of equipment; and I have Mack and IH trucks. I buy everything used.
I no longer buy IH trucks or New Holland equip. because, unless they are new,they are basicly unsupported by the dealers in this area.
I am a great fan of Case backhoes, but we didn't even have a Case dealer in this state for a year or so after Briggs pulled out. Our dealer now is a new startup company, and time will tell.
I bought both of my Komatsus this year, neither from a dealer, and the support seems very good, but I'll know for sure later on, I guess.
Caterpillar and Mack both support their machines very well in my experience, no matter the age. I do not run machinery under warranty, so I can't speak to that side of things. Both the dealers and the manufacturers seem to want to help anyway they can, for a price, of course.
My point is, the support you get seems to depend heavily on the individual dealership. My IH dealer has said things were unavailable that another dealer 300 miles away had no trouble with.
I no longer buy IH trucks or New Holland equip. because, unless they are new,they are basicly unsupported by the dealers in this area.
I am a great fan of Case backhoes, but we didn't even have a Case dealer in this state for a year or so after Briggs pulled out. Our dealer now is a new startup company, and time will tell.
I bought both of my Komatsus this year, neither from a dealer, and the support seems very good, but I'll know for sure later on, I guess.
Caterpillar and Mack both support their machines very well in my experience, no matter the age. I do not run machinery under warranty, so I can't speak to that side of things. Both the dealers and the manufacturers seem to want to help anyway they can, for a price, of course.
My point is, the support you get seems to depend heavily on the individual dealership. My IH dealer has said things were unavailable that another dealer 300 miles away had no trouble with.
That he would Nige, that he would!
Abscraperguy
Senior Member
Where do you see customers mostly going from Finning? Here in Grand Prairie it seems most guys start running Deere, a few go to Hammer Case (but an incomplete lineup and motley collection of brands doesn't help), and Komatsu. I think Komatsu could really give Finning a run for their money if they weren't so lackadaisical with their whole operation.
Nige
Senior Member
Although you didn't quote my comment that you gets lots of difference between dealers. I'll go as far as to say that you'll get a lot of difference between different branches of the same dealer. Companies can set up whatever kind of systems they want but at the end of the day it's all down to the people at the sharp end in the Product support Department who generate the repeat machinery sales, despite what the salesmen would have you believe.
mitch504
Senior Member
my point exactly, Nige
I didn't quote the part about different dealers as I am only referring to the dealer that covers our area. I can't speak for the service given by anyone else.
But none the less, in this case, it's not a branch by branch issue. It's a dealerwide issue since they switched over to a new computer system many months ago, and parts supply has been virtually non existent. In fact, we've had to start dealing with other dealers, one of which is half ways across the country just to keep getting parts.
The local dealer is generally great, but since the implementation of Lawson, things have been so screwed up, that it's not even funny. I'm sure that if they ever get things worked out, the service will go back to normal levels. But a 6 to 8 week wait for a filter that should be in stock is a bit much, especially since we can get it from the next dealer, one province over, the next day.
But none the less, in this case, it's not a branch by branch issue. It's a dealerwide issue since they switched over to a new computer system many months ago, and parts supply has been virtually non existent. In fact, we've had to start dealing with other dealers, one of which is half ways across the country just to keep getting parts.
The local dealer is generally great, but since the implementation of Lawson, things have been so screwed up, that it's not even funny. I'm sure that if they ever get things worked out, the service will go back to normal levels. But a 6 to 8 week wait for a filter that should be in stock is a bit much, especially since we can get it from the next dealer, one province over, the next day.
Alberta
Well-Known Member
Another issue we seem to run into a lot is that what should be common stock parts are not available and have to come from Hong Kong or Morton....should not take a week to get a cylinder seal kit...not acceptable.
Most of what we see here is Finning customers going mostly to Brandt for the smaller stuff, or SMS for the bigger stuff. There also seems to be quite a few defecting to Wajax. Not sure if it's the same up there. but Hammer is no longer here, we have Hiway Service now. I don't know how they stay in business, since it seems that nobody has any of the brands that they sell.