Small Equipment hauling question.

First a little background on me. I'm a young guy, I've got a small dozer and I'm keeping busy doing small brush clearing jobs around here. I'm trying to make a name for myself. I've got a D21 and I move it with a 3/4 ton dodge pickup on a tandem dual gooseneck trailer. I would like some insight into what I need to do to become legal, because I thought I was legal.

I was stopped by the highway patrol the other afternoon while moving my machine to a job. I believe he stopped me because he suspected I was hotshotting. I had a set of axles on my trailer for my 4x4 pickup along with the dozer. The officer was very polite and professional, and I am not here to complain about him doing his job. Now my first mistake was no CDL. The GVWR of truck and trailer was 29k, and the limit is 26k. I was ignorant of the fact that GVWR was combined with truck and trailer. I have no problem with this ticket, as ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law.

I was under the impression that as long as I am not hauling for hire that I am not required to be tagged commercial. He informed me that this was not the case. Because I was transporting equipment that I was using for work that I was commercially hauling, regardless of if I was getting paid to haul or not. To me this is like saying you drive your commuter car to get to work to make money, it should be commercial. Now I looked around on the OK DOT website and saw that they have adopted FMCSA guidelines for their motor vehicle statutes. On the FMCSA website I found an exceptions list, and I found this:

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/r-l-wizard/exceptions.pdf

Private Carriage
FMCSA has no economic regulatory jurisdiction over the transportation of property by motor vehicle when--(1) the property is transported by a person engaged in a business other than transportation; and (2) the transportation is within the scope of, and furthers a primary business (other than transportation), of the person.

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I'm thinking this covers what I had first assumed. Am I correct?

I plan to find a trailer with a lower GWVR or contact the manufacturer and seeing if they will assign my trailer a lower GWVR and a tag to reflect this to get me to a legal weight. I am trying to avoid tagging and insuring my truck commercially. My truck isn't primarily used to haul my machine, and I'm trying to keep my expenses low as this is my first business venture. If my business picks up I'd like to upgrade to a medium duty truck or a single axle tractor, but that's another topic.

Another thing I was incorrectly ( I think ) cited on was Improper restraint/securement. I did not have 5 chains on the machine (law states one each corner, one chain over any hydraulic moving component). But the statute listed states that requirement if for machines 10k lbs and heavier. My machine is around 9k lbs, and according to that statute, I fall under regulations for vehicles 10k and under. Here's the link to the FMCSA statutes

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regu...mcsrruletext.aspx?reg=393.130&keyword=393.130

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?reg=393.128

Also, a statute the trooper listed on all of my commercial violations doesn't seem to exist on the FSCMA or the OK DOT websites. He listed all of the other statutes in full with the letter, but he listed the commercial violations (no trailer tag, obscured (blacked out) clearance lamps, no extinguisher, no triangles, no med card, windshield crack) with 393.2. Am I missing something while looking for that statute?

I'm thinking if I get my weight down to 26,000 or under I would be able to continue transporting my own equipment without registering as a private commercial carrier. Am I correct or is there something I'm missing?

Sorry for the lengthy post, I just want to make sure I'm legal or I'm able to to what it takes to become legal.

OKDOT and OHP have been nailing goose necks left and right.
If you are charging then you are in business and technically need commercially tags and a DOT number if you are over 26,000 pounds. You maybe able to register your rig for under 26000 pounds but you will still need commercial tags to be legal.

We had a 5th wheel with a 12 m tag on it. I can't remember the reason, probably cheaper , I think all the trailers have 12m, except the lowboys

Chains, Chains , and MORE chains... nothing says stop me more than a load with out chains, or enough... a chain on at least the 4 corners, some will let you slide with using the one chain 2 boomers. but that guy is getting scarce, plus your chain has to be a rated chain now.
Tires is another get me... cheaper tires with a lower capacity. the trailer or truck , say you have a 12,000 lb axle single tire, if the number on the side wall of the tire says 4,000. your axle is rated for the tires on it also, so 8000 lb. you would get a ticket for being over loaded if the weight was over the tires rating. but you can't put 8,000 pound tire on it to raise it to 16,000 it would be the axle then 12,000

Dirt on the machine, tracks and trailer, wave the flag,

I've found that a nice clean looking tractor trailer, pick up or dump truck keep the eyes of the DOT away, you drive a dirty ole raggedy looking truck then DOT is looking at the I could care less about anything,

Just want to add, FMCSA regs are the minimums. I have hualed flatbed loads od of shapes and sizes, plenty of equipment. I could never have enough chains or boomers. I also drove HD wrecker and that job was very profitable for me from folks who liked short cuts, Ok getting of soapbox.
One thing that you may be able to do if you own ag property in OK is to register your truck as a farm vech not exactly legal but it helps getting around some laws. I will tell you if you go this route you are not legal and someone could turn you in.

CinOK said:

Just want to add, FMCSA regs are the minimums. I have hualed flatbed loads od of shapes and sizes, plenty of equipment. I could never have enough chains or boomers. I also drove HD wrecker and that job was very profitable for me from folks who liked short cuts, Ok getting of soapbox.
One thing that you may be able to do if you own ag property in OK is to register your truck as a farm vech not exactly legal but it helps getting around some laws. I will tell you if you go this route you are not legal and someone could turn you in.

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Haven't done it myself, but have seen plenty of farmers trying to get by with tagging farm vehicle here (mostly because I'm paying closer attention to it now than I used to) It has gotten to the point that (in my own oppinion) if you have farm tags you are already suspect. I've seen farm trucks pulled over for light loads, and the local contractor who I thought was obviously overloaded go right on by with out even so much as a second glance from the DOT. (I'm referring to an instance where a contractor with an ex on a twin axle trailer drove right past DOT sitting alongside the road on seperat occasion)
I'm no expert, but as difficult as it is to be compliant, it would seem to me that compliance is going to be the easiest way/cheapest way in the long run.
If tagging for farm.........I'd still make sure your weights were within your limits and not try to "catch" DOT on technicalities.

sorry to tell u , but just because you get your gcvw under 26,000 doesnt mean you dont need a cdl, you need a trailer with a gvw of 9999 behind your 3/4 ton truck not to be bothered....... if i was u and you can make this dozer thing work id get my CDL anyway just to have it

Around here if you want to be under CDL you only purchase a 25900 lb plate but then you cant haul over that . For example if had a dual tandem gooseneck with a data plate weight of 24000 lb from the manufacture and a 2500 dodge with a doorpost weight of 9200 lb which is what mine is you wouldnt have to purchase a plate for 33200 lb for the truck you would just buy a 25900 lb plate and not be required to have CDL. I have class A so it dosent matter but ive been stopped a bunch by DOT and always quiz em about the issue. Unless youre state is different i would just load up everything you normally haul take it to a quarry and weigh it and if its under 26000 lb just buy that weight plate from DMV and maybe add 1000 lb for mud and tools if you can without going over 26000 lb.

You must not have many hills or mountains. I pulled a 305 over our local mountain with my 3/4 ton Cummins Dodge and immediatley was wishing I had used my KW. Ended up crawling up it in 4x4 Low range about 7-10 miles an hour. Over heated my motor on the way up and over heated my automatic tran on the way down with the jake brake.

insert dodge jokes here!!!!

heavylift said:

We had a 5th wheel with a 12 m tag on it. I can't remember the reason, probably cheaper , I think all the trailers have 12m, except the lowboys

Chains, Chains , and MORE chains... nothing says stop me more than a load with out chains, or enough... a chain on at least the 4 corners, some will let you slide with using the one chain 2 boomers. but that guy is getting scarce, plus your chain has to be a rated chain now.
Tires is another get me... cheaper tires with a lower capacity. the trailer or truck , say you have a 12,000 lb axle single tire, if the number on the side wall of the tire says 4,000. your axle is rated for the tires on it also, so 8000 lb. you would get a ticket for being over loaded if the weight was over the tires rating. but you can't put 8,000 pound tire on it to raise it to 16,000 it would be the axle then 12,000

Dirt on the machine, tracks and trailer, wave the flag,

I've found that a nice clean looking tractor trailer, pick up or dump truck keep the eyes of the DOT away, you drive a dirty ole raggedy looking truck then DOT is looking at the I could care less about anything,

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Thanks for the info. My truck, trailer and machine are all clean. I didnt have any problems with the actual equipment, just the weight.

CinOK said:

OKDOT and OHP have been nailing goose necks left and right.
If you are charging then you are in business and technically need commercially tags and a DOT number if you are over 26,000 pounds. You maybe able to register your rig for under 26000 pounds but you will still need commercial tags to be legal.

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According to the following link the only reason I need to register commercial is for over 26k.

http://www.occeweb.com/tr/IntraStPrvtLcnse.htm

The first link I provided on the first post states

Private Carriage
FMCSA has no economic regulatory jurisdiction over the transportation of property by motor vehicle when--(1) the property is transported by a person engaged in a business other than transportation; and (2) the transportation is within the scope of, and furthers a primary business (other than transportation), of the person.

I'm fairly certain I fall into this category if I get the weight down to 26k. I'm not on the clock when I'm moving the machine. I dont factor delivery into my costs. I'm moving my property to a location to make money, not making money while moving my property. If this is the case the DOT needs to be stopping all of the half tons pulling lawn trailers and giving them a commercial inspection.

jimmyjack said:

sorry to tell u , but just because you get your gcvw under 26,000 doesnt mean you dont need a cdl, you need a trailer with a gvw of 9999 behind your 3/4 ton truck not to be bothered....... if i was u and you can make this dozer thing work id get my CDL anyway just to have it

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I dont see anything about this in Oklahoma law. If anyone could find it I'd like to see it. It would make it a lot easier for me to make my decision on getting a CDL. I dont mind having a CDL, I'm just trying to avoid the extra costs for commercial registration.

DiamondLTruckin said:

You must not have many hills or mountains. I pulled a 305 over our local mountain with my 3/4 ton Cummins Dodge and immediatley was wishing I had used my KW. Ended up crawling up it in 4x4 Low range about 7-10 miles an hour. Over heated my motor on the way up and over heated my automatic tran on the way down with the jake brake.

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We dont have any mountains out here. Hills arent too bad. It pulls the longer hills on the interstate just fine with the cruise set. The truck does have some work done and runs pretty good, but I do have to keep an eye on the EGTs on some of the longer hills.

Thanks for the input everyone. Any one else have any experience with this?

I dont see anything about this in Oklahoma law. If anyone could find it I'd like to see it. It would make it a lot easier for me to make my decision on getting a CDL. I dont mind having a CDL, I'm just trying to avoid the extra costs for commercial registration.

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http://www.dps.state.ok.us/dls/pub/NCDL.pdf


From Oklahoma Drivers License home page link, "Do I need a commercial drivers license?"

http://www.dps.state.ok.us/dls/


Also the over 10,000 lb trailer GVWR rule is a federal law that all states had to adopt way back when the CDL licenses were changed.

Kgmz said:

Also the over 10,000 lb trailer GVWR rule is a federal law that all states had to adopt way back when the CDL licenses were changed.

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Only if the combo is over 26k. If it's under 26k the states still have different rules.

Kgmz said:

http://www.dps.state.ok.us/dls/pub/NCDL.pdf


From Oklahoma Drivers License home page link, "Do I need a commercial drivers license?"

http://www.dps.state.ok.us/dls/


Also the over 10,000 lb trailer GVWR rule is a federal law that all states had to adopt way back when the CDL licenses were changed.

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So according to that link I would not need a CDL as long as my weight was below 26k. Thanks for the link. I may still go see about getting my CDL. I wouldnt mind having it. Thanks for taking the time to find that link.