Will a Small Dozer Do This???

I don't own a dozer but I think I need one I have a million questions after looking for one for 3 months. I will start with the main question.
I have a fair sized piece of hilly woodland which has a good network of logging roads put in by the previous owner. I log with a smallish tractor and farmi winch. Some spots are wet and have to be logged in winter after freeze up so I need a way to to push snow to keep my skid trails open. I would also like to maintain the roads and be able to fill inherited skidder ruts and such.
Been looking at JD 450C, Cat D3C, Dresser TD7G size machines. Is this a good choice ? Or are these to small ?
Thanks in advance. This forum looks great - glad I found it

gg

If its just you kida hobby logging a 450c is fine and probably the best choice of the 3 you mentioned ,if you're talking older little dozers a 450c is an icon and i consider myself a cat dozer fan if that tells ya anything

Pretty much a hobby logger. Spend what I make on taxes and equipment. Just like to work in the woods.

Go for a D3. Terriffic little machine.

Guess im a hobby excavator cause everything i make goes to taxes and equipment haha one reason i say the 450c is its much easier to find one with a winch and maybe log arch than older cat

It sounds like you guys are saying that I will be able to do what I want with this size machine. True?
Early on I found at a 450C with a winch and arch but was unsure of my self. It was said to be in decent shape they wanted $15K. 200 miles away. I called last week to go look but it was sold.
I know of a TD7G with the under carriage pretty much shot. Good shape otherwise - he wants $12.5K. Seems way high ??
Also a Cat D3C - 11K hr machine. 1500 hrs on new motor, 500 hrs on steering clutches, 50% U/C. Well maintained. $18K ?
Beater JD 450C with decent U/C except the rails are all smashed. At a dealers $14K

Yes g-man,I will guarantee you that from your description,the 450C or D would be more than up to your work requirements.I've had nothing but small Deere dozers in my entire 37 year excavating biz,so yes I'm EXTREMELY partial,but with very good reason.In thousands of hours and seat time,I have never had any major component go South on me--NEVER!!! You take care of mother Deere and she will take care of you.Good luck in your search.

g_man said:

I don't own a dozer but I think I need one I have a million questions after looking for one for 3 months. I will start with the main question.
I have a fair sized piece of hilly woodland which has a good network of logging roads put in by the previous owner. I log with a smallish tractor and farmi winch. Some spots are wet and have to be logged in winter after freeze up so I need a way to to push snow to keep my skid trails open. I would also like to maintain the roads and be able to fill inherited skidder ruts and such.
Been looking at JD 450C, Cat D3C, Dresser TD7G size machines. Is this a good choice ? Or are these to small ?
Thanks in advance. This forum looks great - glad I found it

gg

Click to expand...

You may be surprised...as I was...that pushing snow has a bad habit of collecting on the pad bottoms and jamming between the sprocket tips. Unless you have relief holes cut in the pads, or have lower "skirts" to keep the snow out...be prepared for this binding to occur.

The colder the temps, the less it happens...it matters.

Here is the thread concerning the problem:

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.co...-fellas...help-me-out-with-this...&highlight=

Hey Tennu - thanks - I notice that was back last Feb. How did you make out?
I will be looking for mud relief pads for sure.

g_man said:

Hey Tennu - thanks - I notice that was back last Feb. How did you make out?
I will be looking for mud relief pads for sure.

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The 450G is a tough little bugger! I ran loose and went when it was cold...still popped, but several JD mechanics told me the drive train/finals would be fine...bulletproof was the word they used. Made me feel better.

As another option...I do not want to cut relief holes...I was thinking about bolt on skirts for wintertime to keep the snow at bay. Still kickin' the idea around.

I love the Deere, but as an aside, the 2005 D4G didn't have that problem whatsoever...that snow never bothered it a bit.

g_man said:

I don't own a dozer but I think I need one I have a million questions after looking for one for 3 months. I will start with the main question.
I have a fair sized piece of hilly woodland which has a good network of logging roads put in by the previous owner. I log with a smallish tractor and farmi winch. Some spots are wet and have to be logged in winter after freeze up so I need a way to to push snow to keep my skid trails open. I would also like to maintain the roads and be able to fill inherited skidder ruts and such.
Been looking at JD 450C, Cat D3C, Dresser TD7G size machines. Is this a good choice ? Or are these to small ?
Thanks in advance. This forum looks great - glad I found it

gg

Click to expand...

Years ago I got out of logging briefly but was still hauling logs. A friend called with one of those deals you just can't pass up. A 450 John Deere with winch and arch it basically got me back into logging. I had never owned anything that small but was really surprised at how much work you could do with a little machine. Ran the 450 for several years till I ended up running a 550 Deere one Saturday for a friend, the 450 was immediately on the trailer and traded in on a 550B. The 450 is a shuttle shift trans, were you start off with the clutch then you are able to shift from forward to reverse with the reverser lever. This works fine if you are not wanting to maneuver in a tight spot, like between trees in a thinning. The 550 is a power shift transmission allowing you to not only change direction with one lever but also speed, with the 450 to change speeds you have to stop to shift the range change lever. The 550 also has a little higher operator position and a better parking brake system, my 450 on occasion would release it's brake and go sightseeing without me, just a little scary. The 450 and 550 are basically the same machine engine, tracks, blade, winch, final drives etc. The 550 only weighs slightly more but is a much more user friendly machine. Oh I do hate the old style JD winch its temperamental, the newer winches on the G models is a great improvement, but the old style winch will get the job done. I recently tried out an older Cat D4C that I was very impressed with. I have run the older D3B and was not impressed, and knew a fellow with a TD8 that really liked it. Pending the economy here my next one will likely be a Cat or a G model Deere, hope this helps. Good luck.

A few corrections,additions need addressing.On a D model Deere,you usually will get an oval shaped ''relief'' hole in the grouser pad.I have worked my 450D in the snow quite often and have never had a snow jamming scenario.Regarding the 4 speed shuttle trannies,I feel they are highly more resilient and much easier and quicker to use vs.a powershift.For one thing,there is no having to stop or even come close to stopping,just use the reverser to shuttle forward and reverse.You will not damage anything,this is in it's design,to change direction on the fly,it's a fantastic engineering marvel.The other benefit is there's no torque converter to suck up more fuel.As for a weak parking brake,that had to be a case of a much needed adjustment as none of my 350 or 450's ever rolled away.

tuney443 said:

A few corrections,additions need addressing.On a D model Deere,you usually will get an oval shaped ''relief'' hole in the grouser pad.I have worked my 450D in the snow quite often and have never had a snow jamming scenario.Regarding the 4 speed shuttle trannies,I feel they are highly more resilient and much easier and quicker to use vs.a powershift.For one thing,there is no having to stop or even come close to stopping,just use the reverser to shuttle forward and reverse.You will not damage anything,this is in it's design,to change direction on the fly,it's a fantastic engineering marvel.The other benefit is there's no torque converter to suck up more fuel.As for a weak parking brake,that had to be a case of a much needed adjustment as none of my 350 or 450's ever rolled away.

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The D model is newer and uses the same parking brake style as the 550's it's not that the brake was weak but vibrations caused the lever to release. Ran an E model 450 a whole lot different than the B and C model 450's no problems as I encountered with the older dozer trans or parking brake wise. Torque converter in my usage is the only way to go and we never experienced an increase in fuel consumption, thinning is not like pushing dirt a little more care and finese. Just my experiences with the old 450.

Yes! For the work you decribe a small dozer will be more than adequate. I've ran a 1987 deere 455E for years and it has been a great machine. You may also want to consider a track loader with a 4n1 bucket like my 455E. You would be able grab logs with with the 4N1 bucket and move them around easily. They usually cost a little less to purchase too.

Thanks for the help and sugestions. Getting a first tracked machine is interesting if not intimidating. Your info is helpful.
You guys are a little quieter on your pricing opinions than the logging forum I enjoy. They all scream and holler that the asking prices are way high. I guess I will have to take my best shot. I am pretty isolated where I am so there is not a lot around except for Nash Equip.

You can get a idea on prices by following Auction results or going to Machinery Trader. If you can make enough money from the logging I would suggest going for dozers in the $20-30K range since they will be more likely to have good life left in them. In the $10-20K range is what is known as farm dozers. Many will be very serviceable but will not put up with the grind of working everyday without having major repair done. I did spot a interesting one on Machinery Trader closer to your neck of woods (Pa) yesterday. It is a Waldon dozer (never heard of the brand before) that had only 960 hours and was under $12,000. It looked to be in the 450 size.

We had a 450 E it was junk. We broke stuff that deere had never seen broke. It was a money pit from the day after Deere droped it off with 0 hrs. The first day it wouldnt start and it went down hill from there. I think it cost us $5,000 a year just to keep it working , plus normal track wear cost. We replaced it with a Dresser TD7H and have been pleased with it and it cost less to own and pushes faster and more than all the 450 deeres we ever owned. By the way the 450c motor was only good for about 4500 hrs. Good luck with your dozer hunting.

DIG IT said:

We had a 450 E it was junk. We broke stuff that deere had never seen broke. It was a money pit from the day after Deere droped it off with 0 hrs. The first day it wouldnt start and it went down hill from there. I think it cost us $5,000 a year just to keep it working , plus normal track wear cost. We replaced it with a Dresser TD7H and have been pleased with it and it cost less to own and pushes faster and more than all the 450 deeres we ever owned. By the way the 450c motor was only good for about 4500 hrs. Good luck with your dozer hunting.

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To each their own on brand loyalty,but you are WAY wrong with that 4500 hr. figure. I've logged much further than that with my old C,friends/fellow excavators by me the same.Basically,that engine is and always has been in one form or another one of the very best Deere ever offered--besides other Deere apps.,you will find that mill in countless other stationary apps.,such as compressors,water pumps, and generators.I would put that 4 banger up against any other comparable sized oil burner for dependability,power,and longevity anytime.

Have a 450C here and hate it also. A real bit-- to work on, hydraulics are a mess with constant leaks. Have a D3 that will push rings around it. Have replaced the clutch in it, had both final drives off for leaks between the stearing clutch housings and final drive housings.

I can say that the engine has only needed oil changes and fuel filters. Oh ya, alternator did go but that is to be expected in time. This one has a loader on it so it gets used around the yard here and does not go out on jobs except for the rare occasion when a small track loader is the trick.

By far this is the worst machine to work on I have ever seen. Learned lots of new adult words and even invented a few turning wrenches on this thing.